Author Topic: Space-time is the new ether  (Read 3814 times)

Offline Solitary

Space-time is the new ether
« on: June 30, 2013, 10:10:02 AM »
:evil:
« Last Edit: July 11, 2013, 02:21:48 AM by Solitary »
There is nothing more frightful than ignorance in action.

Re: Space-time is the new ether
« Reply #1 on: June 30, 2013, 11:29:38 AM »
Or maybe they are so different that comparing them breaks the Apple/Bandicoot Rule.
We 'new atheists' have a reputation for being militant, but make no mistake  we didn't start this war. If you want to place blame put it on the the religious zealots who have been poisoning the minds of the  young for a long long time."
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Offline SGOS

Re: Space-time is the new ether
« Reply #2 on: June 30, 2013, 11:57:01 AM »
I'm happy about this.  I always like the ether theory.  Not because it made sense. I just liked it for some reason. :-D

Offline Sal1981

Re: Space-time is the new ether
« Reply #3 on: June 30, 2013, 06:34:42 PM »
I think of matter as "folded" space, and when people talk about matter and energy I view it as densely packed space. And energy in this view is just how this packed space is moving. It's not a new or original perspective, but I like it.

Stuff like wormholes becomes possible with this perspective. Curvature in space-time makes for a bit interesting view with packed space.
"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself - and you are the easiest person to fool" --- Richard P. Feynman

Re: Space-time is the new ether
« Reply #4 on: June 30, 2013, 07:17:16 PM »
I just picture a turtle trying to "understand" New York City.

Then I have another beer and kick back.  :lol:
We 'new atheists' have a reputation for being militant, but make no mistake  we didn't start this war. If you want to place blame put it on the the religious zealots who have been poisoning the minds of the  young for a long long time."
PZ Myers

Offline Hakurei Reimu

Re: Space-time is the new ether
« Reply #5 on: June 30, 2013, 07:49:59 PM »
The luminiferous aether was thought to be a substance that had to support light, the thing that light was a wave in. The spacetime thing is the background geometry for which all of physics occurs in, and of course, it was discovered earlier that there are (mathematically) more geometries than the flat Euclidean. Special relativity begets general relativity when you consider what happens when you allow a locally Minkowskian metric to be globally curved and make a few educated guesses about the nature of how the curvature of spacetime is related to the local distribution of matter, and the result is that you see something that looks a whole lot like gravity. I see only the vaguest of similarities.

Sorry, Sol. The luminiferous aether theory, as actually formulated, is still dead and buried. It hasn't been resurrected. We know that it doesn't exist, because it cannot live in a world where the Michelson-Morley experiment is a null result (which implies we are stationary to the aether), and yet we still see the seasonal aberration of starlight (which implies at the same time that we are moving relative to it).

TL;DR version: Leo is right. You are comparing apples to bandicoots.
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Re: Space-time is the new ether
« Reply #6 on: June 30, 2013, 07:57:18 PM »
Quote from: "Hakurei Reimu"
TL;DR version: Leo is right. You are comparing apples to bandicoots.
:-k
We 'new atheists' have a reputation for being militant, but make no mistake  we didn't start this war. If you want to place blame put it on the the religious zealots who have been poisoning the minds of the  young for a long long time."
PZ Myers

Offline stromboli

Re: Space-time is the new ether
« Reply #7 on: June 30, 2013, 08:02:56 PM »
I see the universe as a big fucking pinball machine and one day, I'm gonna pull that lever............
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Re: Space-time is the new ether
« Reply #8 on: June 30, 2013, 11:22:49 PM »
The aether actually returned via Lorentz and his equations, but it wasn't accepted because Lorentz postulated that the aether occupied some privileged position, and the aether was in principle undetectable. So, with there being no possible evidence for Lorentz's aether reference frame and direct contradictions with experimental evidence for Einstein's relativity, tis dumped.

Though you still get people like WLC and his cronies who need Lorentz and his aether frame to support the Kalam Cosmological argument. They are also committed to the view (which they explicitly endorse) that time dilatation and length contraction only "apparently" occur.

I figured you guys would find that face-palmingly stupid, especially Joesephazalo. :rolleyes:
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Re: Space-time is the new ether
« Reply #9 on: July 01, 2013, 06:42:36 AM »
So, the OP is mostly nonsense.
We 'new atheists' have a reputation for being militant, but make no mistake  we didn't start this war. If you want to place blame put it on the the religious zealots who have been poisoning the minds of the  young for a long long time."
PZ Myers

Offline Solitary

Re: Space-time is the new ether
« Reply #10 on: July 01, 2013, 10:59:47 AM »
:evil:
« Last Edit: July 11, 2013, 02:22:28 AM by Solitary »
There is nothing more frightful than ignorance in action.

Offline Solitary

Re: Space-time is the new ether
« Reply #11 on: July 01, 2013, 11:56:01 AM »
:evil:
« Last Edit: July 11, 2013, 02:22:57 AM by Solitary »
There is nothing more frightful than ignorance in action.

Re: Space-time is the new ether
« Reply #12 on: July 01, 2013, 12:22:59 PM »
Can you refer us to the TV show you're citing?
We 'new atheists' have a reputation for being militant, but make no mistake  we didn't start this war. If you want to place blame put it on the the religious zealots who have been poisoning the minds of the  young for a long long time."
PZ Myers

Offline Solitary

Re: Space-time is the new ether
« Reply #13 on: July 01, 2013, 12:43:59 PM »
:evil:
« Last Edit: July 11, 2013, 02:23:28 AM by Solitary »
There is nothing more frightful than ignorance in action.

Offline Solitary

Re: Space-time is the new ether
« Reply #14 on: July 01, 2013, 12:48:01 PM »
:evil:
« Last Edit: July 11, 2013, 02:23:55 AM by Solitary »
There is nothing more frightful than ignorance in action.

 

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