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NRA's enemies list.

Started by Brian37, February 14, 2013, 10:39:53 AM

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buttfinger

I couldn't care less if a person hunts for sport, so long as they are responsible.  Sport hunting targets the old and weak in a herd, making the herd stronger over all.

Mathias

Quote from: "buttfinger"I couldn't care less if a person hunts for sport, so long as they are responsible.  Sport hunting targets the old and weak in a herd, making the herd stronger over all.


And I thought that I was in the third world because here the flock eats feed, fattening, take antibiotics and anabolics, then is slaughtered. As for wild animals, most do not live in flocks and those living are endangered by lack of food and space, ie, there is need to strengthen the herd, unless you live in the nineteenth century.
Hunting for sport is so primitive as to make war spoils.
"There is no logic in the existence of any god".
Myself.

buttfinger

You clearly know nothing of the most popular game.  Deer, Elk, moose, etc. DO travel in herds.  Trophies from these animals become desirable when the animal is greatly aged and often sick.  As for your arguments against strengtherning the herd: farming is the very reason that wild species are dwindling.  When we allow them to get weak and sick, they will become extinct, leaving us with ONLY farmed animals who have been genetically modified, pumped full of steroids, and confined in small spaces that increase their body fat and decrease their nutritional value.  We have seemingly tamed nature, but we're really just damaged it and removed ourselves from the sight of our own irresponsibility.  The further down that route that we go, the more we endanger our brother species, which in turn endangers our own.

Mathias

buttfinger,

I agree with the second part of your arguments. Regarding the first, the animals do not need the man for kill old and/or sick animals. because there are several younger males, predators and nature disasters that do that. Instead using rifles and traps, cravenly appealing to the best instrument for adaptation in this planet, the intelligence.
Taking off the cultural part that perseveres in the habit of hunting, I still think an involuted act. Anyone "infected" by civilization should have aversion to hunt for fun.
"There is no logic in the existence of any god".
Myself.

TrueStory

Quote from: "Plu"Sport would be a man with a spear taking on a bear or a tiger. I'd pay to watch that game.

Sounds like the NRA is acting par for the course. Lets hope it opens some eyes.

1 person with a spear in the jungles of Laos against a tiger, seems like a fair playing field.
Please don't take anything I say seriously.

buttfinger

Mot people infected by civilization have an aversion to eating food that doesn't come neatly wrapped in plastic.  There is a disconnect between us and the "tooth-and-claw" reality of nature.  While I personally don't engage in sport hunting, I DO insist that my children see the reality of where food comes from  and i DO support people coming in contact with this primal part of nature, as those who don't often find an outlet for that part of their mind in serial killing and the like.  That's not to argue "lack of hunting makes you a serial killer", just that people with physical and mental pathologies can find an outlet that is more savory for our species.

Mathias

TrueStory,

The need to go to Laos to kill a tiger is as fanatical as that of a  Jeova witness go preach in the house of the other.
"There is no logic in the existence of any god".
Myself.

TrueStory

Quote from: "Mathias"TrueStory,

The need to go to Laos to kill a tiger is as fanatical as that of a  Jeova witness go preach in the house of the other.
the fuck are you talking about?
Please don't take anything I say seriously.

buttfinger

The need to go to Laos to kill a tiger is not indicative of responsible hunting.  Very rarely is anything but the pelt harvested.  But E disagree about the level of fanaticism involved.  Hunters, even unscrupulous ones, don't shun education and they certainly don't meet 5 times a week to discuss how to be more effective at it, nor do they do it daily and record the amount of time spent doing it, turn in these time records and use it as a basis for looking down on others who don't hunt enough.  Hunters also don't excommunicate people for hunting differently than they do.

SGOS

I think we should be somewhat cautious when suggesting sport hunting  is strongly linked to the NRA (if in fact that is what is being done here).  Most hunters, at least the one's I know, aren't even members of the NRA.  That the NRA might claim a strong kinship with hunters is mostly NRA spin, as far as I can tell.  The NRA is about gun control.  Hunting is about another issue, vile as it may seem to some people.  But sport hunting it is not about gun control, just as gun control is not about taking away hunting rifles.  The NRA and hunting are not the same thing.

stromboli

Quote from: "buttfinger"I couldn't care less if a person hunts for sport, so long as they are responsible.  Sport hunting targets the old and weak in a herd, making the herd stronger over all.

Thank you for some sanity.
Hunting is something I've done a fair amount of. Responsible hunting done properly, with game surveys and studies that select how many and what type of game to be hunted in a given area, protects the species by keeping herd sizes optimum and minimizing winter starvation and other factors. We refer to it as game conservation, which is what it actually is.

People are against trophy hunting, but there are good reasons for it. By selecting regions where trophy game are most likely to be found and limiting the number of permits allowed, only serious-i.e. more qualified- hunters get the opportunity. A typical buck deer can impregnate multiple does. One buck or two bucks in a herd does not substantially harm the viability of the herd, and actually helps to control numbers.

Game hunters typically take game opportunistically; the weak and less able. Dry does-non-weaning, meaning too old to produce offspring- can be culled from the herd, which also a good thing. Winter kill is based on numbers- too many in a herd over grazes a given area, in sparse conditions, causing die off. Limiting numbers by hunting eases the burden on the herd and allows for enough forage for the whole group.

All that said, the present NRA has little or nothing to do with that. Groups like Ducks Unlimited do more to aid and benefit the waterfowl picture than the NRA ever did. Most or all of the improvement of the wetlands during the 70's and 80's was promoted by Ducks Unlimited. It was hunters that did the actual work and spent the money to protect their sport. The NRA now is nothing but a shill for manufacturers and wacko fringe members like Ted Nugent.

buttfinger

Quote from: "SGOS"But sport hunting it is not about gun control, just as gun control is not about taking away hunting rifles.  The NRA and hunting are not the same thing.
Sure it is.  A .223 is a legitimate hunting rifle, despite protests from Piers Morgan, et. al.  When they take away small caliber rifles and mass shootings stop being 3 small bullets in one victim and start being one large bullet through 3 victims, what are they going to ban next?  In fact, every criterion for something being an "assault rifle" (I use the quotation marks because an actual assault rifle needs to be fully automatic or bust-fire, and are already illegal) is cosmetic.

buttfinger

Quote from: "stromboli"The NRA now is nothing but a shill for manufacturers and wacko fringe members like Ted Nugent.
Also the NRA has long been a lobby for a very specialized group of people.  It unreasonably and unscrupulously allows members who have no business being on the trigger end of the gun to be members, and it unreasonably argues for NO restrictions on guns, all for the sake of making a buck.

Mathias

Quote from: "buttfinger"Mot people infected by civilization have an aversion to eating food that doesn't come neatly wrapped in plastic.  There is a disconnect between us and the "tooth-and-claw" reality of nature.  While I personally don't engage in sport hunting, I DO insist that my children see the reality of where food comes from  and i DO support people coming in contact with this primal part of nature, as those who don't often find an outlet for that part of their mind in serial killing and the like.  That's not to argue "lack of hunting makes you a serial killer", just that people with physical and mental pathologies can find an outlet that is more savory for our species.


And you said nothing that justifies killing an animal for sport or worse, have a feeling of exhilaration when hunting prey. Unless you live in an environment that hunting is essential for survival. Not because the technology is a corrupted power that we must become wild again.
"There is no logic in the existence of any god".
Myself.

Mathias

Quote from: "TrueStory"
Quote from: "Mathias"TrueStory,

The need to go to Laos to kill a tiger is as fanatical as that of a  Jeova witness go preach in the house of the other.
the fuck are you talking about?


A person who feels the need to confront a tiger with a rifle is as primitive as the fundamentalist followers of the god of the bible.
"There is no logic in the existence of any god".
Myself.