the hated abortion discussion.

[AllPurposeAtheist]

Here's the argument I've heard time and time again from people from their ivory towers and self righteousness, poor people shouldn't be allowed to breed. Bottom line as if to imply that people with money and nice jobs are the ONLY people capable of raising children and poor people are mere burdens on everyone else completely ignoring the fact that millions upon millions, indeed the vast majority of humans who have ever existed on this shitty rock of a planet have been poor and that trend isn't going to reverse now or any time in the future...ever.
Now if you agree poor people oughtn't breed then you could be considered part of the gentrified bourgeois in which case Marx has a nice lesson on frim where your wealth is derived .

The worker becomes all the poorer the more wealth he produces, the more his production increases in power and range. The worker becomes an ever cheaper commodity the more commodities he creates. With the increasing value of the world of things proceeds in direct proportion to the devaluation of the world of men. Labour produces not only commodities; it produces itself and the worker as a commodity -- and does so in the proportion in which it produces commodities generally.

If you want poor people to stop breeding then denounce your wealth, give it to poor people so they're not poor anymore.
Oh wait..it's about you and your self righteous beliefs.. My mistake.

[stromboli]

Why come so many pro-lifers lose interest once the kid has been born?

That single thought very nicely points out how stupid the argument is. If you diminish or remove the ability for women to receive birth control, make "personhood" laws that make women criminally liable for a miscarriage, get rid of abortion, the only remaining alternative is a bunch of welfare raised children nobody really wants that are nothing but a burden on society.

Oh, wait- I just described Mississippi. 

[AllPurposeAtheist]

A lot of poor people own cats.. They don't care if the cat drags it away and eats it once born..  After all.. Cats are people too..

[Green Bottle]

If a woman decides she wants an abortion then everybody else should respect her decision end of fkn story, cos its her  body and her decision.

[aitm]

yeah well I am still not convinced at the heart, it is a simple racial issue in that old white men don't give a fuck about kids of "color". Whitey is losing his place as the majority, gotta stop the white gal from abortin the next Duke.

[AllPurposeAtheist]

yeah well I am still not convinced at the heart, it is a simple racial issue in that old white men don't give a fuck about kids of "color". Whitey is losing his place as the majority, gotta stop the white gal from abortin the next Duke.

Basically based on Marx to keep creating poor workers to keep the proletariat busy creating wealth for the bourgeois.. See? They're really Marxists at heart..

[Gawdzilla Sama]

Is this supposed to be "the heated abortion discussion"?

[AllPurposeAtheist]

Is this supposed to be "the heated abortion discussion"?

It's just my way of turning the pro lifers into fucking commies..

[doorknob]

:)

I don't believe I ever stated my personal view on whether abortion should be legal. And I never will.

I simply stated a scientific fact. I like to see every ones thought processes on the matter.

I've also seen a great deal of strawmen tonight btw. I also see a lot of assumptions being made.

I realize every thing is not black and white and no issue ever is. I just thought it might be backwards that people will protect a guilty adult yet easily excuse and justify killing an innocent life. A life whether it's sentient, resembles a human and every other excuse.

Now that may sound pro life to you and I could see how people would make that assumption but honestly I just like to call a duck a duck.   
scientifically an embryo is apart of the human life cycle. It is a human scientifically. now you can call it a tumor or a parasite but it is still human. I think admitting that abortion is terminating a human life is just being honest about it! As if admitting that would some how stop abortions from being legal. Or even make it obvious as to whether it is right or wrong. But back to that black and white issue different people have different values on life. Some don't value life at all. Some value an embryo some value a criminal. Some people don't care one way or another. Who is right or wrong is subjective, and it can also be situational.

I just wanted to see if a single person could be honest with them selves about it. Or what your version of honesty is.

[Hijiri Byakuren]

Don't talk about strawmen when you're intentionally twisting the issue. Regardless of whether the embryonic stage is part of the human life cycle, the fact of the matter is that it is not a sentient life form, and my moral code does not extend to them as such. That means cats, dogs, etc. Any animal that obviously thinks and feels (and is not otherwise needed for food purposes) is something whose life I will put time and effort into defending long before I give so much as one singular shit about an embryo.

[Shiranu]

I just wanted to see if a single person could be honest with them selves about it. Or what your version of honesty is.

I am; it is, at it's bluntest and most basic definition, a non-sentient parasite. Just because you can't accept that doesn't mean I'm not honest to myself about it.

[doorknob]

neither of those is a blunt or basic definition. Non sentient is not in the definition of embryo. Neither is parasite. Those are terms coined by pro lifers to comfort the women having abortions and they are not based on science.

Also that does not refute what I said. Those are excuses.

by the way some biologists have said that a fetus is symbiotic not parasitic.

[Hijiri Byakuren]

Non sentient is not in the definition of embryo.

I never said it was, you dunce. Nevertheless, they are non-sentient, and don't fall into my moral compass as such.

Also that does not refute what I said.

Refute what? You've offered no argument. You aren't even a participant in this discussion. You're just sitting there insulting people for having an informed opinion.

[Gawdzilla Sama]

It's just my way of turning the pro lifers into fucking commies..

Very well, carry on.

[Nam]

:)

I don't believe I ever stated my personal view on whether abortion should be legal. And I never will.

I simply stated a scientific fact. I like to see every ones thought processes on the matter.

I've also seen a great deal of strawmen tonight btw. I also see a lot of assumptions being made.

I realize every thing is not black and white and no issue ever is. I just thought it might be backwards that people will protect a guilty adult yet easily excuse and justify killing an innocent life. A life whether it's sentient, resembles a human and every other excuse.

Bolded: not scientific. You're not even coming from a scientific position first, you're coming from an emotional one and trying to use science to justify your emotions about the subject.

-Nam