why are liberal places so expensive?

[rock]

It isn't so much that liberal places are expensive as much as it is that places which are now expensive have become liberal. Since I think the 80's or so conservatives have been on the move out of cities and liberals on the move into cities. It's got a lot to do with people moving to places that represent them better rather then being practical and living close to work.

Besides you could just move to Detroit, not exactly a conservative haven right? And it's cheep too! : p


It has little to do with politics and much much more to do with simple supply and demand.(and then all the extra modified baggage that affects it)



PS: IMO if your looking for a good liberalish place to live with some decent prices here and there, look somewhere between Olympia,WA and Portland, OR. Our conservatives are practically liberals who like to hunt and fish.

[hillbillyatheist]

There's places in norman for under 400 bucks a month. and its safer and nicer than where I am now, paying 850 dollars a month.  not to mention, transit is 10 bucks a month for the disabled, and here its 60. guitar lessons 90 bucks a month, compared to up here more like 200 a month, Then you factor in other stuff like groceries and electric and cable, all of which are cheaper, and financially its a no brainer. on the bright side even if its a red state There's an active atheist group there for me to join. So I can find some like minded people to hang with.

[hillbillyatheist]

IMO if your looking for a good liberalish place to live with some decent prices here and there, look somewhere between Olympia,WA and Portland, OR. Our conservatives are practically liberals who like to hunt and fish.

any town in particular?

[zarus tathra]

Because rural areas are taxed to subsidize urban development, and subsidies increase prices. They're only "liberal" because they're afraid of pissing off the poor minorities who tend to flock to cities and who they rely on to serve as manual labor.

Also, because materialism is a left-wing idea.

[billhilly]

we have something like that here called section 8.

the problem is similar. ridiculously long wait lists and also the places covered by section 8 tend to be dilapidated crime infested roach motels.

funny enough you can get a nice place at reasonable costs in conservative areas, not dumps.

I know. where I lived in Ada OK, I had a decent two bedroom home. no roaches, no gangs and everything worked (dishwasher, gas, water, etc. and it was $350 a month. of course pretty much everybody but me was a holy roller and staunch republican.

been doing some googling and if I go back I think it'll be to Norman, OK, cheap living, has basic transit, is a college town, (OU) has an arts community, less insane than other parts of the state, and if I could land even a part time job there combined with my disability I'd be living quite comfortably. I could work on paying back my student loans and resume my music education at the same time. so it won't be all bad.

as much as I like Denver I can't sustain the costs much longer. I'm going in debt as it is. I'd be living in a backward ass state but at least I'd be better off financially, get back on my feet and resume my music education.  Oklahoma has one of, if not the lowest cost of living in the US.

Wow, Ada.  I'm from Ada.  When did you live there?

[mykcob4]

mykcob4 wrote in part:

Bullshit! Liberals don't see themselves as elite. That is utter nonsense. The only people helping the poor are Liberals. It certainly isn't the repukes the liberterians or the tea partiers! Fuck corrupt corporations! Not all corporations are bad BTW only the corrupt ones!

Thanks for making my point for me about how "liberals" see themselves as being the elite.

I watched a video espousing communism which suggested we go to a 32 hour work week and for work people would shuffle pretty much worthless paperwork around in an office.  Those working on farms or doing construction work from "can't see to can't see,"  see communism as a bunch of lazy fuckers not doing any real work.  Which the video I watched supported this notion.  So naturally, people working hard physical jobs reject the idea that others can just play in an office a few hours a week, while they work their butts off supporting the bastards, will reject "liberalism."  They don't need to know anything more about "liberalism" other than it is like communism.  

Personally, I reject the whole conservative and liberal name tags as being realistically valid.  Seems to me that most people vote for politicians the same way they voted for their homecoming King and Queen.  Pure popularity contest, with both sides talking bullshit and mudslinging at the other side.  With the sides being decided by the popularity of a few stated ideals, which catch on with the most people.  Then its' ride the bandwagon with the most people on it, for most voters.

I didn't make your point at all, quite the opposite. I do agree with you about how people vote. For the most part people are uninformed voters because they don't want to be informed. As for Liberalism being like communism that is just absurd. I don't know about the video that you watched as I haven't seen it nor do I know of it's credibility. Seems like a propaganda piece to me.
I think your views are a wee bit cynical. It's easy to claim that all politicians are alike etc...! The fact is that there are very different ideals which lead to political differences.

[zarus tathra]

I think we should worry less about "evenly dividing the wealth" and more about "evenly dividing the work." We should also get rid of all the make-work bullshit, we'd seriously work like 5 hours a week if we got rid of all of it.

[LikelyToBreak]

I'm on disability and I considered moving to another state.  One of the states I considered was Oklahoma.  Have a friend in Anadarko.  Norman sounds nice.  But, my wife doesn't want to leave her friends here, so guess I'm stuck here.  

mykcob4 wrote:

I didn't make your point at all, quite the opposite. I do agree with you about how people vote. For the most part people are uninformed voters because they don't want to be informed. As for Liberalism being like communism that is just absurd. I don't know about the video that you watched as I haven't seen it nor do I know of it's credibility. Seems like a propaganda piece to me.
I think your views are a wee bit cynical. It's easy to claim that all politicians are alike etc...! The fact is that there are very different ideals which lead to political differences.

Afraid I have to disagree.  You made the point that liberals think of themselves as being "elite" by saying that only liberals help the poor.  Even the Republicans will point at programs which they got started as being beneficial for the poor, so saying only liberals help the poor is an elitist attitude.  

The "right" equate liberalism with communism.   Not me.  As I said I don't like the name tags of conservative and liberal.  Too simplistic to be of any real use.  

The video I watched was a communist propaganda piece.  I try to go out of my way to learn how others think about things, especially those with views very different from mine.  Which is why I watched it.  

I am cynical.  And mykcob4 is right in that I see most politicians as being pretty much alike.  The rhetoric is different, but when it comes to a vote, they mostly all vote for the monied interest's.  

At least we do agree that the vast majority of voters are grossly uninformed.  :-D

[Jmpty]

I think we should worry less about "evenly dividing the wealth" and more about "evenly dividing the work." We should also get rid of all the make-work bullshit, we'd seriously work like 5 hours a week if we got rid of all of it.

I don't know what you do for a living, but maybe you should try something else.

[hillbillyatheist]

Wow, Ada.  I'm from Ada.  When did you live there?

a fellow okie! how about that!  :-D
 
If you know where the walmart super center is, the one out by Lonnie Abbott Blvd and Country Club rd, well there's a trailer park just north of there. thats where I lived.

[billhilly]

They've moved the damned wally world a couple of times.  It used to be across from the fairgrounds and now it's out north of town.  I've only been back a couple times to visit since 88.  Seems like it went to hell for a while then the Indians bought most of it after they got gambling.  Anyway, GO Cougars!

[mykcob4]

I'm on disability and I considered moving to another state.  One of the states I considered was Oklahoma.  Have a friend in Anadarko.  Norman sounds nice.  But, my wife doesn't want to leave her friends here, so guess I'm stuck here.  

mykcob4 wrote:

I didn't make your point at all, quite the opposite. I do agree with you about how people vote. For the most part people are uninformed voters because they don't want to be informed. As for Liberalism being like communism that is just absurd. I don't know about the video that you watched as I haven't seen it nor do I know of it's credibility. Seems like a propaganda piece to me.
I think your views are a wee bit cynical. It's easy to claim that all politicians are alike etc...! The fact is that there are very different ideals which lead to political differences.

Afraid I have to disagree.  You made the point that liberals think of themselves as being "elite" by saying that only liberals help the poor.  Even the Republicans will point at programs which they got started as being beneficial for the poor, so saying only liberals help the poor is an elitist attitude.  

The "right" equate liberalism with communism.   Not me.  As I said I don't like the name tags of conservative and liberal.  Too simplistic to be of any real use.  

The video I watched was a communist propaganda piece.  I try to go out of my way to learn how others think about things, especially those with views very different from mine.  Which is why I watched it.  

I am cynical.  And mykcob4 is right in that I see most politicians as being pretty much alike.  The rhetoric is different, but when it comes to a vote, they mostly all vote for the monied interest's.  

At least we do agree that the vast majority of voters are grossly uninformed.  :-D

Oh for crying out loud. The fact is that realizing that Liberals help the poor and the conservatives don't is just a fact. It's not being elitist. Conservatives give to religious organizations that serve to peer pressure their congregations to vote conservative and to be brainwashed in to rascist prejudice religious thinking.
As far as all politicians vote for monied interest that is not true. Voting for Medicare/Medicaid, for Social Security, for Afordable Medical Act, for community college, for PBS & NPR, for WICK and school lunch programs, for banking regulations and the EPA, all are Liberal ideas made law by Liberal politicians that cared for doing the right thing and not for the monied few!

[LikelyToBreak]

mykcob4 wrote:

Oh for crying out loud. The fact is that realizing that Liberals help the poor and the conservatives don't is just a fact. It's not being elitist. Conservatives give to religious organizations that serve to peer pressure their congregations to vote conservative and to be brainwashed in to rascist prejudice religious thinking.
As far as all politicians vote for monied interest that is not true. Voting for Medicare/Medicaid, for Social Security, for Afordable Medical Act, for community college, for PBS & NPR, for WICK and school lunch programs, for banking regulations and the EPA, all are Liberal ideas made law by Liberal politicians that cared for doing the right thing and not for the monied few!

Sounds like mykcob4 thinks in black or white.  And no, I'm not talking race.  I'm referring to politics which is exactly what he accuses conservatives of doing.  Or so it seems to me.

There were 16 Reps in the Senate who voted for Medicare and 6 Dems who voted against it.  It was not passed strictly along party lines, many Reps voted for it too.  It was the Reps who helped LBJ get the Civil Rights Act passed.  Yes, there have been many social programs pushed through be liberals, but often conservatives helped them do it.  It is not strictly a right and wrong on either side.

Often the devil is in the details.  Like the UnAffordable Healthcare Act.  Which is in reality a give away to the insurance companies.  Like the Patriot Act, it just has a nice sounding name.  

The elitist attitude, displayed by many "liberals" drives many people away from liberal organizations.  People don't like being talked down to.  Which is what most liberals do to anyone who dares to disagree with them.  Being trailer park scum, makes me want to vote for someone who at least doesn't shove that fact into my face.

[PopeyesPappy]

You say that like libratards are immune to condescending attitudes concerning their utopian market economy bullshit.

[Aroura33]

if I can find a place that is safe, low cost, and liberal, I'll be quite hapy. it could simply be that rural areas for whatever reason are more conservative and urban areas more liberal, and simply due to population, the urban areas are more expensive. so it could be two different things (liberalism and price) unrelated to each other, but both of which relate to population. (kind of like how ice cream eating and murders both go up in the summer but aren't related to each other but both relate to the heat)

I think you answered your own question right here.

In the heart of Portland Oregon, for instance, it costs more to live than say out in the valley, south of Portland.  That area is more rural, but also happens to remain fairly liberal, yet the prices are much lower than in the city or suburbs of Portland itself.  The same thing happens around Seattle and New York.
Rural communities do tend to be more conservative, but even the liberal ones are less expensive to live in.

I think a lot of it has to do with tolerance.  Liberals can tolerate being around lots of people from many lifestyles and ethnicities much easier than conservatives (this is a huge generilazion I know, but it does tend to be true).  So Liberals tend to gather in cities, and those who only want to be with their own "kind" tend to stay in those small towns.  And they don't like them no outsiders neither.

When all your goods and services are close, prices go up, space becomes more precious.  When there are 50 acres between you and your neighbor, land prices are lower, there is more room for more people.  So that part really is simple economics.