Author Topic: Three things people get wrong about evangelicals  (Read 644 times)

Three things people get wrong about evangelicals
« on: February 12, 2021, 03:02:25 PM »
I saw the title of this opinion piece and thought "I am going to try to read this with an open mind." I didn't even make it past the first sentence.

3 Things People Get Wrong About Evangelicals

I have always thought of Christianity as the most inclusive societal movement known to humankind. To the depths of our souls as Christians, we believe that everyone is equally made in the image of God and equally loved by God. ...

Christianity is inclusive if you mean that they will accept anyone who wants to convert to their religion but evangelical Christians do not to accept other religions as true. Most want America to be "one nation under God" with a government based on Biblical principles. Only those who accept Christ as their Lord and Savior are saved.

Misunderstanding 1: Evangelicals are anti-LGBTQ

This is one of the most common misunderstandings of my community out there, and one that is particularly important to me as I have so many friends and loved ones that are members of the LGBTQ community. Evangelics are frequently maligned as anti-LGBTQ and I just don't believe this is accurate. Evangelicals are not anti-anybody. Our Bible is very clear about this: "Dear friends, let us love one another, for love comes from God. Everyone who loves has been born of God and knows God." For many evangelicals, this means serving our brothers and sisters in the LGBTQ community.
...

Evangelical Christians are always at the forefront of blocking any legislation that would provide any legal protections for LGBTQ people. They "love" LGBTQ people but they don't want LGBTQ people to marry, have children or have the same legal protections as straight people. For example, Arkansas’s senate just passed a religious exemptions bill for medical personnel that’s so expansive that it would allow any medical professional to refuse to help LGBTQ people – or even refer them to someone else – and face no consequences for that discrimination. This bill was presented and supported by Christians because they don't want to work with people who have relationships they find offensive, so the author might want to think about why LGBTQ people believe Christians don't support them.

Misunderstanding 2: Evangelicals are anti-science

Another big misunderstanding I see a lot is that evangelicals are anti-science. This, too, isn't accurate. Christians believe in science; we just believe that God was the creator of science and that everything He created bears a divine order and a logical construct. ...


As long as science doesn't lead to any conclusions that question a divine creator or challenge their beliefs they are good with it.

Misunderstanding 3: Evangelicals are notoriously pro-life but have little regard for life after birth.

Abortion has to be one of the most divisive issues in our country today. Americans are split over the right of a woman to choose abortion and the rights of the unborn in the womb. Evangelicals largely (though not always) side with the pro-life movement. But the idea that Evangelicals turn our backs on people in need after birth is inconsistent with the facts—and with our faith. ...


I do agree that this is an unfair criticism because I don't see the evidence that Christians ignore the needs of children or adults. Christians often adopt children and are willing to be foster parents. There are a lot of Christian organizations that provide charity services to adults and children. Many evangelical Christians oppose the death penalty.
"Religions are like fireflies. They require darkness in order to shine." - Arthur Schopenhauer

Offline Hydra009

Re: Three things people get wrong about evangelicals
« Reply #1 on: February 12, 2021, 03:54:48 PM »
Funny how no one's anti-science but there's a heaping helping of science denialism out there.  Who's taking part in it?  No one?

Creationism in particular is supposedly supported by no one, yet was a widespread idea and was involved in a flurry of legislation and lawsuits a little over a decade ago.  Hell, it polled at 40% just a couple years ago.

Re: Three things people get wrong about evangelicals
« Reply #2 on: February 12, 2021, 03:58:49 PM »
Misunderstanding 3: Evangelicals are notoriously pro-life but have little regard for life after birth.

Considering they are often pro-gun, pro-war, pro-death penalty and even anti-maskers, and pro-gather in churches...they often do have little regard for life after birth.

Offline Hydra009

Re: Three things people get wrong about evangelicals
« Reply #3 on: February 12, 2021, 04:09:42 PM »
I do agree that this is an unfair criticism because I don't see the evidence that Christians ignore the needs of children or adults. Christians often adopt children and are willing to be foster parents. There are a lot of Christian organizations that provide charity services to adults and children. Many evangelical Christians oppose the death penalty.
Ehh...evangelical Christians are very frequently supporters of right-wing policies that quite literally rip kids from their parents' arms as well as the least possible amount of government assistance to those in need.  To say nothing of the massive Christian gatherings during coronavirus and the associated spread of deadly disease.

Christian charities which provide no-strings-attached assistance to the needy is incredibly laudable, but often the image of benevolence is somewhat different from the reality.

And while evangelicals themselves may or may not support the death penalty, their right-wing representatives certainly do, so in what sense are they opposed to the death penalty?
« Last Edit: February 12, 2021, 04:13:47 PM by Hydra009 »

Re: Three things people get wrong about evangelicals
« Reply #4 on: February 12, 2021, 04:17:44 PM »
It is often been pointed out that Sunday is the most segregated day of the week.  So, it must not be christian churches that foster that.  Damn muslims!! 

Ah!  It must be those damned mud people--just can't trust them.  And we all know how inclusive those evangelical christian white nationalists are.
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent,
Is he able but not willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able or willing?
Then why call him god?

Re: Three things people get wrong about evangelicals
« Reply #5 on: February 12, 2021, 04:37:45 PM »
Misunderstanding 3: Evangelicals are notoriously pro-life but have little regard for life after birth.

Considering they are often pro-gun, pro-war, pro-death penalty and even anti-maskers, and pro-gather in churches...they often do have little regard for life after birth.


That's a stretch. I hate guns but I don't equate the right to own guns as having no regard for human life. Is everyone serving in the military indifferent to human life? Christians certainly aren't the only ones refusing to wear masks and congregating on a regular basis, e.g. GaysOverCovid.

"Religions are like fireflies. They require darkness in order to shine." - Arthur Schopenhauer

Re: Three things people get wrong about evangelicals
« Reply #6 on: February 12, 2021, 05:06:33 PM »
That's a stretch. I hate guns but I don't equate the right to own guns as having no regard for human life. Is everyone serving in the military indifferent to human life? Christians certainly aren't the only ones refusing to wear masks and congregating on a regular basis, e.g. GaysOverCovid.

The irony of the Jesus crowd being over the top pro-gun and often pro-war (especially if we are killing Muslims) while their savior went like a lamb to the slaughter. Not saying they have a monopoly, but the argument that they cherish adult life is laughable. Let's not forget the Christian past...involving crusades, inquisitions, witch burning, extermination of Jews, destruction of native Americans and slaveholding as provided for in their Bible.

Re: Three things people get wrong about evangelicals
« Reply #7 on: February 12, 2021, 05:41:06 PM »
The irony of the Jesus crowd being over the top pro-gun and often pro-war (especially if we are killing Muslims) while their savior went like a lamb to the slaughter. Not saying they have a monopoly, but the argument that they cherish adult life is laughable. Let's not forget the Christian past...involving crusades, inquisitions, witch burning, extermination of Jews, destruction of native Americans and slaveholding as provided for in their Bible.

I don't think Christians cherish adult life but I don't think they only care about unborn life. Christianity, Islam, and Judaism are morally bankrupt belief systems. Even if followers of Abrahamic religions behaved ideally according to their religions, they would still be morally reprehensible. The problem isn't Christians don't live up to their values, the problem is they do.
"Religions are like fireflies. They require darkness in order to shine." - Arthur Schopenhauer

Offline Hydra009

Re: Three things people get wrong about evangelicals
« Reply #8 on: February 12, 2021, 06:39:45 PM »
I don't think Christians cherish adult life but I don't think they only care about unborn life.
If they lobbied against war and poverty as vociferously as they lobby against abortion, then I would say that they care deeply about both.

Re: Three things people get wrong about evangelicals
« Reply #9 on: February 12, 2021, 08:13:54 PM »
Okay. Let's see what I "get wrong" about a group of people I used to be one of.

I saw the title of this opinion piece and thought "I am going to try to read this with an open mind." I didn't even make it past the first sentence.

3 Things People Get Wrong About Evangelicals

I have always thought of Christianity as the most inclusive societal movement known to humankind.



To the depths of our souls as Christians, we believe that everyone is equally made in the image of God and equally loved by God. ...

Christianity is inclusive if you mean that they will accept anyone who wants to convert to their religion but evangelical Christians do not to accept other religions as true. Most want America to be "one nation under God" with a government based on Biblical principles. Only those who accept Christ as their Lord and Savior are saved.

Misunderstanding 1: Evangelicals are anti-LGBTQ

This is one of the most common misunderstandings of my community out there, and one that is particularly important to me as I have so many friends and loved ones that are members of the LGBTQ community. Evangelics are frequently maligned as anti-LGBTQ and I just don't believe this is accurate. Evangelicals are not anti-anybody. Our Bible is very clear about this: "Dear friends, let us love one another, for love comes from God. Everyone who loves has been born of God and knows God." For many evangelicals, this means serving our brothers and sisters in the LGBTQ community.
...

Evangelical Christians are always at the forefront of blocking any legislation that would provide any legal protections for LGBTQ people. They "love" LGBTQ people but they don't want LGBTQ people to marry, have children or have the same legal protections as straight people. For example, Arkansas’s senate just passed a religious exemptions bill for medical personnel that’s so expansive that it would allow any medical professional to refuse to help LGBTQ people – or even refer them to someone else – and face no consequences for that discrimination. This bill was presented and supported by Christians because they don't want to work with people who have relationships they find offensive, so the author might want to think about why LGBTQ people believe Christians don't support them.

Yeah, that's some nice rhetoric that is commonly heard in church. The problem is that their actions belie their true feelings about the LGBTQ+, and actions speak louder. They don't love the LGBTQ+; they want to fix them, or exterminate them, if necessary. They do not want them to exist openly, but to live in fear of being outed, like the good old days they pine for. They don't want them to embrace what they are, but to suppress it and live in celibacy. The LGBTQ+ are "equal" to them, but only in the sense that they have an equal right to live like they're straight.

Misunderstanding 2: Evangelicals are anti-science

Another big misunderstanding I see a lot is that evangelicals are anti-science. This, too, isn't accurate. Christians believe in science; we just believe that God was the creator of science and that everything He created bears a divine order and a logical construct. ...


As long as science doesn't lead to any conclusions that question a divine creator or challenge their beliefs they are good with it.

Yeah, Christians believe in science. That's why when they hear some bogus story about science proving them right, they gobble it up. They know that having science on your side brings legitimacy. But just like with the Bible, they ignore the stuff that doesn't align with their beliefs and assumptions. Just as Christians will substitute theology with baseless exegesis, they'll also substitute real science with pseudo-science.

Misunderstanding 3: Evangelicals are notoriously pro-life but have little regard for life after birth.

Abortion has to be one of the most divisive issues in our country today. Americans are split over the right of a woman to choose abortion and the rights of the unborn in the womb. Evangelicals largely (though not always) side with the pro-life movement. But the idea that Evangelicals turn our backs on people in need after birth is inconsistent with the facts—and with our faith. ...


I do agree that this is an unfair criticism because I don't see the evidence that Christians ignore the needs of children or adults. Christians often adopt children and are willing to be foster parents. There are a lot of Christian organizations that provide charity services to adults and children. Many evangelical Christians oppose the death penalty.

Christian Evangelicals focus on overturning Roe v. Wade and making abortions illegal, and even punishable under the law. This despite the fact that abortions have been on a steady downward trend since Roe v. Wade and Planned Parenthood facilities started providing safe options. If they really wanted to kill abortion, they'd focus on preventing the need for them in the first place. Increase access to healthcare? Nope. Include contraceptives and the use of condoms in sex education? Nah, teach them to wait until marriage. That'll totally work. Rather than focus on the things that would actually make abortions happen less often, they focus on taking away rights from women, forcing them to have to take unsafe options instead, because that's how Christian Evangelicals do. They're not constructive; they're destructive. This is true with every issue they take part in. They want to take rights away from others to force them into living according to Evangelical Christian standards.
« Last Edit: February 12, 2021, 11:11:31 PM by Blackleaf »
"Oh, wearisome condition of humanity,
Born under one law, to another bound;
Vainly begot, and yet forbidden vanity,
Created sick, commanded to be sound."
--Fulke Greville

Re: Three things people get wrong about evangelicals
« Reply #10 on: February 12, 2021, 09:17:45 PM »
Yeah, that's some nice rhetoric that is commonly heard in church. The problem is that their actions belie their true feelings about the LGBTQ+, and actions speak louder. They don't love the LGBTQ+; they want to fix them, or exterminate them, if necessary. They do not want them to exist openly, but to live in fear of being outed, like the good old days they pine for. They don't want them to embrace what they are, but to suppress it and live in celibacy. The LGBTQ+ "equal" to them, but only in the sense that they have an equal right to live like they're straight.

Jesus' unconditional love seems to come with a lot of conditions.
"Religions are like fireflies. They require darkness in order to shine." - Arthur Schopenhauer

Re: Three things people get wrong about evangelicals
« Reply #11 on: February 13, 2021, 08:17:06 AM »
I guess the cousins aren't evangelicals.

I'll have to tell them tomorrow when I go to church. (j/k)
We 'new atheists' have a reputation for being militant, but make no mistake  we didn't start this war. If you want to place blame put it on the the religious zealots who have been poisoning the minds of the  young for a long long time."
PZ Myers

Offline drunkenshoe

Re: Three things people get wrong about evangelicals
« Reply #12 on: February 13, 2021, 09:53:56 AM »
Yeah, no... I don't think we misunderstand anything about evangelicals.

If your goal is to spread your belief world wide, you are a serious threat to human civilisation. Period. The rest is 'it's a religion of peace!'
"I believe you find life such a problem because you think there are good people and bad people. You're wrong, of course. There are, always and only, the bad people, but some of them are on opposite sides." Havelock Vetinari

Offline drunkenshoe

Re: Three things people get wrong about evangelicals
« Reply #13 on: February 13, 2021, 11:02:45 AM »
That's a stretch. I hate guns but I don't equate the right to own guns as having no regard for human life. 

No, it is not a stretch, maybe a strawman. Besides the fact that the gun problem in the US is far beyond what you described, it's not about one pro-something either.

Quote
Is everyone serving in the military indifferent to human life?

That's a very manipulating question. The US military is completely private and it's practically mercenary. There hasn't been a conflict/attack on US soil since when? Don't say 9/11. How many invasions and international wars have been launched since? Through open lies by government no less. Just the previous decade.  So, the answer is yes. If you take up arms and become an active combatant in the US army, you need to be indifferent to human life. If you think that it is OK; that it is just life to be paid, get some scholarship, medical insurance to travel to specific regions of the world to kill people there, you are indifferent to human life.

The US military is not protecting American people. They won't protect the civilians from some potential civil conflict either. They will just respond to protect the federal government and its order, and kill the civilians if necessary. That's what an army is. Esp. one like US army.

This is a complete picture: "...pro-gun, pro-war, pro-death penalty and even anti-maskers, and pro-gather in churches ..." Add that the pro-life (Evangelists are responsbile from abortion rights being abolished/prevented to develop everywhere possible, including some European countries. They've succeed in Poland. They are very organised and actively working/supporting to abolish various kinds of modern laws under religious beliefs) and their motto is basically, 'if you don't agree with us, you are our enemy'. Do you need some Middle Eastern ethnic dressed, long bearded men with weapons to see past this? It's a fucking jihad. If you are trying to spread a religion, you are just a step away from terrorism. You don't have to hold a gun. (I'm not convinced they don't/won't hold a gun either. TOO much money is involved and human life is very cheap.) But yeah money works better, in wider scales because wealth distribution is terrible. This is exactly what extremist muslim groups do everwhere in the world. Money, jobs, women...and they are very successful because it works.   

A group of gay people advocating against masks nowhere near an example against this. You can bet there are evangelical gay groups too.
« Last Edit: February 13, 2021, 11:10:19 AM by drunkenshoe »
"I believe you find life such a problem because you think there are good people and bad people. You're wrong, of course. There are, always and only, the bad people, but some of them are on opposite sides." Havelock Vetinari

Offline Hydra009

Re: Three things people get wrong about evangelicals
« Reply #14 on: February 13, 2021, 01:54:31 PM »
If your goal is to spread your belief world wide, you are a serious threat to human civilisation. Period.
That's the stated goal of most major religions.  And as we have seen, they'll go to great lengths to increase their market share.  Humanity's purpose is to serve the ideology, rather than the other way around.