Author Topic: Fed up  (Read 4760 times)

Offline Colanth

Re: Fed up
« Reply #30 on: August 29, 2013, 04:50:04 PM »
Quote from: "sealoch"
I agree i get so irritated when i am told that i have no hope. Hope for what?
Hope that some Christian, some day, will actually understand what "atheist" means.  (Don't hold your breath.)
Afflicting the comfortable for 70 years.
Science builds skyscrapers, faith flies planes into them.

Re: Fed up
« Reply #31 on: September 03, 2013, 01:32:12 PM »
I hear this often about "thinking with your heart." It is metaphorical of course as the heart does no thinking (nor do any other organs except the brain and with some even that is dubious). They are talking about emotions. But emotions don't think either. They react. Reacting is not thinking.

I will make a reference to Guridjieff/Ouspensky who talked of there being three centers in our brains: The Intellectual, Emotional and Instinctive. They each serve to motivate behavior. Fight or flee for example is an instinctive response. It can overpower the other centers or may incorporate them. It depends. In a perfect individual I suppose all three centers would be working together in balance. In actuality, they are usually out of balance and the consequent motivations and behavior will be skewed which invariably causes problems. So to say that the Theist experience requires only emotional (heart thinking) commitment is out of balance.

Perhaps thinking with our "gut," is a metaphor for instinctive motivations. Thinking with only our gut or our heart will necessitate irrational behavior. Religion is irrational. The manifestation of religious beliefs indicates irrational thought processes. The difficulty in trying to argue with a Theist is they are basically irrational. So using logic (or the Intellectual center) will not work. Ever! Reason is a foreign language to them.

As human beings generally we do not wish to die which is instinctive. We also want to be loved which effects our emotions. God ostensibly provides a life everlasting which appeals to instinct and supposedly unconditional love (theoretically) which appeals to emotions. Of course since there is no God it is all a mirage.

The apologist for God/Religion are always confused because they are allowing their intellectual center to be governed by emotion and instinct. They are trying desperately to reconcile the instinctive and emotional through what they perceive to be logic. But this is disingenuous as it ends up being not reason but irrational rationalizations. Quite a paradox they create for themselves. Only when a person realizes the futility of such endeavors do they have an epiphany and realize the only correct course is to throw the whole thing out.

Atheists are a threat to Theists. It threatens their emotions and their instinct. Much (if not all) of the arguments between the two are at cross purposes. There may also be a failure on the part of Atheists if they do not also include the instinctive and emotional aspects in their dialogues.

So a question: the position of not believing in something that cannot be proved is a logical manifestation and the fundamental tenet of atheism. But what are the emotional and instinctive aspects of being an Atheist?
It is easier to fool people than convince them they have been fooled. [/color]
M. Twain

Re: Fed up
« Reply #32 on: September 03, 2013, 02:03:30 PM »
Quote from: "Aleps"
Hi, I am glad to finally find a community of other atheists. I am currently on a long road trip with just my Christian mother, while my atheist dad and sister remain at home. I happened to download a copy of Greta's "Why are you atheists so mad? 99 things that piss off the godless", and when my dear mother questioned what I was reading she turned her head away and proclaimed how disappointed she was with me. We have gone through countless arguments, during which I have stated multiple different opinions from valid sources, on why religion is harmful and how likely it is that god does not exist. Her counter argument is always "You must be so sad and miserable, not believing in anything." I then tell her how I am, in fact, a very happy person, to which she never fails to say "You get it from your dad, I should have taken you to church more. You have to listen to your heart more."  HOW THE FUCK ARE YOU SUPPOSED TO ARGUE AGAINST THAT???!

Family is a hard issue to deal with when it comes to this issue. I consider myself lucky because my adoptive mom really never pushed religion on me, although for a long time when I first said I was an atheist thought it was a "phase". But she has been a great listener in recent years when I talk about arguments I make online with theists and often get an agreement from her.

I do not envy you though. My younger biological sister has been blasted by our biological family for coming out and she gets the same types of reactions you depict here.

I'd say unless she sucks the life out of you to the point you, you might simply refrain from making it an issue. I have an older "doomsday" biological brother I cut ties with because of his constant "you're going to burn in hell" crap. But all things considered if you get along well outside that topic, I'd simply vent online and let any religious tripe she may peddle, go and bitch about it here.

From her viewpoint as with any parent, no matter how wrong headed and wrong it is, our species has always evolved to want to protect their offspring. She truly believes, all be it falsely, that believing will protect you and save you.

My adoptive mom is Catholic and still believes, but not in a preachy way and she is a wonderful listener. But I am lucky. Only you can judge how to deal with family on this issue. You don't have to allow others baggage to control you, but you also don't have to force the issue if everything outside that issue outweighs that one issue.

Just remember, you have a place here if the superstitious bullshit, not just of family, but of society in general get to you. We do understand.
"We are a nation of Christians and Muslims, Jews and Hindus -- and nonbelievers." Obama
Poetry By Brian37 Like my poetry on Facebook Under BrianJames Rational Poet and also at twitter under Brianrrs37

Re: Fed up
« Reply #33 on: September 03, 2013, 02:12:14 PM »
when saying fed, comes my mind federal reserve.

what a demonik instution.!