Submissive relationships

[Shiranu]

Then you must not be talking about the same concept of nuclear family because i have not seen any major communal child rearing communities. Its still The parents with their kids.

Baruch already addressed what I meant; this idea of one mom... one dad... being the ideal way to raise a kid is simply a huge u-turn from the way things have historically (and frankly more efficiently) have been done as well as it simply does not work out for so many of us.

My mom was a cokehead and my dad was absent for my first 3 years before I was adopted. By the time I was 13 I was watching my adopted dad die of cancer. And all the while it was held over my head that I don't have a proper family... I will never have a "normal" life. And I grew up believing that I had been cheated out of a proper upbringing.

This is not some isolated happening... there are countless people in the United States who are raised by single mothers and fathers... who are raised in abusive households that fit the nuclear model... and simply put it just does not work. There is no "best" cookie-cutter family model... there is only trying your best to surround your kin with as many good influences as you can. The American ideal of a nuclear family to me is very limiting and taken from an era that valued it's pseudo-intellectualism's "triumph" over tradition far too highly.

[mauricio]

Baruch already addressed what I meant; this idea of one mom... one dad... being the ideal way to raise a kid is simply a huge u-turn from the way things have historically (and frankly more efficiently) have been done as well as it simply does not work out for so many of us.

My mom was a cokehead and my dad was absent for my first 3 years before I was adopted. By the time I was 13 I was watching my adopted dad die of cancer. And all the while it was held over my head that I don't have a proper family... I will never have a "normal" life. And I grew up believing that I had been cheated out of a proper upbringing.

This is not some isolated happening... there are countless people in the United States who are raised by single mothers and fathers... who are raised in abusive households that fit the nuclear model... and simply put it just does not work. There is no "best" cookie-cutter family model... there is only trying your best to surround your kin with as many good influences as you can. The American ideal of a nuclear family to me is very limiting and taken from an era that valued it's pseudo-intellectualism's "triumph" over tradition far too highly.

I understand your points though my contention was with your claim that the nuclear family had already went away. Which i do not think is true. Though i do not think the nuclear family is perfect i think its "destruction" is pointless due to how our empathy seems to give value to to the lives and well being of people in a spectrum of strangeness-familiarity. The life of your brother subjectively is worth SO much more than that of a creature that is not even part of the animal kingdom. The closest of kin hold irrationaly strong bonds. What we could do is supply it with a system that patches nature's holes. Or go all transhumanist and create a better moral drive than empathy. Also the tribe style communal child rearing seems impossible in the modern metropolis where people need to interact with strangers over large swaths of lands. The community would end up broken or isolated if they try to survive in a modern metropolis. Though i guess the community could just go with minimalist life styles and self sufficiency. I think that is usually how they do it.

[Baruch]

There may still be functional families in the barrio you come from.  Good for you.  I actually had a fairly functional nuclear family upbringing with my adoptive parents, but wouldn't have had that with my natural parents.  There are no successful communal upbringing systems, outside of Third World native situations, and we are working hard to destroy those.  The nuclear family was a transient situation from 1950 - 1970 in the US and other First World countries.  It is no longer possible for most husbands to support even one non-working wife, let along a wife and kids.  See:

http://www.amazon.com/Stiffed-The-Betrayal-American-Man/dp/0380720450

This is still ongoing, having assisted in destroyed the Blue Collar, the White Collar are busy heading for the scrap heap too.  A world of executive jerks and robots and domestics.  The women will be arm candy for the Boss, or a domestic.

[mauricio]

There may still be functional families in the barrio you come from.  Good for you.  I actually had a fairly functional nuclear family upbringing with my adoptive parents, but wouldn't have had that with my natural parents.  There are no successful communal upbringing systems, outside of Third World native situations, and we are working hard to destroy those.  The nuclear family was a transient situation from 1950 - 1970 in the US and other First World countries.  It is no longer possible for most husbands to support even one non-working wife, let along a wife and kids.  See:

http://www.amazon.com/Stiffed-The-Betrayal-American-Man/dp/0380720450

This is still ongoing, having assisted in destroyed the Blue Collar, the White Collar are busy heading for the scrap heap too.  A world of executive jerks and robots and domestics.  The women will be arm candy for the Boss, or a domestic.

Gotta get ready to survive the brave new world:

[mauricio]

I realize now i was using the concept of the nuclear family wrong. I was talking about the fact that society seems to still be working as an agglomeration of smaller core groups of individuals who share kinship which is a much more stronger bond than some sort of bigger community sense without shared blood.

[Baruch]

I realize now i was using the concept of the nuclear family wrong. I was talking about the fact that society seems to still be working as an agglomeration of smaller core groups of individuals who share kinship which is a much more stronger bond than some sort of bigger community sense without shared blood.

Your national or ethnic culture may be quite different than mine.  So things can be confusing ;-)  Usually when people start acting as a mass proletariat or mass peasantry .... watch out, usually bad things happen.  People acting according to familial association, friend association, coworker association are the norm.  These overlap.  This is one reason why politics fails in the US since the advent of TV ... people no longer associate in political units after work, like they did before TV ... this wasn't an accident, it wasn't an accident that an active Left was actually dying in the 1960s, not being reborn.  It gave it's last gasp during the 70s with Kent State.  Urban America isn't anything like it was two generations ago.  Socialism was actually viable then.  Individualism and consumerism serves The Man.

This is the ultimate submission, the political-economic ... female submission fantasies, are about a re-enactment of the dominant social paradigm, with the husband/father acting out The Man ... and the wife/children as the proletariat who secretly wants to be exploited (fantasy).