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Faith Is From Lack Of Knowledge

Started by Solitary, September 17, 2014, 12:44:38 PM

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Solitary

When one sees faith claims as knowledge claims, then it becomes clear that one of three things must be happening:  people are pretending to know things they do not know; people are delusional;  people use a process I don't understand and makes no sense to access information about the world: A virgin birth, Woman made from a man's rib, talking snakes, burning bushes talking, and donckeys talking, Jonas lived in the belly of a whale, Mohammad flew to heaven on a winged horse etc.

They should formulate their beliefs on the basis of evidence, and  stop pretending to know things they don’t know. It’s both amazing and tragic that this is even considered controversial. Why does religion have to be organized and not just a private belief? Why is religious authority not even questioned, but science is? How can anyone know anything about the "supernatural" even if it did exist? Why are gods not believed to exist and therefor myths, but God does and is not a myth?

Advice to those of faith, Be honest, admit lack of knowledge and evidence, be humble, and not pretending to know things you don’t know, these are qualities that you should not be afraid of. These are virtues to which you should aspire. Overcome your fears with knowledge, not superstitious nonsense and rituals, and prayers that are never answered by more than chance. Live life to the fullest in case you are wrong, so you don't waste the life you have by listening to authorities that have no more knowledge of their religion than you do, but just ambiguous Scriptures written thousands of years ago by ignorant tribesmen claiming they have divine knowledge.   Solitary
There is nothing more frightful than ignorance in action.

Hydra009

Quote from: Solitary on September 17, 2014, 12:44:38 PMThey should formulate their beliefs on the basis of evidence, and  stop pretending to know things they don’t know.
Amen.

I could ask religious people the capital of Bulgaria and most would say they don't know.
I could ask those same people questions about the fundamental nature of the universe, the origin of humanity, and whether or not there's an afterlife and they're suddenly omniscient.

Solitary

 :eek: :lol: Well you just made my day. Thanks!
There is nothing more frightful than ignorance in action.

stromboli

Belief in religion without being challenged can be considered as knowledge. Until the point is made that belief is based on faith alone and is not provable by any known method, believers can hold to the idea that they have knowledge of the truth. Which is why I do that.

josephpalazzo

Quote from: stromboli on September 17, 2014, 04:14:39 PM
Belief in religion without being challenged can be considered as knowledge. Until the point is made that belief is based on faith alone and is not provable by any known method, believers can hold to the idea that they have knowledge of the truth. Which is why I do that.

In spite of knowledge, many theists will persist in believing blindly whatever their faith says they must believe. Wasn't it Luther who said, "'Reason is a whore, the greatest enemy that faith has..."

SGOS

Quote from: josephpalazzo on September 17, 2014, 05:13:13 PM
Wasn't it Luther who said, "'Reason is a whore, the greatest enemy that faith has..."
He was pretty close to nailing it.  If it's not the greatest enemy, it ranks right up there.  He's just not understanding how important that is. 

The movie Martin Luther, starring Richard Burton, I think, came out in the 50s.  My Luthern Church bought a 16 mm copy of the movie, which probably cost quite a bit.  I watched the thing about 5 times.  They were seemingly quite proud to own the movie, and once they bought it, they had to keep showing it to get their money's worth.  Still, I guess I learned something of the historic background of my church, which isn't a bad thing.  But I don't remember all that much about the movie either.  I remember that Luther nailed a manifesto or something to the doors of the Catholic Church, and managed to piss off the Pope. 

Green Bottle

Anything that pisses off the pope is ok by me...
God doesnt exist, but if he did id tell him to ''Fuck Off''

Lachish

Quote from: Green Bottle on September 17, 2014, 05:45:12 PM
Anything that pisses off the pope is ok by me...

You really sure you want to say that?

Hydra009

Yah!  You'd better watch your mouth or else the Catholic leadership might get mad and take it out on a choir boy again.  :razz:

Mike Cl

Quote from: Lachish on September 18, 2014, 07:31:29 PM
You really sure you want to say that?
Well, I think he did say that--and I join him.  The pope, the office and it's history is almost the exact opposite of what Jesus of the Bible would teach.  Can you picture your beloved Jesus dressed as the pope dresses????  The pope could sell all of fineries and feed the poor for years.  Yet he parades around in his shocking display of wealth for all to see.  Yeah, I'd like to personally piss him off!
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?<br />Then he is not omnipotent,<br />Is he able but not willing?<br />Then whence cometh evil?<br />Is he neither able or willing?<br />Then why call him god?

Hydra009

Quote from: Mike Cl on September 18, 2014, 08:24:16 PMWell, I think he did say that--and I join him.  The pope, the office and it's history is almost the exact opposite of what Jesus of the Bible would teach.  Can you picture your beloved Jesus dressed as the pope dresses????  The pope could sell all of fineries and feed the poor for years.  Yet he parades around in his shocking display of wealth for all to see.  Yeah, I'd like to personally piss him off!
The new one kinda toned it down compared to the old one, but yeah, it's still a vast concentration of wealth.  I dunno what sorts of vows they take there, but a vow of poverty definitely isn't one of them.

stromboli

And we see that the Pope has been elevated to near godlike status, i.e. the Vicar of Christ. But which Pope?

The pope that closeted his pedophile predator buddies and kept them from prosecution, the one that used the media and PR to dodge all the bullets about generations of pedophiles preying on young boys and girls?

The pope that said using condoms was against the will of god, when health authorities were advocating the use of them to fight the spread of AIDS? The pope that said birth control was also against the will of god, leading to millions of families in poverty with far more children than they could care for and feed effectively? That pope?

The pope that condemned unwed mothers and took their children away from them and then forced young women to work hard labor for penance?  That pope?

The pope that made a saint out of Mother Teresa, who made millions from all kinds of dubious sources and then banked the money in a Swiss account and let the thousands of women suffer because suffering brought them closer to god? And when she was sick, sought out the best doctors in America?

Oh, ok. we don't don't want to piss off a homophobic 12th century dictator that sits on millions of dollars in finery and estates, and allows their cardinals and bishops to live in high style while the minions grovel in the dirt to cough up tithing to keep them in their finery, yeah, that pope. Got it.