Author Topic: Climate Change  (Read 3540 times)

Offline Johan

Re: Climate Change
« Reply #15 on: August 25, 2013, 12:57:24 PM »
And being a non-parent by choice, I have already done far more to save the environment for the next generation and beyond than any number of saved toilet flushes ever will.

And in a round about way, that illustrates my point. Saving the environment has nothing to do with why I choose not to have kids. But the fact remains that not having kids is good for the environment on many levels. Now I don't think anyone is suggesting we start a movement to try and get people to choose not to have kids in order to save the environment. That would be silly because it would be living a lower quality of life assume you wanted kids and were otherwise able to have them.

And that is all I'm saying. Do what you can when you can. But don't get so over the top about it that you deny yourself the things you really want because it might help preserve the environment in some extremely small way. More importantly, don't get all up in someone's grill because they might prefer the light of halogen bulbs in their creative workspace instead of the horrible green tinge given off by those god forsaken compact florescent bulbs. Do what can when you can. Leave others be to do the same and keep the big picture i.e. its all turning to dust eventually no matter what, in perspective.
Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false and by the rulers as useful

Offline Thumpalumpacus

Re: Climate Change
« Reply #16 on: August 25, 2013, 01:14:40 PM »
Quote from: "Johan"
And being a non-parent by choice, I have already done far more to save the environment for the next generation and beyond than any number of saved toilet flushes ever will.

And in a round about way, that illustrates my point. Saving the environment has nothing to do with why I choose not to have kids. But the fact remains that not having kids is good for the environment on many levels. Now I don't think anyone is suggesting we start a movement to try and get people to choose not to have kids in order to save the environment. That would be silly because it would be living a lower quality of life assume you wanted kids and were otherwise able to have them.

And that is all I'm saying. Do what you can when you can. But don't get so over the top about it that you deny yourself the things you really want because it might help preserve the environment in some extremely small way. More importantly, don't get all up in someone's grill because they might prefer the light of halogen bulbs in their creative workspace instead of the horrible green tinge given off by those god forsaken compact florescent bulbs. Do what can when you can. Leave others be to do the same and keep the big picture i.e. its all turning to dust eventually no matter what, in perspective.

I wasn't meaning to get up in anyone's grill.  I was just explaining my own opinion.

I don't get preachy about it, but I don't agree with your view that because extinction is inevitable we should not think about the possibilities.  My own view is that when considering MMGW, we'd ought to take a Pascal's-Wager approach to it, to wit, even if this current trend is not caused by man's industry, we're better served by minimizing  the environmental impact of our activities.
<insert witty aphorism here>

Offline Solitary

Re: Climate Change
« Reply #17 on: August 25, 2013, 03:00:33 PM »
This is what won't help the problem: Some Vt. utilities try to put brakes on solar boom
Small companies are seeing financial losses from renewable energy use and production.  :evil:  :roll:  Solitary
There is nothing more frightful than ignorance in action.

Offline Johan

Re: Climate Change
« Reply #18 on: August 25, 2013, 05:21:16 PM »
Quote from: "Thumpalumpacus"
I don't get preachy about it, but I don't agree with your view that because extinction is inevitable we should not think about the possibilities.  
Where did I say we should not think about the possibilities? I never said that.
Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false and by the rulers as useful

Offline Thumpalumpacus

Re: Climate Change
« Reply #19 on: August 25, 2013, 05:33:07 PM »
Quote from: "Johan"
Quote from: "Thumpalumpacus"
I don't get preachy about it, but I don't agree with your view that because extinction is inevitable we should not think about the possibilities.  
Where did I say we should not think about the possibilities? I never said that.


It's implicit in this passage:

Quote from: "Johan"
So while I think its stupid to be environmentally irresponsible, I also think its pretty pointless to live a less enjoyable life in the name of trying to 'save the planet'. What this means for me in practice is that I don't burn rainforest and I try to avoid products and activities that can lead to rainforest being burned or anything else equally harmful to environment taking place. But at the same time, I don't live on grapenuts and limit my transportation options to a recumbent bike made of hemp and old soup cans.

You're clearly evacuating the middle right here in order to disparage those who might disagree with you, a priori.  

Certainly the choice is not between rainforest-burning and eating grapenuts.  There's a wealth of options in between, which are possibilities, which you are ignoring.
<insert witty aphorism here>

Offline Johan

Re: Climate Change
« Reply #20 on: August 25, 2013, 08:28:45 PM »
I think you're reading a lot into that post which simply isn't there. I have not said I think people should ignore possibilities and I do not think they should. I cannot state it any more plainly than that.
Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false and by the rulers as useful

Offline Colanth

Re: Climate Change
« Reply #21 on: August 26, 2013, 01:20:37 AM »
Quote from: "Solitary"
This is what won't help the problem: Some Vt. utilities try to put brakes on solar boom
Small companies are seeing financial losses from renewable energy use and production.  :evil:  :roll:  Solitary
Remember the old Jack Benny joke about the victim and the mugger?  "Take my life, I need my money for my old age"?

They may keep from suffering financial loss now, but how much financial loss do you suffer when Alaska becomes the tropics?
Afflicting the comfortable for 70 years.
Science builds skyscrapers, faith flies planes into them.

Offline Johan

Re: Climate Change
« Reply #22 on: August 26, 2013, 07:43:27 AM »
Quote from: "Colanth"

They may keep from suffering financial loss now, but how much financial loss do you suffer when Alaska becomes the tropics?
Which will be when?
Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false and by the rulers as useful

Offline Thumpalumpacus

Re: Climate Change
« Reply #23 on: August 26, 2013, 07:55:53 AM »
Quote from: "Johan"
I think you're reading a lot into that post which simply isn't there. I have not said I think people should ignore possibilities and I do not think they should. I cannot state it any more plainly than that.

Fair enough, then.  My apologies.
<insert witty aphorism here>

Re: Climate Change
« Reply #24 on: August 26, 2013, 02:40:17 PM »
Quote from: "Solitary"
"Taken to the ultimate, you're going to die, so it doesn't make any difference if I let you live until your body quits functioning or I shoot you now."

 So what did you mean by that. "I shoot you now?" Seriously.

Those aren't Johan's words. That's Colanth's interpretation of them.
Atheists are not anti-Christian. They are anti-stupid.--WitchSabrina

Offline Colanth

Re: Climate Change
« Reply #25 on: August 27, 2013, 07:10:02 PM »
Quote from: "Johan"
Quote from: "Colanth"

They may keep from suffering financial loss now, but how much financial loss do you suffer when Alaska becomes the tropics?
Which will be when?
That depends on what we do between now and then.  It could be by the end of this century, it could be never.
Afflicting the comfortable for 70 years.
Science builds skyscrapers, faith flies planes into them.

 

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