Author Topic: WTH ALABAMA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  (Read 956 times)

Offline Draconic Aiur

WTH ALABAMA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
« on: June 22, 2019, 07:56:14 PM »
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Quote
An Alabama megachurch plans to start its own police force thanks to a new law permitting the church to do just that.

The law, signed by Gov. Kay Ivey, authorizes Briarwood Presbyterian to "appoint and employ one or more suitable persons to act as police officers to protect the property of the school or academy."
A similar bill was proposed four years ago, but it was dropped by the Alabama legislature amid a public outcry over the Presbyterian Church in America's racist history, as well as criticism that the bill was unconstitutional and violated the Establishment Clause's separation of church and state. Briarwood Presbyterian is part of the PCA.
Briarwood Presbyterian's congregation is overwhelmingly white. Nearby Birmingham is two-thirds black.
The PCA is a conservative denomination that originated early 1970s Alabama. In 2016 it apologized for "racial sins" that included "the segregation of worshipers by race" as well as "the participation in and defense of white supremacist organizations," among other things.
Officials at Briarwood Presbyterian Church say that a police force is necessary in order to adequately protect its 4,100 members, including 2,000 students and faculty on its two campuses.
The church hopes its new security force will keep intruders and prevent trespassers from accessing the property, it said in a press release that was posted by CNN affiliate WBRC.
The officers will complete state certified training by the Peace Officers Standards and Training Commission. The officers will also be trained on the proper use of a non-lethal weapon.
The ACLU of Alabama tweeted the new law undermines the separation of church and state are is "a threat to our freedom of religion and a violation of the Establishment Clause."
"We expect this law to be challenged in the courts," it said.
The new law is expected to go into effect in the fall.

The beginning of the end of the Bill of Rights! Fucking idiots!

Offline Shiranu

Re: WTH ALABAMA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
« Reply #1 on: June 22, 2019, 08:03:54 PM »
"BuT sHaRiA lAw Is CoMiNg To GeT uS!!!" - Republican Alabamans, probably
Quod est inferius, est sicut quod est superius.
Et quod est superius, est sicut quod est inferius.

Re: WTH ALABAMA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
« Reply #2 on: June 22, 2019, 08:05:48 PM »
I lived in Alabama as a small child, and then we left. It's never been the same since.
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"An experiment is a question which science poses to Nature, and a measurement is the recording of Nature's answer."
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Re: WTH ALABAMA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
« Reply #3 on: June 22, 2019, 09:05:56 PM »
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I lived in Alabama as a small child, and then we left. It's never been the same since.
I lived in Alabama as a child as well.  The best thing, by faaaarrrrrr---was leaving it!  got so tired of seeing those 'colored' and 'white' signs everywhere.
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent,
Is he able but not willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able or willing?
Then why call him god?

Offline Munch

Re: WTH ALABAMA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
« Reply #4 on: June 22, 2019, 09:07:42 PM »
Be an interesting experiment. Makes me think of this.

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Offline Baruch

Re: WTH ALABAMA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
« Reply #5 on: June 22, 2019, 10:41:11 PM »
Not uncommon.  Megachurches commonly have official or unofficial police forces, run by off-duty police or elders.

No, not Sharia law.  Trying to make Christians into Jihadis?  Really?  How about atheist legal systems (China etc).
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luu shalmaata luu balt’aata
May you be well, may you be healthy

Offline Mr.Obvious

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Re: WTH ALABAMA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
« Reply #6 on: June 23, 2019, 01:58:00 AM »
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Not uncommon.  Megachurches commonly have official or unofficial police forces, run by off-duty police or elders.

Maybe not uncommon, but it does seem unconstitutional.
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Offline Baruch

Re: WTH ALABAMA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
« Reply #7 on: June 23, 2019, 03:45:15 AM »
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Maybe not uncommon, but it does seem unconstitutional.

In Belgium.  EU constitution, or is there a Belgian one?

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In the US we have powers delegated to states, to counties, to municipalities.  And anything else is reserved for the people.  EU people are subjects, not citizens.  Of course by-laws by some church, can't overrule higher authority.  Not municipality, county etc.  US law is very complicated.  It isn't some monolith for all people all time everywhere dictated from the capital (like Napoleonic or Roman law).
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luu shalmaata luu balt’aata
May you be well, may you be healthy

Offline Mr.Obvious

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Re: WTH ALABAMA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
« Reply #8 on: June 23, 2019, 04:57:20 AM »
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In Belgium.  EU constitution, or is there a Belgian one?

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In the US we have powers delegated to states, to counties, to municipalities.  And anything else is reserved for the people.  EU people are subjects, not citizens.  Of course by-laws by some church, can't overrule higher authority.  Not municipality, county etc.  US law is very complicated.  It isn't some monolith for all people all time everywhere dictated from the capital (like Napoleonic or Roman law).

Unconstitutional in American terms, of course.
Your constitution states a clear divide between church and state. A state-approved and recognized church-police-force seems in direct contrast, to me.
"If we have to go down, we go down together!"
- Your mum, requesting 69 last night.

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Offline Baruch

Re: WTH ALABAMA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
« Reply #9 on: June 23, 2019, 07:23:13 AM »
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Unconstitutional in American terms, of course.
Your constitution states a clear divide between church and state. A state-approved and recognized church-police-force seems in direct contrast, to me.

Popular understanding is always inaccurate ;-)  US Constitution doesn't limit what people can do, it limits what Feds can do.  Only the Feds.  How it applies to lower jurisdictions is exactly what created the Civil War (nullification).  eg: can Federal prohibition of slavery, trump state or local law.  It is up to the courts always to interpret.  Including resolving conflict between jurisdictions.

Because the Confederacy rejected the jurisdiction of the Federal government (aka seceded) that made peaceful resolution impossible.  Even slave holders were against nullification, President Andrew Jackson threatened to invade S Carolina, if they tried that while he was in office.  Neither could Lincoln, for the same reasons.

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"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof..." ... that's it, not some long winded argument from Marx.  Interpretation is up to the courts.  Not up to the people.  Most Americans are religious, even if we don't agree on religion.  Our religion will always impact how we vote and govern.

"establishment ..." as in the Queen is the head of the Anglican Church.  Originally, that meant, 300 years ago, it was illegal to be atheist, or to be Catholic etc, a capital crime.  Our founders didn't want that here.  Notice "free exercise thereof ..." what does that mean?  The Feds can't create a state religion (aka Anglicanism, Marxism etc), aka something mandatory or to prohibit.  I am free to worship anything I want, or nothing at all.  And with freedom of assembly, I can assemble with people who are like minded.

So what can a state do?  Shrugs.  What can a county or municipality do?  The point of law, is to force my neighbors to do something they don't want to do (cut their grass), or to force them to not do something they want to do (leave dog doodoo).  That is what the whole point of law is.  Organized tyranny.  Hence the less "state" the better.  Tyranny is inevitable, given the inexorable failures of human nature.

Ever read the Federalist Papers or Anti-Federalist Papers?  Federalism prevents over centralization of power.  No papacy, no royalty, no dictatorship.

Why are churches trying to protect themselves?  Because Marxist Einstatz-gruppen are going around shooting up congregations (not really).  Paranoia.  Usually with mega-churches there is a problem with parking on Sunday, and that requires some parking officials to organize the process of coming and going (to prevent accidents).  I don't care for mega-churches.

Really, I expect only further escalation.  Roving gangs of armed Brownshirts outing and shooting liberals ;-(
« Last Edit: June 23, 2019, 07:28:47 AM by Baruch »
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luu shalmaata luu balt’aata
May you be well, may you be healthy

Offline Mermaid

Re: WTH ALABAMA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
« Reply #10 on: June 23, 2019, 01:04:31 PM »
I'd rather see organizations with these designated armed people than just allowing everyone to carry a firearm with the intent of being the hero in a time of crisis. The "good guy with a gun" theory is just retarded. And let's face it, it's more like "white guy with a gun".
Maybe a designated and trained person or group of people will be able to better recognize who the "good guy" is and who is the "bad guy with the gun" in a situation like a mass church shooting. It's hard enough for law enforcement.

But let's not kid ourselves. The second amendment is for white people.
We are tied to the ocean. And when we go back to the sea, whether it is to sail or to watch - we are going back from whence we came.

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Re: WTH ALABAMA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
« Reply #11 on: June 23, 2019, 01:16:17 PM »
With churches the "good guy" is the one who believes everything the Holy Horseshitter up front says and who contributes the most money.

Everyone else is suspect.
The Christian church, in its attitude toward science, shows the mind of a more or less enlightened man of the Thirteenth Century. It no longer believes that the earth is flat, but it is still convinced that prayer can cure after medicine fails.

-- H. L. Mencken

Offline aitm

Re: WTH ALABAMA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
« Reply #12 on: June 23, 2019, 02:17:08 PM »
Frankly I don't have an issue with this yet.
A. I have no intention of going on said grounds.
B. Peeps who are going there for reasons other than being part of the activities should not go.
C. Don't need a C
A humans desire to live is exceeded only by their willingness to die for another. Even god cannot equal this magnificent sacrifice. No god has the right to judge them.-first tenant of the Panotheust

Offline Draconic Aiur

Re: WTH ALABAMA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
« Reply #13 on: June 23, 2019, 04:15:09 PM »
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Popular understanding is always inaccurate ;-)  US Constitution doesn't limit what people can do, it limits what Feds can do.  Only the Feds.  How it applies to lower jurisdictions is exactly what created the Civil War (nullification).  eg: can Federal prohibition of slavery, trump state or local law.  It is up to the courts always to interpret.  Including resolving conflict between jurisdictions.

Because the Confederacy rejected the jurisdiction of the Federal government (aka seceded) that made peaceful resolution impossible.  Even slave holders were against nullification, President Andrew Jackson threatened to invade S Carolina, if they tried that while he was in office.  Neither could Lincoln, for the same reasons.

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login

"Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof..." ... that's it, not some long winded argument from Marx.  Interpretation is up to the courts.  Not up to the people.  Most Americans are religious, even if we don't agree on religion.  Our religion will always impact how we vote and govern.

"establishment ..." as in the Queen is the head of the Anglican Church.  Originally, that meant, 300 years ago, it was illegal to be atheist, or to be Catholic etc, a capital crime.  Our founders didn't want that here.  Notice "free exercise thereof ..." what does that mean?  The Feds can't create a state religion (aka Anglicanism, Marxism etc), aka something mandatory or to prohibit.  I am free to worship anything I want, or nothing at all.  And with freedom of assembly, I can assemble with people who are like minded.

So what can a state do?  Shrugs.  What can a county or municipality do?  The point of law, is to force my neighbors to do something they don't want to do (cut their grass), or to force them to not do something they want to do (leave dog doodoo).  That is what the whole point of law is.  Organized tyranny.  Hence the less "state" the better.  Tyranny is inevitable, given the inexorable failures of human nature.

Ever read the Federalist Papers or Anti-Federalist Papers?  Federalism prevents over centralization of power.  No papacy, no royalty, no dictatorship.

Why are churches trying to protect themselves?  Because Marxist Einstatz-gruppen are going around shooting up congregations (not really).  Paranoia.  Usually with mega-churches there is a problem with parking on Sunday, and that requires some parking officials to organize the process of coming and going (to prevent accidents).  I don't care for mega-churches.

Really, I expect only further escalation.  Roving gangs of armed Brownshirts outing and shooting liberals ;-(

Tell that to the yanks in before and during the civil war. No, the feds are the government and the states who invite such savage bullshit that contradict the constitution should be shown in force what the feds can do. The state is only a state, and lower level compared to the federal government.

Protect your theism with your bullshit logic elsewhere, for when a state governor signs a bill for a church militia that ruins the safety of our multicultural and religion or lack of religion by favoring a protestant church that has been known to be really racist.


Offline Baruch

Re: WTH ALABAMA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
« Reply #14 on: June 23, 2019, 04:27:48 PM »
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I'd rather see organizations with these designated armed people than just allowing everyone to carry a firearm with the intent of being the hero in a time of crisis. The "good guy with a gun" theory is just retarded. And let's face it, it's more like "white guy with a gun".
Maybe a designated and trained person or group of people will be able to better recognize who the "good guy" is and who is the "bad guy with the gun" in a situation like a mass church shooting. It's hard enough for law enforcement.

But let's not kid ourselves. The second amendment is for white people.

Yes, and all colored folks are Cuban communists, right?  The Left is so racist ... but OK as long as self hating.

But I agree, church groups or corporations that keep internal security, need to be regulated and licensed.  We know the regular police won't do anything.  They are there for the coffee and donuts and pensions.  And no, I don't think teachers should be armed.  A large HS might have local security, again licensed.  In Tombstone, the Clantons got afoul of the city ordnance about carrying a gun in town.  That was 1882 in the Wild West.  This is why I am opposed to "open carry" and "concealed carry" unless you are properly deputized (licensed as a public or private security officer like the Earps).

If guns are White, then I encourage Blacks to lock and load.  If guns are male, then I encourage women to lock and load.  No need for such nice folks to miss out.
« Last Edit: June 23, 2019, 05:08:29 PM by Baruch »
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luu shalmaata luu balt’aata
May you be well, may you be healthy

 

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