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Quest for Truth

Started by Absolute_Agent, June 16, 2019, 09:02:36 PM

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Absolute_Agent

#540
Quote from: josephpalazzo on August 09, 2019, 04:24:27 PMI can say no one created the universe, the universe is eternal.

The big bang theory contradicts that statement.  If the universe had a beginning, it is not eternal.  Everything in the observable universe exhibits transience, impermanence.  You cannot honestly say the universe is eternal.  If it had a beginning, then it had a cause, and that cause can be none but God.

The name by which God called Himself, EHYH, means "I AM THAT I AM", which is interpreted that He is the self-existent, self-subsisting. Since God identified Himself as He is that He is (YHVH), I CAN honestly say that God is He who is uncreated, without beginning or end.  I can honestly say that God is the eternal source of all existence.


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Absolute_Agent

#541
Quote from: Mike Cl on August 09, 2019, 09:07:30 PM
However, I do sort of say a prayer to myself from time to time, for I do aspire to be a good person and not to harm anyone (or animals) without cause.  My personal motto, so to speak, is 'first do no harm.' and I take that inside and mull it over, from time to time, to figure out what it means and how it should govern my actions and thoughts.  But this is all inside work with no god anticipated nor expected.  After all, I do have to live with myself.

Interesting!  That's a good motto to live by.  Do you find this "self-prayer" makes a difference in your life?


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josephpalazzo

Quote from: Absolute_Agent on August 10, 2019, 07:16:09 AM
The big bang theory contradicts that statement. 


Oh now you need science to come to your help! Great, the laws of physics also says that matter/energy cannot be created. BTW, I happen to have great reservation about the BBT. In my last book (check https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1546256199/ref=dbs_a_def_rwt_bibl_vppi_i0 chapter 7) I outlined all the flaws of that theory. LOL.
My advise to you: stay in your lane, you are not an expert in science.

Absolute_Agent

#543
Quote from: josephpalazzo on August 10, 2019, 07:47:49 AM
Oh now you need science to come to your help! Great, the laws of physics also says that matter/energy cannot be created. BTW, I happen to have great reservation about the BBT. In my last book (check https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1546256199/ref=dbs_a_def_rwt_bibl_vppi_i0 chapter 7) I outlined all the flaws of that theory. LOL.
My advise to you: stay in your lane, you are not an expert in science.
Thanks for the book link.  I see you are an unconventional thinker.  I like that.  Can you prove that matter and energy are not created or destroyed, or is that just another convenient assumption?

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josephpalazzo

Quote from: Absolute_Agent on August 10, 2019, 08:19:16 AM
Thanks for the book link.  I see you are an unconventional thinker.  I like that.  Can you prove that matter and energy are not destroyed, or is that just another convenient assumption?

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Conservation of matter/energy is the bedrock of physics. Without it, Einstein cannot deduce E= mc2 which launched his theory of Special Relativity (1905) and General Relativity (1915), Planck cannot deduce E = hf, which launched Quantum Mechanics in 1900, Dirac cannot deduce that anti-particles exist (1927) which launched Quantum Field Theory, nuclear bombs cannot be built in the 1940's, and so on.  All the advancements in science since Newton would go out the window. 

Absolute_Agent

Quote from: josephpalazzo on August 10, 2019, 08:27:19 AM
Conservation of matter/energy is the bedrock of physics. Without it, Einstein cannot deduce E= mc2 which launched his theory of Special Relativity (1905) and General Relativity (1915), Planck cannot deduce E = hf, which launched Quantum Mechanics in 1900, Dirac cannot deduce that anti-particles exist (1927) which launched Quantum Field Theory, nuclear bombs cannot be built in the 1940's, and so on.  All the advancements in science since Newton would go out the window.
How inconvenient...

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Mike Cl

Quote from: Absolute_Agent on August 10, 2019, 07:16:09 AM
The big bang theory contradicts that statement.  If the universe had a beginning, it is not eternal.  Everything in the observable universe exhibits transience, impermanence.  You cannot honestly say the universe is eternal.  If it had a beginning, then it had a cause, and that cause can be none but God.

The name by which God called Himself, EHYH, means "I AM THAT I AM", which is interpreted that He is the self-existent, self-subsisting. Since God identified Himself as He is that He is (YHVH), I CAN honestly say that God is He who is uncreated, without beginning or end.  I can honestly say that God is the eternal source of all existence.


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Actually, the universe could be considered eternal in that it is simply one phase of a universe creating system.  If the black holes are sucking in all the energy that comes close, and at a certain time that energy becomes too much for the black hole to handle, that excess energy forms a 'bud' or bubble and then breaks off the black hole and creates another universe via a 'big bang'.  Our universe could be simply part of an eternal system.  Yet, even that leaves us with a question that can never be answered--who/what created the first universe?  Or, who or what created the first god? 
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?<br />Then he is not omnipotent,<br />Is he able but not willing?<br />Then whence cometh evil?<br />Is he neither able or willing?<br />Then why call him god?

Mike Cl

Quote from: Absolute_Agent on August 10, 2019, 07:39:49 AM
Interesting!  That's a good motto to live by.  Do you find this "self-prayer" makes a difference in your life?


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I don't call it prayer; I model it after a process I learned in Unity.  It is call affirmations.  I 'affirm' something--which means I take a statement inside and mull it over or sort of meditate on it for a period.  That helps me focus my energy in a more positive and productive way.  For example, if going for a job interview I will 'see' myself being successful and I will make a short physical list of the points I want to cover/improve in and post them on a mirror or somewhere I will see them daily.  I will come as close to experiencing the actual interview as I can.  This helps me focus on that process. 

Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?<br />Then he is not omnipotent,<br />Is he able but not willing?<br />Then whence cometh evil?<br />Is he neither able or willing?<br />Then why call him god?

josephpalazzo

Quote from: Absolute_Agent on August 10, 2019, 09:16:11 AM
How inconvenient...

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Indeed the idea that God created the universe raises many questions that don't square with science. i guess you can invoke magic. But history shows that as science advances, magic recedes. It becomes more and more difficult to believe that God just pooffed the universe out of nothing when it can't even stop a Hitler to kill millions of innocent people, not to mention the horrific suffering that billions have suffered and continue to suffer.

Baruch

Quote from: Mike Cl on August 10, 2019, 09:34:27 AM
I don't call it prayer; I model it after a process I learned in Unity.  It is call affirmations.  I 'affirm' something--which means I take a statement inside and mull it over or sort of meditate on it for a period.  That helps me focus my energy in a more positive and productive way.  For example, if going for a job interview I will 'see' myself being successful and I will make a short physical list of the points I want to cover/improve in and post them on a mirror or somewhere I will see them daily.  I will come as close to experiencing the actual interview as I can.  This helps me focus on that process.

That is one of the many angles of "self change".
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Baruch

Quote from: Mike Cl on August 10, 2019, 09:22:37 AM
Actually, the universe could be considered eternal in that it is simply one phase of a universe creating system.  If the black holes are sucking in all the energy that comes close, and at a certain time that energy becomes too much for the black hole to handle, that excess energy forms a 'bud' or bubble and then breaks off the black hole and creates another universe via a 'big bang'.  Our universe could be simply part of an eternal system.  Yet, even that leaves us with a question that can never be answered--who/what created the first universe?  Or, who or what created the first god?

Speculation.  Nobody knows what happens inside a black hole, experimentally.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Mike Cl

Quote from: Baruch on August 10, 2019, 11:39:23 AM
That is one of the many angles of "self change".
I agree.  It can also be called thinking positive--Robbins????

It also had elements of NLP as well--self improvement is one of the stated goals of NLP.
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?<br />Then he is not omnipotent,<br />Is he able but not willing?<br />Then whence cometh evil?<br />Is he neither able or willing?<br />Then why call him god?

Mike Cl

Quote from: Baruch on August 10, 2019, 11:40:58 AM
Speculation.  Nobody knows what happens inside a black hole, experimentally.
Yes, it is speculation.  But more plausible than god did it. 
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?<br />Then he is not omnipotent,<br />Is he able but not willing?<br />Then whence cometh evil?<br />Is he neither able or willing?<br />Then why call him god?

Baruch

Quote from: Mike Cl on August 10, 2019, 11:56:30 AM
Yes, it is speculation.  But more plausible than god did it.

One bad idea doesn't make another bad idea look good ;-)

There is no creator god, because there is no creation.  Creation/Destruction is primitive pre-scientific Indian metaphysics, overseen by Shiva.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Absolute_Agent



Quote from: josephpalazzo on August 10, 2019, 10:37:54 AMIt becomes more and more difficult to believe that God just pooffed the universe out of nothing
Ha ha... Of course it will become increasingly difficult to believe in creation as you progress through the courses of your theory, if your starting assumption is that nothing that exists was created, all material reality was self-caused! [emoji23][emoji23][emoji23]  It just randomly poofed itself into existence, you assume?  Once again you have succinctly proved my point: the only difference between us is how much of the available evidence you use, and how you interpret it. Like I said, science is handicapped by its assumptions.
Quote from: josephpalazzo on August 10, 2019, 10:37:54 AM
when it can't even stop a Hitler to kill millions of innocent people, not to mention the horrific suffering that billions have suffered and continue to suffer.
God-less science never stopped Hitler; in fact, it enabled him.  The blood of the Jews,  of Nagasaki, and Hiroshima, is on your hands.[emoji3166]



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