Flying Sphagetti monster - Greatest Atheist Straw man OAT

[pato15]

What are you talking about? As far as I know, all Pastafarians agree that the FSM created the universe.

[the_antithesis]

What's a god?

[Poison Tree]

If we examine beliefs humans have held throughout history, although you see a variation of 'Gods', and a stronghold of monotheism, there has always been a belief that the stars, the universe, the cosmos, have originated by a transcendent , intelligence.

This word must have some double secret definition for you that the rest of us are not privy to. Gods appear quite simply as beefed up versions of humans and sometimes animals. They have moods and bodies and desire (and often pain and death and birth) just like humans. They have more power than humans, but powers that are seen in nature.

Is the image of a giant human throwing lighting and changing into animals to have sex somehow transcendent to you? Then certainly some kind of superman flying around and leaping tall buildings must likewise be a pointer to some underlying intelligence and transcendent cause of our universe.

[Plu]

What are you talking about? As far as I know, all Pastafarians agree that the FSM created the universe.

Hey now, believing in the FSM is not a requirement for being a Pastafarian! It says so right in the gospel.

Also, as a child I rejected the notion of a god creating things, because it didn't make any sense. And I did go to church when I was a kid, I guess I was just naturally inquisitive and curious instead of accepting any answer thrown at me, or something. If you really think about it, even a child will understand the nonsense of it.

The only reasons children believe in gods is because
A: they trust their parents (a natural trait) and their parents tell them about them, and then their parents make them fucking terrified of gods, and tell their kids to never question them, and that slowly grinds into their brain to the point where it's so deeply ingrained that it takes years to get it out again
B: they just want easy answers because that way they won't have to think as hard

[Fidel_Castronaut]

What's a god?

I believe we've gone through this with MR before. His definition of his god (Allah) is whatever he wants it to be, every other description be damned.

Remember when I used his reasoning to evidence why I'm actually god and he can't disprove it? Oh lol

[Jason78]

If we examine beliefs humans have held throughout history, although you see a variation of 'Gods', and a stronghold of monotheism, there has always been a belief that the stars, the universe, the cosmos, have originated by a transcendent , intelligence.

If you examine a science book now, you'll find out that we now know that stars aren't created, they aren't lit like cosmic candles by the invisible hands of the gods, they coalesse from hydrogen gas clouds.


Try science mendacium remedium, it works.

[Bibliofagus]

What does 'outside of time and space' mean?

[Jason78]

That is actually absolutely false. Almost all world religions have a belief that a transcendent reality created the universe. Even the greeks believed in their own transcendent realities.

The Greek gods lived on Mount Olympus.  This wasn't some imagined transcendent reality.  Mount Olympus is a real place.  You can even go there!

Mount Olympus

[SGOS]

Quite often we see people comparing belief in an underlying intelligence to our universe as akin to believing in mythical creatures, fairies, and one particularly mildly amusing comparison I have seen – lobsters!  However, is this a...

OK, before you go any further, just let me interrupt and first ask if you are a real idiot or just doing a parody of one?

[AxisMundi]

If we examine beliefs humans have held throughout history, although you see a variation of 'Gods', and a stronghold of monotheism, there has always been a belief that the stars, the universe, the cosmos, have originated by a transcendent , intelligence.

Wrong.

Sorry about that, but not only is the idea of a creator NOT universal, it's not even all that common. Most religions have a creation myth that assumes the Earth always existed in some form or another, and that the big deal is the introduction of humans.

Seriously, you should at least do a cursory study of comparative religions before embarrassing yourself like this.

That is actually absolutely false. Almost all world religions have a belief that a transcendent reality created the universe. Even the greeks believed in their own transcendent realities.

Belief in some form of transcendent reality, irrespective of names or identity, has been universal with few exceptions.

That really is an abuse of 'most' religions, considering this is pretty common knowledge.

Furthermore, even if someone asserts that it was all 'God of the gaps'. This does not detract from the fact humans have always felt a need to ascribe what they saw around them to a higher, transcendent reality.

Although numbers are no indicator of truth, even today, the vast majority of people on earth believe in a transcendent reality , although it was greater the further we go back in the past.

You are wrong, on several levels.

Firstly, early religions were shamanistic and animistic in nature, devoid of gods.

Secondly, most of the creation myths prior to monotheistic beliefs centered around a creator deity creating humans, in a universe that was already present.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmology# ... _cosmology

[SGOS]

Firstly, early religions were shamanistic and animistic in nature, devoid of gods.

Secondly, most of the creation myths prior to monotheistic beliefs centered around a creator deity creating humans, in a universe that was already present.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cosmology# ... _cosmology

I'm not knowledgeable enough to enter this debate in earnest, but it's fun to speculate about this.  I would guess that prehistoric people probably tried to initiate desired outcomes by attempting to use magic of their own, just as we see animistic societies today.  Most early men would have been discouraged by their own personal attempts, but inevitably someone would come along that would convince others that he had actual magical abilities of his own.  Furthermore, if he had a good line of bullshit, he could convince everyone to turn over the important job of conjuring to him, because after all, he was an "expert".  So instead of having to go out and risk his life hunting dangerous prey, he would stay at home by the fire, and be showered with requests and gifts.

Now that's not to say prehistoric societies were not without their skeptics, and some of the skeptics might have misdirected their skepticism toward the sorcerers and witches, rather than the magic itself.  The logical conclusion might have been that the shaman was in the business for his own best interests, because he would frequently put spells on members of the tribe who didn't treat him right (after all, how else would you explain Grog falling down and breaking his leg)?  We actually see this today in animistic societies, where witches are burned or tied to trees in the jungle.

The bottom line is that lots of people believe in magic and magic requires magicians.  They can be either human or imagined, but someone or something has to do the magic.

[leo]

Quite often we see people comparing belief in an underlying intelligence to our universe as akin to believing in mythical creatures, fairies, and one particularly mildly amusing comparison I have seen – lobsters!  However, is this a...

OK, before you go any further, just let me interrupt and first ask if you are a real idiot or just doing a parody of one?

I say he is a funny troll .

[Fidel_Castronaut]

Quite often we see people comparing belief in an underlying intelligence to our universe as akin to believing in mythical creatures, fairies, and one particularly mildly amusing comparison I have seen – lobsters!  However, is this a...

OK, before you go any further, just let me interrupt and first ask if you are a real idiot or just doing a parody of one?

I say he is a funny troll .

I don't think he's a troll, I just think he's not viewing his own arguments with the same lense that he's viewing everyone else's in.

[Johan]

If we examine beliefs humans have held throughout history, although you see a variation of 'Gods', and a stronghold of monotheism, there has always been a belief that the stars, the universe, the cosmos, have originated by a transcendent , intelligence.

People also believed witches were real. A history of believing something is real doesn't automatically make it real.

[Davka]

What does 'outside of time and space' mean?

I think it's code for "imaginary."