Author Topic: Hindu's Hate me on Tumblr  (Read 13007 times)

Offline Aupmanyav

Re: Hindu's Hate me on Tumblr
« Reply #30 on: August 23, 2015, 04:10:47 AM »
I don't get why this is even a discssion topic. Religion is a religion, it is belief system. Trying to distinguish one from the others is just stupid. As long as it is a belief system there will be fanatics.
Each religion is different. Try comparing Jainism and Buddhism with Christianity and Islam. Well, I am not much of a Hindu, I am a strong atheist and an Advaitist (believer in non-duality).

I was replying to this:

Devout Hindus are in many ways far more hateful and more gifted at wielding illogical brain-rot against human intelligence than the Abrahamic religious followers, and in countries where they dominate they are as violent as any religion gets.
Peacewithoutgod should make his case by examples. An ad-hoc statement is not enough.

If Hinduism was anything 'better', a lot of things in those countries would be 'better'. It's not. It's the same male dominated bullshit percieved in contrast with Abrahamic religions.
You are coming to us after a 1000 years of foreign rule and 200 years of inculcation of materialism by the British and 70 years of decay with the ‘grab it if you can’ democracy that we have  and modern perversity. Hinduism at present is weak but is on mend. Except in poor uneducated sections of the society whose numbers are decreasing progressively, men and women are equal partners in life. Women’s education and employment is constantly increasing.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2015, 04:15:07 AM by Aupmanyav »
"Brahma Satyam Jagan-mithya" (Brahman is the truth, the observed is an illusion)
"Sarve Khalu Idam Brahma" (All this here is Brahman)

Re: Hindu's Hate me on Tumblr
« Reply #31 on: August 23, 2015, 05:45:04 AM »
You are aware that by demanding peacewithoutgod make his case by examples, you also claim that among belief systems yours cannot have any violent traits or acts in general, except certain situations, right? And if he does give examples then what will you do? Start to evaluate it case by case by other factors or say that that's not true hinduism but just perverted understanding of it? Does that sound familiar from somewhere?

The majority of muslims and christians and jews are not violent. They are strongly against violence, they are simple people trying to make their way and scared that something will happen to their family and love ones. They believe that what has been going on with their religion, what is being promoted as their religion is just perverted by emperialism, modern political games played in countless levels. Exactly like people in your culture.

You keep saying you are an atheist, but you are defending a religion -or series of religions- by claiming that their inherent qualities hold some truth or essence -different than others- that people don't know about it if they don't see it that way and that those qualities distinguish these belief systems from others. You are saying that your religion -yes your religion- is something that has a fixed essence; an understanding free and from that but changed in 'practice' or some other ways under the attack of a certain other culture.

That's^ the definition of a believer and a religion. You see your system as entitled a place above others. Isn't that something also fundemantlly conflicts with what those belief systems offer?

See, as long as a system is a religion, it stops being universal just there.

It seems to me like you are confused about two things. First, the set of conditions and factors -inner/outer- that transforms a society and its culture; its religion through time AND that the religions are just primitive control systems invented by men to impose on to societies by a minority in power according to certain benefits and profits -be it in favour of people or not, irrelevant at this point, but mostly not- so the wheel can turn, therefore they change through time. These are the same things. It's not just about what happens to a society while that is a factor, it is about the fundamental quality of religion.

 :exclaim: The belief systems you are defending are likely to include violent groups as much as the others, because their members are homo sapient. We are violent, social primates.  You see yours different; above the others -like all others- because you believe in it. And in your case, definition in contrast plays a lot of role as I said before and makes it easier.

 :exclaim: It's basically what Western cultures do to define all the other cultures, including yours. Creating a definition in contrast and transform the same problems of their societies with different terms than the ones less developed ones into something else; create identities. Like identifying certain crimes -like rape and domestic violence- with islamic or other eastern cultures. Demonising the other.

You are identifiying the cultural and religious corruption with British Imperialism. Is it a factor? Certainly. But it doesn't change that all belief systems inherently define themselves and their members above others. That's the root of the idea. Doesn't matter how 'peaceful' one looks compared ot others.

If Abrahamic religions vanished from face of the earth over a night, the religions left behind would fill the same space transforming and adapting to the same machine in a very short time. And after a few generations, it would be fully functional in the same violent manner as those and people would be discussing the terms of killing someone according to Hinduism with the same terms, genuinely thinking how peaceful and accepting their religions are. 









« Last Edit: August 23, 2015, 08:06:38 AM by drunkenshoe »

Offline Aupmanyav

Re: Hindu's Hate me on Tumblr
« Reply #32 on: August 23, 2015, 09:47:07 AM »
The majority of Muslims and Christians and Jews are not violent. They are strongly against violence, ..
You keep saying you are an atheist, but you are defending a religion ..
You are saying that your religion - yes your religion- is something that has a fixed essence; an understanding free and from that but changed in 'practice' or some other ways under the attack of a certain other culture. ..
the religions are just primitive control systems invented by men to impose on to societies by a minority in power..
The belief systems you are defending are likely to include violent groups as much as the others ..
the ones less developed ones into something else ..
Where are you from Kepler-63? Please do not make statements which make people laugh.
Kindly understand that although I am an atheist, but I remain a Hindu. The philosophy of Advaita (non-duality) does not allow a God, because then it makes two things - God and the denizens of the world. Advaita includes even the non-living things.
Foreign domination for 1000 years has changed the culture of all people in the world. Yes, Hinduism is facing the onslaught of Western culture, but we know through history that it will survive it. Hinduism is a very tenacious religion.
In that case I would say that your understanding of religion is very deficient. Religion is a protector of society, a doctor to its adherents, and is a scientific researcher a step ahead of science. Do you know that 3,000 years ago, the Nasadiya hymn in RigVeda declared that there is a relationship between existence and non-existence? Science came to that stage only in the last Century.
We do not have any violent groups. That is why adherents of other religions who came to India have never faced any problem. We did not even ask them to adopt our ways*. They were given all freedom.
That is a very imperialistic statement. What is that which the developed countries have and India or China do not have. Indian business administrators and technocrats are slowly taking over the highest positions in the corporate world. Our economies are doing the best in the world and we have a nice balance of foreign exchange (USD 354 billion to be exact. Of course, at the moment India cannot compare with China, but the predictions are that by 2050, it will overtake the US economy and be the second largest economy in the world after China).

* The exception is in case of Zoroastrians. The Gujarat king where they landed gave all freedom but placed two conditions. 1. That they will adopt Gujarati language. 2. There women will wear 'saris'. :D
The Zoroastrians accepted the conditions and have lived happily for 1,400 years and in the process becoming some of the richest people in India including the House of Tatas.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2015, 11:25:58 AM by Aupmanyav »
"Brahma Satyam Jagan-mithya" (Brahman is the truth, the observed is an illusion)
"Sarve Khalu Idam Brahma" (All this here is Brahman)

Offline Baruch

Re: Hindu's Hate me on Tumblr
« Reply #33 on: August 23, 2015, 10:15:15 AM »
It is a simple metaphysical question ... potentiality vs actuality.  And if there is a human nature.  If there is a human nature, then it is part of potentiality, since at any given time, a given human isn't violent.  But every human is capable of violence under certain external/internal conditions.  That is where I would leave it ... except I keep dumping all my sins and every other person's sins, into the human nature bucket (this is Biblical, from Genesis).  Biblical verses also praise human nature.  I could divide it along the lines of a being with rather low EQ, who has a relatively high IQ.

But there are those who deny any kind of metaphysics (they are ignoring parts of the dictionary that use metaphysical words to define some generalities that they do claim to use).  But one can start one's verbal axioms at a different place.  And some will deny potentiality (as only what is actual is factual) ... and for that same reason of "factuality" will deny that there is a human nature, because they regard that as an illegitimate generalization ... that there are only individuals, and that no two people share any characteristics that are ... factual.  That similarities are apparent only.

Maybe cocktail parties at philosophy conventions are dull, because nobody says anything, because they can't agree on a common basis for thought, language or conversation ;-)
שלום

Offline Mermaid

Re: Hindu's Hate me on Tumblr
« Reply #34 on: August 23, 2015, 10:15:32 AM »
I thought Hindu worshipers were meant to be peaceful meditators, not tumblr feminazis. 
"feminazi". There's that word again.
We are tied to the ocean. And when we go back to the sea, whether it is to sail or to watch - we are going back from whence we came.

John F. Kennedy

Offline Mermaid

Re: Hindu's Hate me on Tumblr
« Reply #35 on: August 23, 2015, 10:17:25 AM »
So on my personal tumblr blog, I made a post about 3 months ago that said "the Hindu Religion is Bullshit, but man are their gods Trippy" and I still to this day get anonymous messages sent to me from people that I assume are Hindu saying that I'm a piece of shit, and that they want to kill me, ect...  At first I was surprised that this was coming from the hindu's because typically this is the type of thing that I would expect Muslims to do.  So my question to you all is have you ever been harassed by Hindu's for being an atheist/insulting the Hindu religion?
It sounds like you are harassing, and they are harassing back. Their calling you a piece of shit is no more disrespectful than you posting about  how their beliefs are bullshit when you know they are your audience. In this case, you reap what you sow, death threats aside.
We are tied to the ocean. And when we go back to the sea, whether it is to sail or to watch - we are going back from whence we came.

John F. Kennedy

Offline Baruch

Re: Hindu's Hate me on Tumblr
« Reply #36 on: August 23, 2015, 10:18:29 AM »
"feminazi" is unfair ... most women are "femicommies".  Fortunately like most males, I am OK with fraternizing with the "enemy" ;-)
שלום

Offline Mermaid

Re: Hindu's Hate me on Tumblr
« Reply #37 on: August 23, 2015, 10:20:13 AM »
"feminazi" is unfair ... most women are "femicommies".  Fortunately like most males, I am OK with fraternizing with the "enemy" ;-)
I guess I fail to see the intended humor in that.
We are tied to the ocean. And when we go back to the sea, whether it is to sail or to watch - we are going back from whence we came.

John F. Kennedy

Offline Baruch

Re: Hindu's Hate me on Tumblr
« Reply #38 on: August 23, 2015, 10:26:43 AM »
My apologies then (fraternizing).
שלום

Re: Hindu's Hate me on Tumblr
« Reply #39 on: August 23, 2015, 10:28:52 AM »
Where are you from Kepler-63? Please do not make statements which make people laugh.
Kindly understand that although I am an atheist, but I remain a Hindu. The philosophy of Advaita (non-duality) does not allow a God, because then it makes two things - God and the denizens of the world. Advaita includes even the non-living things.
Foreign domination for 1000 years has changed the culture of all people in the world. Yes, Hinduism is facing the onslaught of Western culture, but we know through history that it will survive it. Hinduism is a very tenacious religion.
In that case I would say that your understanding of religion is very deficient. Religion is a protector of society, a doctor to its adherents, and is a scientific researcher a step ahead of science. Do you know that 3,000 years ago, the Nasadiya hymn in RigVeda declared that there is a relationship between existence and non-existence? Science came to that stage only in the last Century.
We do not have any violent groups. That is why adherents of other religions who came to India have never faced any problem. We did not even ask them to adopt our ways. They were given all freedom.
That is a very imperialistic statement. What is that which the developed countries have and India or China do not have. Indian business administrators and technocrats are slowly taking over the highest positions in the corporate world. Our economies are doing the best in the world and we have a nice balance of foreign exchange (USD 354 billion to be exact. Of course, at the moment India cannot compare with China, but the predictions are that by 2050, it will overtake the US economy and be the second largest economy in the world after China).

Obviously, you didn't get anything I wrote beause you are still doing the same thing. You are defining your belief system as something completely different than others and defend that it can explain universe. You might as well be a muslim comparing Allah to Christian god and say that your holly book/religion actually includes scientific progress if you can interpret it 'correctly'.

You don't understand what science or religion is. Anyway, it is a waste of time.




















 

Offline Mermaid

Re: Hindu's Hate me on Tumblr
« Reply #40 on: August 23, 2015, 10:32:23 AM »
My apologies then (fraternizing).
You don't need to apologize to me.
We are tied to the ocean. And when we go back to the sea, whether it is to sail or to watch - we are going back from whence we came.

John F. Kennedy

Offline Aupmanyav

Re: Hindu's Hate me on Tumblr
« Reply #41 on: August 23, 2015, 11:18:17 AM »
You are defining your belief system as something completely different than others and defend that it can explain universe. .. You don't understand what science or religion is. Anyway, it is a waste of time.
Yes, Drunkenshoe. Advaita is different, and especially with my modification (we are allowed to do so in Hinduism). No God, no soul, no heaven, no hell, no karma transferring over non-existent future lives, no birth, no death, even no creation, and complete acceptance with the latest in science. Since you do not want discuss it any further, I will also stop.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2015, 11:30:11 AM by Aupmanyav »
"Brahma Satyam Jagan-mithya" (Brahman is the truth, the observed is an illusion)
"Sarve Khalu Idam Brahma" (All this here is Brahman)

Offline peacewithoutgod

Re: Hindu's Hate me on Tumblr
« Reply #42 on: August 23, 2015, 12:07:26 PM »
"feminazi" is unfair ... most women are "femicommies".  Fortunately like most males, I am OK with fraternizing with the "enemy" ;-)
Are they really? And I thought they were "lesbolorenabobbits" ;-0
There are two types of ideas: fact and non-fact. Ideas which are not falsifiable are non-fact, therefore please don't insist your fantasies of supernatural beings are in any way factual.

Doctrine = not to be questioned = not to be proven = not fact. When you declare your doctrine fact, you lie.

Offline Baruch

Re: Hindu's Hate me on Tumblr
« Reply #43 on: August 23, 2015, 12:31:23 PM »
Using a Hindu analogy, to apply to this whole section ...

Devas are benevolent gods.  Asuras are anti-Deva-gods.  Astika vs Nastika.  This was clearly re-used in Babylon 5.  If I were Hindu, I would see opposing religions as being of the Asuras ... but atheists (and ancient India had the Lokayatas) would be Asuras who are in denial of their own divinity ;-)

Like I mentioned, I find the POV of Hinduism to be very useful to unravel conundrums.  A Swiss Army Knife of theology.
שלום

Offline Aupmanyav

Re: Hindu's Hate me on Tumblr
« Reply #44 on: August 23, 2015, 01:15:10 PM »
No, I shit every morning. Do devas/Gods do that? I am under no illusion. Yes, many see this as 'asuri prakriti'.:D
You see, Baaruch, I am guided by Kalama Sutta, so no hocus-pocus.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2015, 01:17:43 PM by Aupmanyav »
"Brahma Satyam Jagan-mithya" (Brahman is the truth, the observed is an illusion)
"Sarve Khalu Idam Brahma" (All this here is Brahman)