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Pres. Obama - Pros and Cons

Started by Smartmarzipan, September 25, 2013, 02:13:20 PM

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AllPurposeAtheist

Look folks.. The financial elite pay no homage to us. Parties matter not because both are paid in full so it boils down to which throws us the most crumbs. I get more crumbs from the left so I root for the biggest crumb thrower..
All hail my new signature!

Admit it. You're secretly green with envy.

Johan

Quote from: "LikelyToBreak"On a side note, Johan what industry do you work in?  Because I know a lot of people who would like to get employed into something with a future.  Seriously, I am not joking or trying to make a point.  It would be great if I could point someone in the right direction.
I work in the trucking industry. Pretty much every trucking company I know is hiring. That's because lots of those companies treat their employees poorly and pay crap rates. But a crappy low paying job is still better than no job in my book. I should note that I mentioned several other businesses near my office also have hiring signs out front. None of them are trucking companies. Most are manufacturing of some sort. Some are looking for unskilled labor, others are looking for skilled labor. Welders is something I see companies looking for on their hiring signs a lot in this area. There are also other openings and there are openings in sectors that not related to manufacturing.

I don't deny that unemployment is high. But I also stand by my assertion that anyone who claims there are no jobs out there either isn't looking hard enough or being open minded enough.

I should also mention that trucking was never a goal of mine. I got into it only because I became disenchanted with aviation and didn't want to fly anymore. So I needed to find something else to do and when I opened the paper, there were lots of ads for trucking jobs. I did a six week CDL program at a driving school and had a job offer in hand before I had the license. I should probably also mention that I first got into trucking about 9 years ago, did it for a year and then got into computer repair. After moving to the midwest right when ipads and tablets started taking away a huge chunk of the PC repair market, I got back into trucking. IOW I got over the whole 'I'm only going to work in my dream career field' thing and now I go where the jobs are and where the money is.  

QuoteThe rest of the Johan's argument is just attacking a straw man.  I have never said Obama is the worse the president we have ever had.  I don't complain about the price of gas going up, and if it did I would have to have a reason to peg the blame on Obama or any other president.  And I don't hate Obama.
I didn't mean to suggest that you hated Obama nor did I suggest that you were complaining about gas prices.

QuoteI do find it annoying that Obama promised things which I knew he could not deliver when he was running for president, and now he is not being held to task for not delivering.  Yes, I know all of the candidates for president make campaign promises they know they can't deliver on.  But, I didn't like it when Bush did it and I still didn't like it when Obama did it.
Same here. Couldn't agree more.

QuoteI don't know what Obama or anyone else can do to change the employment situation.  But, then if Obama can't do anything to change it now, how can we hold Bush responsible for the employment situation when he was president?
I agree again.
Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false and by the rulers as useful

AllPurposeAtheist

Obama was hamstrung from day one to be destined to become Carter II, but stuck in a system that's dominated by guess who? Billionaires and trillionaires.. He's forced to play their games and we're the pawns..
All hail my new signature!

Admit it. You're secretly green with envy.

LikelyToBreak

Johan, thanks for the information.  Unfortunately, one the people I wanted to suggest a job market to, had three accidents in the first year he started driving.  He's a nice guy but, a little accident prone.  Still, it is a good idea for some people.  Better sitting in a cab all day, then in front of the boobtube wondering how the hell your going to pay rent this month.

Sorry if I confused your comments to mean me.  Guess I a little jumpy.

AllPurposeAtheist wrote:
QuoteObama was hamstrung from day one to be destined to become Carter II, but stuck in a system that's dominated by guess who? Billionaires and trillionaires.. He's forced to play their games and we're the pawns..
Agreed.  So, maybe we ought to be calling him Carter 3.0 or something.  A well meaning guy who gets to pretend he has power.

Johan

Believe it or not, accidents on your record aren't automatically a deal breaker for those entering trucking. Felony convictions are a much bigger deal. Recent DUI's are also generally a deal breaker. But accidents that happened 5 or 10 years ago shouldn't cause much of an issue as long as there were no fatalities and the driving record is clean otherwise.

Of course not everyone is cut out for every job and this especially true in trucking. Depending on what area you go into, it can be a tough life. This is especially true early on where most of the available jobs will involve going other the road. Being on the road and away from home for weeks at a stretch while living in a 4'x8' box and showering in truckstops is not something that everyone can handle. As you get more experience, more and better jobs open up that allow you to get home more often.

If you've got above average smarts and/or above average luck, you might be able to find local (not over the road) jobs right out of school with no experience. That's what happened in my case. I've pretty much always been able to park the truck and come home at the end of every work day. But that's the exception not the rule. Most people entering the industry end up having to do at least a year or so of over the road driving with limited time at home and I would advise anyone entering the industry to plan on that. Once you're a year in, jobs with better home time (and better treatment and pay) open up. By two or three years in, local work where you go home every day is very doable.

I loved flying. But I hated flying professionally. When your hobby becomes your job, you don't have a hobby anymore. Trucking was something I got into simply because the barriers to entry were fairly low and there were jobs available. But I can honestly say that I love my current job way more than any flying job I ever had. The pay is better, I'm home more and I don't have to look at the engine every morning and say out loud 'is today the day you're going to try to kill me?' like I did when I flying ratty 50 year old relics down low and in the dirt all day long.
Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false and by the rulers as useful

Minimalist

In case anyone forgot the choices were Obama and either McCain - "There's no country in the world I wouldn't bomb" - or Romney - "I only like rich motherfuckers."

There was no choice.
The Christian church, in its attitude toward science, shows the mind of a more or less enlightened man of the Thirteenth Century. It no longer believes that the earth is flat, but it is still convinced that prayer can cure after medicine fails.

-- H. L. Mencken

The Whit

Quote from: "Minimalist"In case anyone forgot the choices were Obama and either McCain - "There's no country in the world I wouldn't bomb" - or Romney - "I only like rich motherfuckers."

There was no choice.
Write-ins and 3rd party candidates?  Not feasible?  Why?  Maybe it's because nobody ever fucking thinks to do it?  Maybe if we stopped choosing to go along with the elitists false dichotomy of democrat or republican we could make some real progress!
"Death can not be killed." -brq

Johan

Quote from: "The Whit"
Quote from: "Minimalist"In case anyone forgot the choices were Obama and either McCain - "There's no country in the world I wouldn't bomb" - or Romney - "I only like rich motherfuckers."

There was no choice.
Write-ins and 3rd party candidates?  Not feasible?  Why?  Maybe it's because nobody ever fucking thinks to do it?  Maybe if we stopped choosing to go along with the elitists false dichotomy of democrat or republican we could make some real progress!
Lots of people think to do it. And quite of few of them actually do it. But if you put all those people together and then magically multiplied them by ten, you still wouldn't have enough to make a third candidate realistically electable IMO.
Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false and by the rulers as useful

josephpalazzo

Quote from: "Minimalist"In case anyone forgot the choices were Obama and either McCain - "There's no country in the world I wouldn't bomb" - or Romney - "I only like rich motherfuckers."

There was no choice.


The election of Obama and the hatred that insued is indicative that the country wasn't/ isn't ready for a black president. The one good thing is that it made everyone aware that racism is as bad if not worse than 50 years ago. The main difference is that 50 years ago, racists were open about their racism, now they wear it on their sleeves.

josephpalazzo

Quote from: "Smartmarzipan"
Quote from: "josephpalazzo"
Quote from: "LikelyToBreak"I guess that makes me a GOP dog, hate-mongering racist, sexists pig, stupid dumbass.



You don't need to brag about it, we all know that you're a racist.


It's clear to me that the only person here who gives a rat's ass about the color of the President's skin is josephpalazzo.


I've answered you in this thread: viewtopic.php?f=5&t=2452&start=135

SGOS

Quote from: "Smartmarzipan"It's clear to me that the only person here who gives a rat's ass about the color of the President's skin is josephpalazzo.
He does seem obsessed with the color of Obama's skin.  Ordinarily, I would call that a variation of racism, but I think in this case, is just a way to deflect any criticism one might have of the current administration.

aitm

Quote from: "SGOS"
Quote from: "Smartmarzipan"It's clear to me that the only person here who gives a rat's ass about the color of the President's skin is josephpalazzo.
He does seem obsessed with the color of Obama's skin.  Ordinarily, I would call that a variation of racism, but I think in this case, is just a way to deflect any criticism one might have of the current administration.

I find it rather comical that the three (or seven) of you all agree but seem to be arguing through a mirror in which you read what one says as completely backward of what is meant. And then a shit fest occurs all because one has a preconceived notion of what a person is going to say and reads it into their comprehension when in fact what the person said agrees with the whole gist. The great conundrum of the net is one cannot present the tone and intent of the point. But by now it has escaladed into a "nobody really gives a shit the intent" anymore, its all about chest bowing and slamming your dicks on the table.
A humans desire to live is exceeded only by their willingness to die for another. Even god cannot equal this magnificent sacrifice. No god has the right to judge them.-first tenant of the Panotheust

LikelyToBreak

Johan, thanks again for the information on the trucking industry.  Like I said, I don't think the guy I was thinking of would be able to do the job.  Not because of the accidents on his record, but because he tends to space out too much, which is why he got into the accidents.  He has had accidents at his other jobs, non-vehicular in nature as well.  I think he needs a job sitting at a desk, not working with dangerous equipment.

Back to topic, Ron Paul ran for president as a Libertarian before joining the Republican Party and getting elected to the House.  Still, running for president as a Republican he was painted as being a nutjob by the mainstream press.  I'm sure there are socialists within the Democrat party who when they start making waves against the rich are then painted as nutjobs as well.  I can't remember her name, but there was a Representative from South Carolina who when she started trouble by trying to get the military to account for millions of dollars which were gone with no explanation, got painted as a nutjob and didn't get re-elected.  So, I see both parties working at keeping those who "won't play ball," in line.

Bottom line, Johan is probably right in that a third party candidate is not electable.  And candidates working for the people will not be allowed in the game.

josephpalazzo

Quote from: "Johan"It may be true that obamacare will cause more businesses to switch more of their workforce to part time, but ultimately the laws of supply and demand will dictate what businesses must offer in order to keep employee turnover within acceptable levels for profitability. IOW this too shall pass for the majority of the workforce IMHO.

This is taken from a poster on another forum, but worth a repeat:

QuoteActually, a lot of the AHCA is directed at cutting the costs of health care. One of the biggest provisions that has already gone into effect is the one that holds health care insurance companies' profits and administrative costs to 20%. Believe me, they have thrown a shitload of money at fighting this plan -- and that's why. If you follow the money, you'll understand why the costs of health care have risen so precipitously. It's actually for very few reasons, and the AHCA addresses them all. Not as well as if a public option had been included, but it's a damn good start.
 
1. Health care industry profits were in excess of 40% at the time the AHCA went into effect. So instantly, those profits were cut in half. And they're not done. The law imposes more restrictions every year. Is it any wonder these corporations hate Obamacare so much?
 
2. Duplication of effort/records was another huge cost factor. This is why automation requirements are part of the AHCA. You'll hear a lot of small providers bitching and complaining about having to purchase and implement new records-keeping software to comply. I understand their pain, but the idea behind it is to eliminate duplication of procedures and create availability of records to all physicians at all times. So now, if your primary care physician sends you for an MRI and then refers you to a specialist, the specialist doesn't refer you for a second MRI -- he has access to the information gleaned from the first one.
 
3. The amount of money spent for end-of-life care is hugely disproportionate to the funds spent throughout a lifetime for regular prudent care. Here's where the discussion of "death panels" comes in. SOMEONE has to be responsible for determining what is reasonable and prudent care as opposed to extraordinary care to extend someone's life as they approach a natural death. Right now, it's insurance companies -- with a profit motive. This duty is now shifted to the government, which has no profit motive. No different than standards that have been established for many years in European countries and others. And nothing precludes someone from expending their own private means to whatever extent they wish to keep on keepin' on.
 
4. Remember that old saw, an ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure? The AHCA addresses that, too. That's why all preventive treatments are now to be made available at virtually no cost to the patient. It's much less costly to remove a bad little mole than to treat melanoma for a few years.
 
If people actually understood all the good things the AHCA does for them, they'd be thrilled about it. But change is hard and scary, so... here we are.

Satt

I almost seems to me that the only possible route to real change in this country is a revolution.
Quote from: \"the_antithesis\"We\'re a bunch of twats on the internet. We can\'t help you. You should see a psychologist.