Author Topic: The Fall of Kabul  (Read 1298 times)

Re: The Fall of Kabul
« Reply #60 on: August 31, 2021, 09:14:09 AM »
Leaving Afghanistan was fucked up.  Staying for longer is FUCKED up.  No matter what Biden did would be some degree of fucked up.  That Bush put us there is the highest degree of fucked up.  He put us there with no national goal--no way to win.  I guess we still have not learned that one cannot 'build' a govt in a foreign land.  We have a hard enough time as a nation to build ourselves, much less any other country.  So all those brave souls who served in the Afghan theater was there not saving any of my rights, not defending me from any kind of attack, but at the behest of our govt. which had no plans, other than to serve the corporations that made money on suppling the war. 

And the getting out process was not as much a cluster fuck as it appears.  At least that is the impression I end up with after reading several articles talking about Americans in that area and why they were still there.  Some, (more than I thought possible) actually support the Taliban or have family roots in that area.  They will not leave.  And I guess some are in business in some manner and so will not leave.  They had an opportunity to leave but did not take it--for whatever reason.  And it is interesting that the Taliban did not hinder our operations at the airport, but supported it--quite a bit different than Vietnam, where the North Vietnamese we killing us and all of our allies.

It is fucked we left Afghanistan.  It would have been FUCKED to have stayed.  No matter what we were fucked--self induced.  Lately it seems all we do as a nation is to fuck ourselves.  Yes, this country is fucked and I am saddened to have realized that--to be witnessing that.   
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent,
Is he able but not willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able or willing?
Then why call him god?

Re: The Fall of Kabul
« Reply #61 on: August 31, 2021, 09:42:30 AM »
The fact is that the US is really a theocracy as well. Essentially every leader that says "god bless America" or invokes the lord during each and every tragedy just reinforces that fact. They govern based on some shit-brain idea of god's will and then seek solace in the great scam. Our thoughts and prayers go out to the 100s of 1000s of Americans who drowned to death in their COVID juices even though they were "washed" in the blood of jeeeesuuuusah. So their world-view is ideological, history is distorted, science is flawed and human sacrifice is required and expected as the endless loop goes on and on.

Offline Hydra009

Re: The Fall of Kabul
« Reply #62 on: August 31, 2021, 06:58:30 PM »
Hey Taliban. Power is out again and didn't you know garbage pickup is on Tuesday. The shelves are empty, there is no bread or water. Good luck Fuckers. 
They've been in power before.  They ran the country into the ground, but apparently an impoverished and poorly educated populace is exactly what they need to grow their numbers (they love the poorly educated and vice versa), so incompetence is rewarded, not punished.  Wish I could say that Afghanistan is the only country like that.

Offline SGOS

Re: The Fall of Kabul
« Reply #63 on: September 01, 2021, 10:14:38 AM »
Leaving Afghanistan was fucked up.  Staying for longer is FUCKED up.  No matter what Biden did would be some degree of fucked up.  That Bush put us there is the highest degree of fucked up.  He put us there with no national goal--no way to win. 
Bush was re-elected.  Biden may not be.  There is no political upside in defeat or retreat, even if starting the thing was the bigger mistake.  In a game of Old Maid, someone always gets stuck with the old maid.  No one wins at Old Maid, the game ends when someone loses.

Online Shiranu

Re: The Fall of Kabul
« Reply #64 on: September 01, 2021, 07:00:13 PM »
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/uknews/joe-biden-holds-grudges-and-will-punish-britain-for-afghanistan-criticism-allies-say/ar-AANReF2?ocid=uxbndlbing



Quote
It came after Cabinet insiders were quoted as suggesting the US president "looked gaga" and described him as “doolally” in the wake of the fall of Kabul.

"The Brits have their view. But they should be careful. What's been said is offensive and he will remember it. He actually has a long memory," a US source told the Telegraph.

"It's always been his way that if somebody says something really bad to him, or about him, he doesn't speak to them again. He does bear grudges. Boris Johnson should know that."

We literally just elected a senile Trump at this point. Is this preschool?
“The great appear great to us only because we are on our knees. LET US ARISE!” - "The Rebel", Texas' Premier Socialist Newspaper, 1892

Offline SGOS

Re: The Fall of Kabul
« Reply #65 on: September 01, 2021, 07:30:12 PM »
All that does is lower my level of surprise about Biden, since this is the kind of thing I expected before he was elected.

Online Mr.Obvious

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Re: The Fall of Kabul
« Reply #66 on: September 02, 2021, 01:04:13 AM »
I wouldn't take the telegraph on face value though.
These are the people who denied food shortages in britain for as long as they could and blamed any and all border problems on the eu being difficult, post brexit.
They are not quite as rightwing as fox, but they do tend to pass the blame and play that old shifting game.
I can imagine them holding a grudge ever since biden started being more realistic regarding future trade deals with the uk than number 45.
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Offline SGOS

Re: The Fall of Kabul
« Reply #67 on: September 02, 2021, 08:10:33 AM »
I wouldn't take the telegraph on face value though.
These are the people who denied food shortages in britain for as long as they could and blamed any and all border problems on the eu being difficult, post brexit.
They are not quite as rightwing as fox, but they do tend to pass the blame and play that old shifting game.
I can imagine them holding a grudge ever since biden started being more realistic regarding future trade deals with the uk than number 45.
The tracker I checked described the Telegraph as right, but mostly factual.  But describing Biden as doo-lally is clearly right wing.  The article smacked of right wing hatred, rather than balanced liberal disapproval. I wouldn't go out of my way to read it if that was typical of their coverage.
« Last Edit: September 02, 2021, 08:13:40 AM by SGOS »

Online Mr.Obvious

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Re: The Fall of Kabul
« Reply #68 on: September 02, 2021, 08:37:10 AM »
The tracker I checked described the Telegraph as right, but mostly factual.  But describing Biden as doo-lally is clearly right wing.  The article smacked of right wing hatred, rather than balanced liberal disapproval. I wouldn't go out of my way to read it if that was typical of their coverage.

I know them mostly nowadays for first denying weeks and months on end that there were foodshortages and lorrydriver shortages and production labour shortages, in brittain. Only to now admit them but blaming them on the 'pingdemic', as they coin it, and refusing to even acknowledge that brexit has a part in it.
Also them taking the uk governments side quite hard in the idea that the northern ireland protocol is an inflexible mess that is hurting the island of ireland and is a travesty, whilst not adressing that the protocol is actually the proposed and by them accepted solution to the real problem, being checks.
They've also been drumming on about us being assholes who pick on them for having the balls to leave the union, saying that we rigurously apply 'new rules' that apply just to them and make life harder. Which is not true. The rules have existed prior, hell they've helped make most of the rules in the years prior their state as a third country is what is new.

I don' think they usually go as far as to lie about stuff. They just portray it in a very dishonest way, drenched in opinion.
In any case, this article, which alrezdy kind of reads like an opinion piece more than 'world news' is something i'd personally be weary about, because of that.
I also didn't find any other newspaper reading similar headlines, though i could be missing them.
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Offline SGOS

Re: The Fall of Kabul
« Reply #69 on: September 02, 2021, 09:28:56 AM »
I also didn't find any other newspaper reading similar headlines, though i could be missing them.
That struck me too.  When I read that, it sounded like some thought that came from some kook's blog site.  There was much more there than simple disagreement with Biden's withdrawal strategy.  Biden's strategy can be legitimately debated with out the fallacious ad hominem, and that one really ripped a hole in The Telegraph's credibility.

Re: The Fall of Kabul
« Reply #70 on: September 03, 2021, 09:10:22 PM »
I realized my Q friend doesn't know the difference between cabal and Kabul. She believes the soldiers were fighting an actual war against the cabal that Biden just gave up on. I didn't have it in me to even try. I had to let her ramble and I was embarrassed. We were standing outside and people could hear us.🤦🏻‍♀️

Online Shiranu

Re: The Fall of Kabul
« Reply #71 on: September 03, 2021, 09:16:06 PM »
I realized my Q friend doesn't know the difference between cabal and Kabul. She believes the soldiers were fighting an actual war against the cabal that Biden just gave up on. I didn't have it in me to even try. I had to let her ramble and I was embarrassed. We were standing outside and people could hear us.🤦🏻‍♀️

Holy shit lol.
“The great appear great to us only because we are on our knees. LET US ARISE!” - "The Rebel", Texas' Premier Socialist Newspaper, 1892

Offline Hydra009

Re: The Fall of Kabul
« Reply #72 on: September 03, 2021, 09:27:43 PM »
I realized my Q friend doesn't know the difference between cabal and Kabul. She believes the soldiers were fighting an actual war against the cabal that Biden just gave up on. I didn't have it in me to even try. I had to let her ramble and I was embarrassed. We were standing outside and people could hear us.🤦🏻‍♀️
I'd take the opportunity to tell her that the weather in some parts of France is always Nice.  :P

Online Shiranu

Re: The Fall of Kabul
« Reply #73 on: September 10, 2021, 07:01:11 PM »
So remember that ISIS-K commander that we proudly boasted we killed and got revenge on (just ignore the 9 civilians who were killed along side him)?

About that... it looks like he wasn't an ISIS-K commander; rather he was a humanitarian aide worker who was delivering water to neighborhoods that our war left without water, and those civilians were his family and co-workers.

Whoopsie.

If that doesn't sum up the last 50 years of American intervention in the Middle East, I don't know what does.

https://www.nytimes.com/video/world/asia/100000007963596/us-drone-attack-kabul-investigation.html
“The great appear great to us only because we are on our knees. LET US ARISE!” - "The Rebel", Texas' Premier Socialist Newspaper, 1892

Re: The Fall of Kabul
« Reply #74 on: September 11, 2021, 02:38:37 AM »
So remember that ISIS-K commander that we proudly boasted we killed and got revenge on (just ignore the 9 civilians who were killed along side him)?

About that... it looks like he wasn't an ISIS-K commander; rather he was a humanitarian aide worker who was delivering water to neighborhoods that our war left without water, and those civilians were his family and co-workers.

Whoopsie.

If that doesn't sum up the last 50 years of American intervention in the Middle East, I don't know what does.

https://www.nytimes.com/video/world/asia/100000007963596/us-drone-attack-kabul-investigation.html

"Oh, wearisome condition of humanity,
Born under one law, to another bound;
Vainly begot, and yet forbidden vanity,
Created sick, commanded to be sound."
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