Author Topic: Is Pedophilia a Choice?  (Read 4319 times)

Offline Hijiri Byakuren (OP)

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Is Pedophilia a Choice?
« on: April 14, 2016, 10:45:23 PM »
This is one of those questions that tends to rear its ugly head around here every so often, so I figure a dedicated discussion is in order. I'll kick this off by trying to lay out some basic issues that merit discussion.

  • If pedophilia is a choice, why do people choose to do it?
  • Should pedophilia be considered a mental illness?
  • Is pedophilia a sexual orientation? If not, why should it be distinguished from sexual orientation?
  • What sort of carrot/stick approach would be best to prevent pedophiles from crossing into criminal territory? (Especially since current punishments don't seem to discourage a fair number of them.)

If I think of anymore relevant questions, I'll update this post.

Offline PickelledEggs

Re: Is Pedophilia a Choice?
« Reply #1 on: April 14, 2016, 11:13:42 PM »
I'm not sure anyone here is a psychologist/knows of any research...

but imo (in order of your points):
-I don't think is a choice
-yes, I would consider it a mental illness, because it is harmful to society.
-I would say it's a sexual orientation, but we also, if you think of this as a sexual orientation, need to consider that there are also people that get aroused from killing people, which is very clearly considered a mental illness.
-I have no idea. Maybe medication? Something that supresses sexual drive? It feels a bit immoral to do that to someone, but that is the only idea that I have right now. I'm not fixed on it.
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Re: Is Pedophilia a Choice?
« Reply #2 on: April 14, 2016, 11:15:37 PM »
Being attracted to children is not a choice. Acting on that attraction is a choice.

I don't think its reasonable to suggest that it is a mental illness. The line we draw on the age of consent is essentially arbitrary, based on nothing much beyond modern sensibilities. In history, young children were married off to older people without hesitation. It wasn't considered wrong then, today it is considered wrong. I don't think you can assign a real medical diagnosis of a mental illness based on a modern social construct.

As to stopping pedophiles from acting on their urges, I don't know if that is possible. What are you attracted to? I like women. I can't imagine how I might react if society deemed it revolting and illegal that i pursue a sexual relationship with a woman.

Is it different? In some ways. Obviously women are capable of consent and children are not. But the point is the feeling that scenario elicits in you. That's how pedophiles probably feel. Unless you force them to take some hormone killing drug that eliminates sexual attraction for them entirely I don't really see how you can stop them from trying to act on their attraction.
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Offline Draconic Aiur

Re: Is Pedophilia a Choice?
« Reply #3 on: April 15, 2016, 12:09:32 AM »
So this is something hard for me to talk about. I really hope none of my family sees this. But aside from being gay I am also this. If it's one thing I can tell you for sure is that it's not a choice. Weather or not it's  a mental illness I wouldn't know seeing as how I can't afford to go and a see about it. As a homosexual and a pedo living in a country were both can get you in trouble, from my point of view both are very similar. The only difference is that when I get gay sexual urges I can just go and frap to porn online. However there was nothing online to quench pedo sexual urges until shotacon/lolicon was invented.

I'm a person who doesn't act out my sexual urges on real people. I am very normal amongst kids, even when I'm alone with them. But other people can't help themselves. Most are glad that they get caught so they can get help. Still I do not approve of Child Rape and Child Porn, because that involves hurting someone else. I do approve of shotacon/lolicon however, as they are animated, I would still restrict them to fewer does though. Thing is though because it's illegal, it makes it all the more exhilarating for some people aka the "Romeo and Juliet Syndrome"

I battle this every day along with my depression and anxity. It's like a war in my head. But could you imagine it? Imagine if it was illegal to be straight and everybody associated your kind with rapists. How would you feel? How would you act?

You should join the catholic Church.

Re: Is Pedophilia a Choice?
« Reply #4 on: April 15, 2016, 01:11:05 AM »
So this is something hard for me to talk about. I really hope none of my family sees this. But aside from being gay I am also this. If it's one thing I can tell you for sure is that it's not a choice. Weather or not it's  a mental illness I wouldn't know seeing as how I can't afford to go and a see about it. As a homosexual and a pedo living in a country were both can get you in trouble, from my point of view both are very similar. The only difference is that when I get gay sexual urges I can just go and frap to porn online. However there was nothing online to quench pedo sexual urges until shotacon/lolicon was invented.

I'm a person who doesn't act out my sexual urges on real people. I am very normal amongst kids, even when I'm alone with them. But other people can't help themselves. Most are glad that they get caught so they can get help. Still I do not approve of Child Rape and Child Porn, because that involves hurting someone else. I do approve of shotacon/lolicon however, as they are animated, I would still restrict them to fewer does though. Thing is though because it's illegal, it makes it all the more exhilarating for some people aka the "Romeo and Juliet Syndrome"

I battle this every day along with my depression and anxity. It's like a war in my head. But could you imagine it? Imagine if it was illegal to be straight and everybody associated your kind with rapists. How would you feel? How would you act?
Fighting this without help is no better than fighting depression without help. Have you looked into a sliding scale program so you can get therapy? Cognitive behavioral might be of some help especially if combined with medication.

I'm not here to judge you. You haven't acted on it which is the important thing nor have you supported child pornography. As Nonsense said, your feelings aren't a choice, but your actions are. I strongly believe that you can be helped if you can get to the right place.
There is beauty in a finite life.

Offline Baruch

Re: Is Pedophilia a Choice?
« Reply #5 on: April 15, 2016, 07:01:49 AM »
I know a convicted pedophile ... an old man attracted to teenage girls.  I can certainly relate to the feeling, but I draw the line at soliciting or touching.  He is at least guilty of soliciting on-line.  Not a smart move at all, since it was a police sting.
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Offline AkiraTheFighter

Re: Is Pedophilia a Choice?
« Reply #6 on: April 15, 2016, 09:10:13 AM »
You should join the catholic Church.

I see what you did there. Those priest piss me off though. Pretending to be nice and moral then hurting little boys to which the heads protect him if they're caught. Whats even more fucked up is that the bible approves of it.

Fighting this without help is no better than fighting depression without help. Have you looked into a sliding scale program so you can get therapy? Cognitive behavioral might be of some help especially if combined with medication.

I'm not here to judge you. You haven't acted on it which is the important thing nor have you supported child pornography. As Nonsense said, your feelings aren't a choice, but your actions are. I strongly believe that you can be helped if you can get to the right place.

I would if i could afford it. I dunno if there is a sliding scale program in my country. What is it? And while I have to battle with the fact that I'm a pedophile and weatehr or not I'm monster every day, I don't get the sexual urges every day. Ultimately I get it on rare occasions when I'm really really sad and depressed.

Re: Is Pedophilia a Choice?
« Reply #7 on: April 15, 2016, 11:03:05 AM »
I personally don't see how anyone can find a person not even sexually mature desirable, so for me it would have to be a drive rather than a decision. But just like bisexuality, people make choices. I suspect there are numerous people who have desires or inclinations in that direction but are not driven. I think actual pedophilia would have to be considered a drive for that reason, but for the sake of protecting children should certainly be punished. And people should be treated if the drive is so insistent it could lead to acting it out.

I have witnessed incidents with men who were attracted to minor girls, but they were in their own way physically mature enough to be thought of as a woman. I have certainly seen young women who were physically desirable, but again acting on that was not thought of as an option, at least by me. And I also have encountered adult men who have been involved with minor girls, but again it wasn't clear cut pedophilia.


Re: Is Pedophilia a Choice?
« Reply #8 on: April 15, 2016, 12:45:42 PM »
And while I have to battle with the fact that I'm a pedophile and weatehr or not I'm monster every day, I don't get the sexual urges every day. Ultimately I get it on rare occasions when I'm really really sad and depressed.
It sounds like you are using it as a way to manage your feelings.  In that case I would say that learning a healthier way to manage those feelings and developing some coping skills may be a fruitful path. 
Please don't take anything I say seriously.

Re: Is Pedophilia a Choice?
« Reply #9 on: April 15, 2016, 02:04:43 PM »
@AkiraTheFighter
A sliding scale program is when they look at your income and assets and give you a break on the cost of therapy (some places will only charge you as little as 10%!). You might have to look around and call different agencies that can direct you to places you can go. I'm in the US. I'm not sure if it's available in your county or not, but it would be worth a look even if you have to drive a good ways for the service.

You can also look into a program for inexpensive medications. Sometimes medications that are newly released need people who are willing to try them so companies are willing to give people a discount to try them out or even give them for free! You can also tell the doctor your medication price cap so he/she will try you out on less expensive medication.
There is beauty in a finite life.

Re: Is Pedophilia a Choice?
« Reply #10 on: April 15, 2016, 03:44:46 PM »
So this is something hard for me to talk about. I really hope none of my family sees this. But aside from being gay I am also this. If it's one thing I can tell you for sure is that it's not a choice. Weather or not it's  a mental illness I wouldn't know seeing as how I can't afford to go and a see about it. As a homosexual and a pedo living in a country were both can get you in trouble, from my point of view both are very similar. The only difference is that when I get gay sexual urges I can just go and frap to porn online. However there was nothing online to quench pedo sexual urges until shotacon/lolicon was invented.

I'm a person who doesn't act out my sexual urges on real people. I am very normal amongst kids, even when I'm alone with them. But other people can't help themselves. Most are glad that they get caught so they can get help. Still I do not approve of Child Rape and Child Porn, because that involves hurting someone else. I do approve of shotacon/lolicon however, as they are animated, I would still restrict them to fewer does though. Thing is though because it's illegal, it makes it all the more exhilarating for some people aka the "Romeo and Juliet Syndrome"

I battle this every day along with my depression and anxity. It's like a war in my head. But could you imagine it? Imagine if it was illegal to be straight and everybody associated your kind with rapists. How would you feel? How would you act?
Thank you for your honesty and your courage to share this. This is an issue that the world will have to tackle at some point. I'm confident due to laws of averages that there has to be thousands of people like you.
You have the right to believe whatever you like. However, the once you publicize it as fact, you will have to answer a few questions.

I hope Jenny McCarthy gets small pox
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Re: Is Pedophilia a Choice?
« Reply #11 on: April 15, 2016, 06:24:41 PM »
This is one of those questions that tends to rear its ugly head around here every so often, so I figure a dedicated discussion is in order. I'll kick this off by trying to lay out some basic issues that merit discussion.

  • If pedophilia is a choice, why do people choose to do it?
  • Should pedophilia be considered a mental illness?
  • Is pedophilia a sexual orientation? If not, why should it be distinguished from sexual orientation?
  • What sort of carrot/stick approach would be best to prevent pedophiles from crossing into criminal territory? (Especially since current punishments don't seem to discourage a fair number of them.)
Over time, the age of consent has been moved about like the rope-barrier at a bank - it's placement is quite arbitrary.
The media - and politically convenient - hysteria that has been whipped up over pedophilia has gotten way out of hand in recent years. Society has gone bonkers and needs a good reigning in on this issue. So many people have been black-listed under "Megan's Law" that "Megan's Law" has become a new form of tyranny for probation and parole officers to abuse. A 17 yo who got charged w/statutory rape of his 16 yo girlfriend b/c daddy was pissed off about his little girl was neither a rapist nor a pedophile - but he's both under "Megan's Law" and will spend the rest of his life as a registered sex offender for no good reason - as will the stupid drunk who got caught taking a leak in an alley - "indecent exposure" ...
Pedophiles cannot help themselves.
Does this mean that we allow them to do what they want? No.
What does it mean?
It means that we do not send them to prison, where they are brutally raped by other prisoners as "pay back".
Instead, we can hospitalize them and try to treat them. (Pedophilia is incurable - but we can at least study them.)
"Oh, but their victims!" - "What of their victims? We are talking about justice, not vengeance."

« Last Edit: April 15, 2016, 06:26:40 PM by marom1963 »
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Offline Baruch

Re: Is Pedophilia a Choice?
« Reply #12 on: April 15, 2016, 06:33:17 PM »
Justice is very much about vengeance by the hoi poloi against anyone who is non-conformist.  Justice is a worthless abstract concept.

I have had to publicly take a piss, and I wasn't even drunk.  Fortunately one of our fine constabulary didn't catch me.  I pissed against the tire well of my own car.

Calvinists all ... find everyone guilty, apply the death penalty for every violation ... otherwise our sky-daddy will be displeased and withhold the rain.  Canaanite.
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Offline doorknob

Re: Is Pedophilia a Choice?
« Reply #13 on: April 18, 2016, 10:26:23 PM »
I don't think all cases are pedophilia as with a boyfriend one year older. There are many cases where the lines are moved about.

Still

there is something wrong with a 60 year old man ogling a teenage girl. On the same token it's equally sick if a woman does it to a teenage boy. What the hell do you see in a teenage boy any way? Certainly not security. And 60 year old man? Yes I'm sure you and the teenage girl will have lots to relate on.

While yes in the olden days girls as young as 12 were married off. Just because it was socially acceptable didn't make it right. Just as slavery was once socially acceptable it was still always wrong. But now we know better. So an adult male should not be messing around with teenage girls. It's definitely a predatory thing. Can't handle women your own age huh? Women on equal footing. Gotta go after a young inexperienced teenage girl who barely handles other teenage boys let alone an adult male.

So sorry any one under 18 is off limits. It's questionable whether you are really an adult at 18 any way. I know I didn't grow up for a long time after. There are some things that only come with age. While maybe there should be guidelines about how much  older is too much older grey area's exist. It is ridiculous if an 18 year old gets a rap for dating a 17 year old. This is where a judge would have to use common sense yet they fail to every time.

Oh yeah back to the OT No I don't think it is a choice. There may very well be some people who do choose it just as there are in fact some people who chose to be gay but those people are far and few in between. For the most part a person would not choose this. But acting on this is wrong and needs to be treated with therapy. Cognitive therapy is very useful, but also probably medicated. Medications can help clear up thoughts the way glasses clear up vision. Once you become a healthy thinker you will not struggle as hard. I had to change a lot of things about myself. The best way to do it is to just walk away from unhealthy or even sick thoughts and forget about them. Delete it from your mind. Follow your heart and do the right thing will naturally help clear up evil thoughts. Fill your head with positive things.Also doing good deeds no matter how mundane can really make a difference both in a neighbors life and your own.
« Last Edit: April 18, 2016, 10:45:20 PM by doorknob »

Re: Is Pedophilia a Choice?
« Reply #14 on: April 19, 2016, 05:20:12 AM »
Chattel slavery as we practiced it in the US was certainly wrong. However, "slavery" as it was practiced in Ancient Rome was not at all like the slavery that we practiced here. In fact, it more resembled modern employment than chattel slavery. No, the slaves could not just leave when they wanted, but they had rights that had to be scrupulously cared for, including the possession of their wages. They also had guilds to which they could belong that invested their earnings to help them purchase their freedom.Secretary, librarian, teacher, chef, accountant, physician, dancer, artist, government bureaucrat - just some of the occupations that were entirely servile in nature. Only soldiers and lawyers had to be free men. (By the by, it was the soldiers who built Rome's roads, not slaves.)
As for the ages of consent, when I said that it was moved about like the rope at a bank, I meant nowadays, not the past. All over the World, it varies.
As for the past, w/a much shorter life span, getting married at age 12 was not unreasonable. As life-span has increased, the span of childhood has telescoped to an almost ridiculous length. And we have invented something that did not exist in the past: adolescence. To a large extent, this has to do w/delaying the entry of even more young men and women into the work force. The lack of experience that goes w/being young was, in the past, treated for what it was - lack of experience, not a special disease that afflicts the young.
OMNIA DEPENDET ...