Trayvon Martin, One year later

[Jmpty]

I would be interested to hear everyones thoughts on this case. Have you changed your mind after some time to think, or do you feel the same way?

[The Dude]

Has it really been a year already?

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't a good amount of evidence surface that showed Martin was actually attacking the guy? Not saying he should've shot him dead, but the media was so quick to call it a case of racism and were so quick to get sympathy for the kid, they really jumped the gun.

Again, not saying anything he did was justified. Just saying, the news likes to jump to conclusions, and the millions of people taking in everything the news says without an opinion of their own will jump to the same ones.

[Thumpalumpacus]

I think Zimmerman overreacted, likely because of his own preconceived notions, and though I wasn't a member here a  year ago, my views were essentially the same.

[Johan]

I know no more about the case than i did a year ago. And my only knowledge of the case a year ago is what I got via the press. Which is to say that I didn't have enough actual facts to form a valid opinion then and I still don't now.

[La Dolce Vita]

I actually saw an interview with his brother today (was a few weeks old though) where he pointed out than Zimmerman is hispanic, not white. Quite irrelevant to me mind you, but it did seem like everyone was going after him for being a white man shooting a black teen. It could obviously still have been racism however, not like hispanics aren't capable of that, I'm just amused by the extreme focus on race Americans seem to have.

I don't know what happened, but considering the amount of murder cases in the US I don't think it should have gotten this much press. Will be really hard to find an unbiased jury now.

[billhilly]

Whether he's guilty or not, the prosecutor sure has come off looking like an idiot.

[Thumpalumpacus]

I don't, and never did, think it was a direct act of racism ("gosh, I hate black folk.  Hey, look, there's one now.  I should go shoot him".)

I think the racism comes in from profiling ("I've got a black kid in a hoodie in a somewhat affluent neighborhood.  He doesn't belong here.")

I think the reason why it got so much attention is because Zimmerman was acting as someone with a nominal bit of authority, the shooting having taken place on his patrol as part of the local, volunteer Neighborhood Watch.

[Atheon]

I think the racism comes in from profiling ("I've got a black kid in a hoodie in a somewhat affluent neighborhood.  He doesn't belong here.")

This is the way I see it. I believe Zimmerman started following and harassing Martin just because of such profiling. Martin then confronted the guy, and may well have attacked him and knocked him to the ground, though there were no reliable witnesses to that supposition.

My initial problem with the case had nothing to do with race. It was that Zimmerman had been arrested and then simply let go. As a suspect in a fatal shooting, he should have been detained.

I'm also suspicious about how some of the photographic evidence of Zimmerman's head wound came out months later.

(I was also struck by how, in all the forums I read, all the known racists immediately came out in Zimmerman's defense, whereas the rational people were saying we need to gather more evidence.)

[Johan]

I remember it being reported that Zimmerman called the police about seeing someone suspicious and he was told not to pursue or approach the person. It would seem that he ignored those instructions. If that is true, I think I might find that very compelling in deciding whether or not his self defense claim had any merit.

[Shiranu]

A. He stalked an innocent kid.
B. He was told not to by police.
C. He is only 25% Hispanic, so he would most likely be majority white.(irrelevant)
D. The evidence of a fight is sketchy as hell.
E. He had a history of calling the cops on black kids for no reason.

Given the lack of evidence of him being innocent, he can go fuck himself.

[Thumpalumpacus]

My initial problem with the case had nothing to do with race. It was that Zimmerman had been arrested and then simply let go. As a suspect in a fatal shooting, he should have been detained.

I absolutely agree.  I don't know  whether a crime occurred that night or not, but I know for a fact that Zimmerman was given inappropriately lenient treatment.

I remember it being reported that Zimmerman called the police about seeing someone suspicious and he was told not to pursue or approach the person. It would seem that he ignored those instructions. If that is true, I think I might find that very compelling in deciding whether or not his self defense claim had any merit.

Not only that: the Neighborhood Watch training he'd been through specifically emphasizes the instruction to not take any action towards confronting any suspect.  The training he received specifically instructed him to call the police and await their response.  To not have done that, and then to disregard the instructions of the dispatcher as well, will go hard on him in court, I think.

[Nonsensei]

A. He stalked an innocent kid.
B. He was told not to by police.
C. He is only 25% Hispanic, so he would most likely be majority white.(irrelevant)
D. The evidence of a fight is sketchy as hell.
E. He had a history of calling the cops on black kids for no reason.

Given the lack of evidence of him being innocent, he can go fuck himself.

None of that is established.

A. Says you.
B. The 911 dispatcher is not a member of the police force and had no power to give him any orders.
C. Irrelevant
D. Zimmerman had visible bruises and a broken nose.
E. Calling the cops on black kids has no bearing on whether or not he would murder one in cold blood.

Shiranu you represent the most common thoughts of Zimmerman guilt advocates,  for lack of a better term. Your reasoning is plagued with emotion and has no regard for legal realities. Worse, it doesn't address the elephant in the room which is that nobody knows what happened besides Zimmerman. If Treyvon were white I have a stong feeling a lot of people who share your opinion would be saying that Zimmerman should never have been charged due to a lack of evidence.

Any conviction of Zimmerman will be based on pure circumstance, and that is not how the law should be exercised. Especially in a murder trial.

[Shiranu]

None of that is established.

A. Says you.
B. The 911 dispatcher is not a member of the police force and had no power to give him any orders.
C. Irrelevant
D. Zimmerman had visible bruises and a broken nose.
E. Calling the cops on black kids has no bearing on whether or not he would murder one in cold blood.

A. Says George Zimmerman. Unless admitting on a phone call that you are following an unarmed, law-abiding citizen while you yourself are packing heat is no longer an admission that you stalked someone.

B. "I'm not a member of the police force, I just work for the police department by working directly with police officers after being trained by the PD to work with the officers."

Their paycheck is made out by the police department and they relay information to and from officers to a caller after being trained by the police. Sorry, but I consider that part of the law enforcement branch and thus their voice carries more weight than if a regular civilian had told him not to.

If it was a janitor or trash collector that might be relevant, but as it stands that is one hell of a piss-poor defense.

And that is such a piss poor defense anyways...

D. Zimmerman had visible bruises and a broken nose.

Still sketchy on how long it took that to be stated.

But to quote C, irrelevant. You started the confrontation by stalking a kid, and you escalated it by pulling a gun on him. Even if he DID get in a fight and got his ass handed to him, he is still in the wrong.

E. Calling the cops on black kids has no bearing on whether or not he would murder one in cold blood.

No, but if you don't want race to be an issue in your trial you should try not to make it an issue on who you harass.

Shiranu you represent the most common thoughts of Zimmerman guilt advocates, for lack of a better term. Your reasoning is plagued with emotion and has no regard for legal realities.

Oh, I didn't realize I was a judge. If I had known that I would have just thrown his ass in jail last year and not had this stupid trial.

Worse, it doesn't address the elephant in the room which is that nobody knows what happened besides Zimmerman.

That elephant in the room exists with a good number of murders, but we don't make it an issue then.

If Treyvon were white I have a stong feeling a lot of people who share your opinion would be saying that Zimmerman should never have been charged due to a lack of evidence.

Actually, no one would have ever known about it... it only got media attention because Treyvon was black.

And I doubt it, since we have concrete evidence he stalked an unarmed kid by HIS OWN ADMISSION, and the scene backs that up.

Any conviction of Zimmerman will be based on pure circumstance, and that is not how the law should be exercised. Especially in a murder trial.

We better let a shitload of murderers out of jail then...

[DunkleSeele]

A. He stalked an innocent kid.
B. He was told not to by police.
C. He is only 25% Hispanic, so he would most likely be majority white.(irrelevant)
D. The evidence of a fight is sketchy as hell.
E. He had a history of calling the cops on black kids for no reason.

Given the lack of evidence of him being innocent, he can go fuck himself.

"Lack of evidence of him being innocent"? Did you fucking drink your brains for breakfast? Ever heard of "[blink:1855gbv0]innocent until proven guilty[/blink:1855gbv0]"?

I'm the first one to say that this whole story has many obscure details, but the above comment is just...wow!

[Jack89]

A. He stalked an innocent kid.
B. He was told not to by police.
C. He is only 25% Hispanic, so he would most likely be majority white.(irrelevant)
D. The evidence of a fight is sketchy as hell.
E. He had a history of calling the cops on black kids for no reason.

Given the lack of evidence of him being innocent, he can go fuck himself.

It's the other way around, you're innocent until proven guilty.

What I think is that the media grabbed on to this and turned it into a circus.  If Zimmerman was black, or Martin was latino, this would not have gone to trial and we wouldn't even know who these people were.