Author Topic: Another reason Buddhism doesn't get a pass.  (Read 1367 times)

Offline Brian37 (OP)

Another reason Buddhism doesn't get a pass.
« on: December 30, 2015, 09:01:54 AM »
Sagan is the polite Shakespeare calling all this "a flurry of activity signifying nothing". Hitchens would be considered the verbal only Malcolm X of atheists, but even he was very Jeffersonian, in that sure you had the right to make any bullshit claim you wanted, but he had the right to call it bullshit.

So why the attack on Buddhism? Because it is also part of one species, one planet and one evolution. It should not be blasphemy or ridicule free either. That religion was born from Hinduism and the Vedas. The legend of the first Buddha was also a magical story where the divine told his mother Queen Maya that she would give birth to a baby who would bring wisdom to the world, he too had a birth that avoided the birth canal. And it is a religion to call it anything less is bullshit to me. It too has moral codes and holy people and competing sects and different interpretations. While some are atheists and call it a philosophy, others hold the superstitions of "nats"(spirits) and Karma and reincarnation.

Buddhism is as much a superstition as any other religion stemming from mythology.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maya_(mother_of_the_Buddha)


Does Buddhism automatically make you good? Lets see what this former Muslim who grew up in a Buddhist majority has to say.

http://www.pri.org/stories/2015-12-29/burmese-atheist-who-takes-inspiration-george-carlin-and-bart-simpson

And just like every other religion, the cop outs are used "Well they arn't true Buddhists" "Those Buddhists didn't have the right teachers".

https://newhumanist.org.uk/articles/4021/the-dark-side-of-buddhism

This is just the tip of the ice burg. Point being it is not bigoted to say ALL religions are man made artificial constructs having NOTHING to do with our common existence and our modern scientific understanding of nature, evolution, human behavior, or the universe.

I really get fucking sick of the false accusation of bigotry or being falsely accused of being "militant" for simply pointing out willful ignorance. YES I get that people like what they believe, and from a human rights standpoint I will defend it, but at the same time I will put a blunt mirror to your logic in hopes that you will consider that ALL religions are superfluous placebos at best, and unfortunately still divisive and this post is yet another example.

Again, human rights are a given, but no religion on the face of the planet deserves a taboo.
"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers." Obama
Poetry By Brian37 Like my poetry on Facebook Under BrianJames Rational Poet and also at twitter under Brianrrs37

Offline Shiranu

Re: Another reason Buddhism doesn't get a pass.
« Reply #1 on: December 30, 2015, 09:15:03 AM »
Quote
Point being it is not bigoted to say ALL religions are man made artificial constructs having NOTHING to do with our common existence and our modern scientific understanding of nature, evolution, human behavior, or the universe.

Religions have nothing to do with our common existence and human behaviour.

Right then.
"No one is born hating another person because of the color of his skin or his background or his religion..." - Nelson Mandela

"There are not two sides to bigotry and there are not two sides to hatred." - Arnold Schwarzenegger

Offline Brian37 (OP)

Re: Another reason Buddhism doesn't get a pass.
« Reply #2 on: December 30, 2015, 09:58:06 AM »
Huh,

No they do not. The only thing that is universal about all religions is our species ability to gap fill based on false perceptions. ALL religions are man made. Our species was around long before our currently still held religions, long before the dead ones nobody believes anymore. Our planet is 4 billion years old. Our universe is 14 billion years old.

In 10 billion years none of our human invented myths we call religions will be remembered. It sounds harsh, and yea, it does offend, but humans shouldn't act like children for others merely pointing out reality.

Nothing I just said is a call to force any religion out of existence. It is simply cold water on one's face to get humans to consider a better way of viewing reality instead of clinging to the past.
"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers." Obama
Poetry By Brian37 Like my poetry on Facebook Under BrianJames Rational Poet and also at twitter under Brianrrs37

Offline Shiranu

Re: Another reason Buddhism doesn't get a pass.
« Reply #3 on: December 30, 2015, 11:17:26 AM »
Quote
ALL religions are man made. Our species was around long before our currently still held religions, long before the dead ones nobody believes anymore. Our planet is 4 billion years old. Our universe is 14 billion years old.

That entire argument therefor boils down to "All culture is a man made invention and thus are not part of our common existence or human behaviour (i.e. "the human condition")". 

Culture IS the human condition... not gravity, not physics, not cosmological theories... culture. Religion is, like it or not, a huge part of what it has historically meant to be a human being.

Quote
In 10 billion years none of our human invented myths we call religions will be remembered. It sounds harsh, and yea, it does offend, but humans shouldn't act like children for others merely pointing out reality.

You could apply that just as easily to being an asshole vs being a good person... who will remember in even 100 years?

Life is more than birth, grow up, reproduce, die. You can try to take any beauty out of it.. reduce it to it's most base elements... and scream that everyone is wrong for coming to a different conclusion than you but that is just as much not our problem as our not caring is yours.

I think a scientific view of the world can be and is a very beautiful outlook... but not one that condemns everyone else to being primitive and idiotic for not seeing it like me. That is not a world view I wish to hold.

Quote
Nothing I just said is a call to force any religion out of existence. It is simply cold water on one's face to get humans to consider a better way of viewing reality instead of clinging to the past.

Condescension is rarely an effective tool to change people.
"No one is born hating another person because of the color of his skin or his background or his religion..." - Nelson Mandela

"There are not two sides to bigotry and there are not two sides to hatred." - Arnold Schwarzenegger

Re: Another reason Buddhism doesn't get a pass.
« Reply #4 on: December 30, 2015, 11:23:59 AM »
In my opinion, you are both correct. Just don't know how to express it, but together you pretty much hit 'where the rubber meets the road' as you guys say in English.

I like it.

E: I meant the relationship between culture and religion. 
« Last Edit: December 31, 2015, 03:49:19 AM by drunkenshoe »

Offline Hakurei Reimu

Re: Another reason Buddhism doesn't get a pass.
« Reply #5 on: December 30, 2015, 07:07:15 PM »
Buddhism is mostly absent of the more egregious offenses of its Abrahamic cousins. It tends not to be on people's radar for that reason. It's not that Buddhism gets a free pass; it just has less need of it.
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Re: Another reason Buddhism doesn't get a pass.
« Reply #6 on: December 30, 2015, 07:50:10 PM »
I was told by a Buddhist to Christian convert that Buddhism is secular, making no claims about what gods--if any--exist. He also told me that Buddhism is open enough to be compatible with pretty much any religion, although the religions themselves are unaccommodating of Buddhism. Are you telling me he was wrong?
"Birds born in a cage think flying is an illness." - Alejandro Jodorowsky

Offline Baruch

Re: Another reason Buddhism doesn't get a pass.
« Reply #7 on: December 30, 2015, 07:56:32 PM »
I was told by a Buddhist to Christian convert that Buddhism is secular, making no claims about what gods--if any--exist. He also told me that Buddhism is open enough to be compatible with pretty much any religion, although the religions themselves are unaccommodating of Buddhism. Are you telling me he was wrong?

Very specific examples in Asia.  In China you could be both Taoist and Buddhist, or both Confucian and Buddhist.  And in Japan you could be both Shinto and Buddhist.  In China today, both Confucianism and Buddhism are making a come back.  In Japan today ... you are born into Shinto, but you have a Buddhist funeral ;-)  Like in all traditional societies, religion is controlled as part of state policy, even if more than one is allowed.  Christianity was resisted in China and Japan, because of its association with European imperialism.  But I think it is telling ... that when the Japanese first encountered Christians, they thought they were a variety of Buddhism ;-)
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Offline Shiranu

Re: Another reason Buddhism doesn't get a pass.
« Reply #8 on: December 30, 2015, 07:56:53 PM »
I was told by a Buddhist to Christian convert that Buddhism is secular, making no claims about what gods--if any--exist. He also told me that Buddhism is open enough to be compatible with pretty much any religion, although the religions themselves are unaccommodating of Buddhism. Are you telling me he was wrong?

Yes and no.

To define Buddhism in one way or another is about as futile as defining any religion in one way or another. Some sects of Buddhist are practically 100 percent secular; others like the Tibetan branch are extremely loaded with Tibetan and Hindu folklore mixed in with Buddhist teachings. It falls everywhere from modern atheist philosophy to B.C.E. Hindu reformation.

I would say the majority of Western Buddhists are on the secular-spectrum as well as perhaps Japanese Buddhists whereas Indian/Central-South Central Asians tend to lean more towards a religious-spectrum... but you have exceptions of course on both sides. Likewise I would say that at it's core Buddhism is a very deeply spiritual and superstitious religion that is built around very beautiful and deep philosophical concepts.

It is a great example of why we should not throw the baby out with the bathwater so to speak when it comes to religion.

« Last Edit: December 30, 2015, 07:58:32 PM by Shiranu »
"No one is born hating another person because of the color of his skin or his background or his religion..." - Nelson Mandela

"There are not two sides to bigotry and there are not two sides to hatred." - Arnold Schwarzenegger

Offline josephpalazzo

Re: Another reason Buddhism doesn't get a pass.
« Reply #9 on: December 31, 2015, 05:27:57 AM »
Huh,

No they do not. The only thing that is universal about all religions is our species ability to gap fill based on false perceptions. ALL religions are man made. Our species was around long before our currently still held religions, long before the dead ones nobody believes anymore. Our planet is 4 billion years old. Our universe is 14 billion years old.

In 10 billion years none of our human invented myths we call religions will be remembered. It sounds harsh, and yea, it does offend, but humans shouldn't act like children for others merely pointing out reality.

Nothing I just said is a call to force any religion out of existence. It is simply cold water on one's face to get humans to consider a better way of viewing reality instead of clinging to the past.
^^^
This.

I would add to that, that any culture based on falsehoods, superstitions, misconceptions, warped worldviews is just plain worthless. You might as well have no culture than that piece of shit. And especially religion, which  has been more often than not on the evil side of human nature. It's an abomination that needs to be totally wiped out.

Offline Shiranu

Re: Another reason Buddhism doesn't get a pass.
« Reply #10 on: December 31, 2015, 08:07:03 AM »
Quote
I would add to that, that any culture based on falsehoods, superstitions, misconceptions, warped worldviews is just plain worthless. You might as well have no culture than that piece of shit.

Holy. Shit.

What a primitive and barbaric worldview.
"No one is born hating another person because of the color of his skin or his background or his religion..." - Nelson Mandela

"There are not two sides to bigotry and there are not two sides to hatred." - Arnold Schwarzenegger

Offline Baruch

Re: Another reason Buddhism doesn't get a pass.
« Reply #11 on: December 31, 2015, 08:51:30 AM »
Holy. Shit.

What a primitive and barbaric worldview.

Strong feelings ... harshly expressed.  But I don't think he is against art ... just certain social constructs.  I find 100% this or 0% that to be hyperbolic and overly idealistic.  I would feel the same about neo-Nazi movements.
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