Author Topic: A world devoid of evil would disprove God.  (Read 1036 times)

Offline SGOS

Re: A world devoid of evil would disprove God.
« Reply #15 on: July 09, 2020, 10:14:14 PM »
Doubt is considered a carnal sin in faith, when really only with doubt you're able to correct mistakes in the first place.
When I was very young, I expressed a doubt I had about God to my grandmother.  She said, "You must never doubt God, not even for an instant.  If you doubt, you will go to Hell."

I didn't know how to deal with that.  I could not see any fault in doubt, and it felt totally normal.  And I could see no way of wiping away doubt about God, or anything else that I could never know for sure.  I resigned myself to knowing I was going to go to Hell.  I accepted it as my fate, most likely everyone else's fate too, that is if they were being honest about it.

Later, I continued adjusting my resignation that I was doomed.  I started making up my own more reasonable god.  I decided that a loving god would never send a good person to Hell for doubting, as long as he played by all the other rules.  Later I threw that adjustment out too, eventually coming to the realization that religion was all just a bunch of made up nonsense.  None of those adjustments required that I give up trying to be a good person.  No god is necessary to make that happen.

Offline Baruch

Re: A world devoid of evil would disprove God.
« Reply #16 on: July 09, 2020, 10:53:36 PM »
Ah, but did your grandparents have to swat your behind? ;-)
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ ła’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Re: A world devoid of evil would disprove God.
« Reply #17 on: July 11, 2020, 12:27:50 PM »
Yeah, pretty bad argument.

Perhaps the biggest problem with the argument for the existence of God based on the supposed existence of objective moral values is that the assertion that it follows that if objective morals exist, then God exists, is unproved.

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...isn't morality, according to Christians, supposed to be the personal feelings or opinions of what Yahweh considers moral?

Some Christians may say that Yahweh chooses what he likes morally speaking, but apologists like William Lane Craig assert that God's very essence is "goodness" and that Yahweh's morality comes from that flawless essence and is then not arbitrary. The problem with Craig's argument is that he still falls back on some idea of "goodness" to describe Yahweh's essence. Where did Craig get that standard of goodness by which he describes's God's essence? If he got it from God, then Craig is just telling us that God is like God, a tautology. If Craig's standard of goodness does not come from God, then we can know goodness without God, and the argument from objective morality fails.

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There are forms of objective morality that do not require gods. Within these moral systems, the objective standards are the physical laws of the universe.

Here I must disagree. I don't see how morality can be objective with or without gods. If we choose "the objective standards (of morality as) the physical laws of the universe," we are still making a choice regarding our morals. I can easily disregard any physical laws when I make moral choices, and you cannot prove that my morals are any more subjective than your morals.

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...it is objectively true, that lopping my head off is against my well being. In other words, with well being as the goal, it is objectively immoral to decapitate another person.

What if I disagree with you here. Can you prove I'm wrong?

Offline Baruch

Re: A world devoid of evil would disprove God.
« Reply #18 on: July 11, 2020, 01:27:17 PM »
It is morally righteous to decapitate a Republican or Tory ... what are you people thinking?  Pacifism? They are literally baby Hitler (Sarc)
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ ła’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.