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Ramadan

Started by Fidel_Castronaut, July 08, 2013, 03:53:30 PM

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Fidel_Castronaut

So the holy month draws near, and me and my fiancé had a debate (argument) about the nature of the idea of fasting for x amount of days/weeks/months and what it achieves.

I find the whole idea hypocritical and contradictory. The most common reasoning given for it is that its a time for spiritual enlightenment, or for bringing people closer together and also for raising money for charities or whatever.

However, discounting the spiritual notion of the concept of fasting (which naturally has no evidence aside a warm fuzzy feeling for the believer), I find the idea that one needs to do something like this for the material benefits to themselves and others odd and contradictory. To paraphrase Mr Plinket "If you can do something to benefit your fellow man at any time outside of Ramadan, why not do something to benefit your fellow man outside Ramadan?" Of course I guess many do, but why is it more significant at this time?

The whole idea is just alien to me and makes no sense at all. Ok so I'll never get the personal spiritual journey thing (probably becuase theres no evidence to suggest such anything exists outside your own head). However i get the notion that it's similar to the idea that you need to do something becuase you're commanded to by mr sky fairy again, and for a reward in the life hereafter. Which after all is the entire basis behind Ramadan, lent and so on. Which of course also means that really you're not doing something out of selflessness, as really you're doing it in the hope of appeasing angry god man.

The reason I started this thread is because on Channel 4 here in the UK a show is being broadcast throughout Ramadan showing 'non-believers [kafir if you want to use the politically incorrect name] about what goes on in the festival and how Muslims cope.

Naturally they got the most liberal (and admittedly really nice guy) Muslim they could find called Rashid Khan (a former rugby league player) to present the show, and showed off loads of white people who'd converted to the religion to try and dispel the image of the Islam that has been slowly built through all the violence over the last decade or so through most media outlets. But I still couldn't shake the contradictions inherent within it, such as clearly enforced separate male and female areas, women (and young girls) wearing Islamic dress whilst men sit in their shorts, and finally the constant reference to Allah and 'how we're all made to worship him', which I find to be an abhorrent and repugnantly stupid idea.

Anyway, tl;dr, link below from google to news articles about the show.

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=chann ... 24&bih=673
lol, marquee. HTML ROOLZ!

Seabear

I think it's spelled "Ramada Inn"
"There is a saying in the scientific community, that every great scientific truth goes through three phases. First, people deny it. Second, they say it conflicts with the Bible. Third, they say they knew it all along."

- Neil deGrasse Tyson

LikelyToBreak

Fasting changes the chemicals in the brain.  Therefore, I hypothesize believers who fast get a bigger "God High" from the experience.  The rest of us just get more restless.

Obviously, Channel 4 is pandering to the Muslims.  They, the Channel 4 administrators, hope by this pandering to avoid another 7/7.  Seems cowardly to me. But, then I don't have all of the information they have.  Maybe it is just a way to attract more viewers.  But, the pandering to avoid violence seems more likely to me.

Solitary

My ancestors fasted to bring about an illusionary trance to see there spirit guide when becoming a man. I would think it is for the same reason, to get inside your head and out of the real world we live in.  Peyote, LSD, Shrooms, and many herbs can help too. Don't blame me if you try them. It can be a living hell, not just a good trip. When there is a group of people doing this it brings people closer together. Kind of like men and women in combat, in a spiritual sense.  :-$ I'm trying to meditate. Solitary
There is nothing more frightful than ignorance in action.

Jmpty

I always think fondly of Ramadan. I used to have quite a few employees who were from Somalia, and during Ramadan, they fasted during the day, but in the evening, they would break out the sambusa, these delicious little turnover like things, filled with meat and veggies. Without fail they would share them with me, and everyone else at work. They were, and I'm sure still are, some of the kindest, most gracious people I have ever known.
???  ??

Mnf

Just to clarify, people may argue and justify the benefits of fasting which you may or may not agree with. One of the core explanation of the benefits was provided by prophet Muhammad (pbuh) himself:
"Allah, the Lord of Honor and glory says: All other deeds of man are for himself, but his fasting is purely for Me and I shall reward him for it. The fast is a shield. When any of you is fasting he should abstain from loose talk and noisy exchanges. Should anyone revile him or seek to pick a quarrel with him, he should respond with: I am observing a fast. By Him in Whose hands is the life of Muhammad, the breath of one who is fasting is purer in the sight of Allah than the fragrance of musk. One who fasts experiences two joys: he is joyful when he breaks his fast, and he is joyful by virtue of his fast when he meets his Lord".

In the Quran, Allah states: "Oh you who believe! Fasting is prescribed to you as it was prescribed to those before you, that you many learn piety and righteousness"

aitm

The fragrance of musk stinks like the balls of a camel...that would go along way explaining the fucking wackadoodle that is mohamad the cave dweller.
A humans desire to live is exceeded only by their willingness to die for another. Even god cannot equal this magnificent sacrifice. No god has the right to judge them.-first tenant of the Panotheust

Jason Harvestdancer

Look up "Ramadan babies".  They are generally smaller and have health issues later in their life compared to their counterparts that weren't gestated during Ramadan.
White privilege is being a lifelong racist, then being sent to the White House twice because your running mate is a minority.<br /><br />No Biden, no KKK, no Fascist USA!

Hijiri Byakuren

#8
"Purification by fasting" roughly translates to: "God disapproves of you having shit in your large intestine while worshiping him." Which begs the question, why give people the need to eat in the first place when you could just make us all like the Protoss and get all our sustenance from light? (And make us badass psychics while he's at it.) At the very least we would be in a constant "pure" state for worship purposes.

It seems odd that their god would design us in a manner contrary to what he wants. Make us like sex, then forbid promiscuity. Make us need food, but then forbid it in daylight hours for a month. Look, but don't touch. Touch, but don't taste! Taste... don't swallow!
Speak when you have something to say, not when you have to say something.

Sargon The Grape - My Youtube Channel

StupidWiz

Yup, another month of suffering for me. I'll have to eat and drink discreetly, wake up very early (around 3 AM in the morning) to eat Sahur and then continue to pray Subh. Also after breaking the fast, I'm gonna have to pray Tarwih at the mosque for about 3 hours every night.  :roll:

Muslims who are fasting are not allowed to eat, drink, smoke, have sex even masturbate from 4 AM to generally 6 PM. This is worse if the day temperature is really hot (thirsty!), and you travel outside a lot. Also, food court or stands are generally closed or covered so that Muslims are not "disturbed" by the outside temptation, which is weird, cause the essence of Ramadan fasting is to test yourself, to hold yourself from giving in temptation of worldly desire. What good is it if the temptation is eliminated anyway?  :roll:
... To teach superstitions as truths is the most terrible thing. The child mind accepts and believes them, and only through great pain and perhaps tragedy can they be in after years relieved of them. - Hypatia

stromboli

We need holidays that require endless sex and stuffing your face with meat, preferably bacon. That I could live with. Maybe an atheist Lent, or something.

StupidWiz

Quote from: "stromboli"We need holidays that require endless sex and stuffing your face with meat, preferably bacon. That I could live with. Maybe an atheist Lent, or something.
Agreed!  :lol:
... To teach superstitions as truths is the most terrible thing. The child mind accepts and believes them, and only through great pain and perhaps tragedy can they be in after years relieved of them. - Hypatia

DunkleSeele

Quote from: "Mnf"Just to clarify, people may argue and justify the benefits of fasting which you may or may not agree with. One of the core explanation of the benefits was provided by prophet Muhammad (pbuh) himself:
"Allah, the Lord of Honor and glory says: All other deeds of man are for himself, but his fasting is purely for Me and I shall reward him for it. The fast is a shield. When any of you is fasting he should abstain from loose talk and noisy exchanges. Should anyone revile him or seek to pick a quarrel with him, he should respond with: I am observing a fast. By Him in Whose hands is the life of Muhammad, the breath of one who is fasting is purer in the sight of Allah than the fragrance of musk. One who fasts experiences two joys: he is joyful when he breaks his fast, and he is joyful by virtue of his fast when he meets his Lord".

In the Quran, Allah states: "Oh you who believe! Fasting is prescribed to you as it was prescribed to those before you, that you many learn piety and righteousness"
You call it an explanation, but it's just made-up bullshit coming from a disgusting criminal called Muhammad pbuh (pedophile bastard, useless humanoid).

Colanth

Quote from: "DunkleSeele"it's just made-up bullshit coming from a disgusting criminal called Muhammad pbuh (pedophile bastard, useless [s:2gjczi4m]humanoid[/s:2gjczi4m] hemorrhoid).
FIFY
Afflicting the comfortable for 70 years.
Science builds skyscrapers, faith flies planes into them.

Solitary

:prayer:  :prayer:  :prayer:  :prayer:  :prayer:  ALLAHU AKBAR!  :shock:  8-[  sOLITARY
There is nothing more frightful than ignorance in action.