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Quest for Truth

Started by Absolute_Agent, June 16, 2019, 09:02:36 PM

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Baruch

Quote from: josephpalazzo on August 06, 2019, 03:37:22 PM
and killing anyone - man, woman or child - if you perceive  them to be a threat to your religion

You missed some of my better posts.  It is not wrong to kill people.  It is right to kill the right people, and wrong to kill the wrong people.  As to the killing, I leave that to our authorities.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Absolute_Agent


Quote from: Absolute_Agent on August 06, 2019, 02:02:30 PM
Any ideology that's fundamentally opposed to theistic beliefs.  Any time these ideologies take hold the result is authoritarianism and tyranny.
Case in point:
Quote from: josephpalazzo on August 06, 2019, 03:40:29 PM
Atheist ideology: the belief that there is a LACK of evidence in the existence of a deity. PERIOD.

Now be scared.
You're getting really good at reinforcing my points--good job, keep it up!

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josephpalazzo

Quote from: Absolute_Agent on August 06, 2019, 04:08:41 PM
Case in point:You're getting really good at reinforcing my points--good job, keep it up!

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So are you scared?

Absolute_Agent

Quote from: josephpalazzo on August 06, 2019, 04:13:06 PM
So are you scared?
[emoji28] Incredible...

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Mike Cl

Quote from: Absolute_Agent on August 06, 2019, 02:02:30 PM
Any ideology that's fundamentally opposed to theistic beliefs.  Any time these ideologies take hold the result is authoritarianism and tyranny.  The cause?  Atheism has no moral foundation, except "survival of the fittest."  That's the only rule that's really acknowledged as binding.

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I do understand you don't like facts.   Those few statements are all wrong.  Atheism is not an ideology.  Atheists are not 'against' religion as much as they don't believe in any gods.  The only 'ideologies' that are 'against' religion are other religions; or faction within your own religion.  Atheism does not equate to authoritarianism because atheists don't hold any beliefs nor do they endorse any particular govt. form.  If anything, religion always ends up with authoritarianism--just about all of them.  Atheism does not really exist in that there is not a single code of thought or conduct for atheists--we are not a formal group.  The only thing atheists have in common is disbelief in any gods.  Otherwise they all go their own way. 

Survival of the fittest does not mean what you believe it to mean.  Darwin indicated that survival of the fittest had little to nothing to do with strength.  It is the ability for a species to fit into a particular environment that allows it to survive where other species don't.  Religion, and yours in particular, think the 'survival of the fittest' deals with the ability to kill off its competitors; you buy in totally with the idea that the ends justify the  means.  That is why people of your religion will do anything and everything to rid the world of those who oppose Allah; and many, many christians have the same mindset. 

You don't even know what it is you believe you are opposing.   But then, as a believer, thinking and critical thinking is not necessary, for they are skills you simply don't possess; and I must assume that is why you bow and scrape to your personal dictator in allah.   
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?<br />Then he is not omnipotent,<br />Is he able but not willing?<br />Then whence cometh evil?<br />Is he neither able or willing?<br />Then why call him god?

Baruch

Survival of the Fittest?

Republican = who has the most money

Democrat = who supports the Communist Manifesto best
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

josephpalazzo

Quote from: Absolute_Agent on August 06, 2019, 04:32:09 PM
Incredible...

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Liar. We have enough of a president who lies everyday. We don't need another liar. But I'm not surprise coming from a Muslim since your religion allows you to lie to non-Muslims. Your religion is a disgrace to the human race.

Baruch

Quote from: josephpalazzo on August 06, 2019, 04:39:12 PM
Liar. We have enough of a president who lies everyday. We don't need another liar. But I'm not surprise coming from a Muslim since your religion allows you to lie to non-Muslims. Your religion is a disgrace to the human race.

You know, you would be arrested for saying that, in GB, and other parts of the EU.  I am thankful in that degree, to be American.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Mr.Obvious

Quote from: Absolute_Agent on August 06, 2019, 02:02:30 PM
Any ideology that's fundamentally opposed to theistic beliefs.  Any time these ideologies take hold the result is authoritarianism and tyranny.  The cause?  Atheism has no moral foundation, except "survival of the fittest."  That's the only rule that's really acknowledged as binding.

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Lacking to follow, or be swayed by, theistic beliefs =/= fundamental opposition to said beliefs.
Regardless of how anybody who does not follow said theistic beliefs, might come to find him or herself to view said theistic beliefs.
If, like most people here, you make that distinction, what you are saying fails from the get-go.
"If we have to go down, we go down together!"
- Your mum, last night, requesting 69.

Atheist Mantis does not pray.

Absolute_Agent



Quote from: Mr.Obvious on August 07, 2019, 04:33:20 PM
Lacking to follow, or be swayed by, theistic beliefs =/= fundamental opposition to said beliefs.
Regardless of how anybody who does not follow said theistic beliefs, might come to find him or herself to view said theistic beliefs.
If, like most people here, you make that distinction, what you are saying fails from the get-go.

If I read you correctly are saying that not agreeing to theism is not the same as opposing it.  This seems like a philosophical distinction.  Yet in actual life, I find that anyone who does not accept theism is always opposed to it.  This is because humans are not philosophical abstractions but flesh and blood creatures.  What we don't agree with, we see as a threat, if large numbers of people hold to these ideas, and rightly so.  Politics always deals with large numbers of people so any ideology that does not accept theism WILL oppose it actively.  It will definitely represent a threat to such ideology.  A good example of how this works is that I came to this forum with no intention of sharing my beliefs, yet these were immediately attacked without any provocation.  So instead of just chatting with open-minded people about science or philosophy as I hoped, I was constantly defending myself against attacks and correcting misconceptions about my beliefs.  It was assumed I was here to convert--which wasn't the case at all.  And you can see all the bitterness unleashed against my worldview scrolling through my introduction.  Atheists find genuine theism threatening, and no philosophical argument will convince me otherwise.

Who knows, maybe it's only a misconception, but that's highly doubtful.

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josephpalazzo

Quote from: Absolute_Agent on August 07, 2019, 07:32:24 PM

A good example of how this works is that I came to this forum with no intention of sharing my beliefs, yet these were immediately attacked without any provocation.  So instead of just chatting with open-minded people about science or philosophy as I hoped, I was constantly defending myself against attacks and correcting misconceptions about my beliefs.  It was assumed I was here to convert--which wasn't the case at all.  And you can see all the bitterness unleashed against my worldview scrolling through my introduction.  Atheists find genuine theism threatening, and no philosophical argument will convince me otherwise.

Who knows, maybe it's only a misconception, but that's highly doubtful.



No, you came on this forum with a condescending attitude. And at every opportunity you were pushing your religion. So stop the drama queen. We don't care about your religion. Your arguments, which we have seen a thousand times, are silly and childish.

Absolute_Agent

#461
Quote from: josephpalazzo on August 07, 2019, 07:59:14 PM
No, you came on this forum with a condescending attitude. And at every opportunity you were pushing your religion. So stop the drama queen. We don't care about your religion. Your arguments, which we have seen a thousand times, are silly and childish.
That's unconvincing.  If any of that were honest you wouldn't find it necessary to butt into every conversation.  You're obviously threatened by my beliefs, which if they were of no account as you pretend, you wouldn't waste energy in attacking.   Where there's smoke there's fire.  If you, as most atheists, find theism a threat, then it obviously has an innate power which you feel but cannot account for--since you reject feelings as irrelevant. 

In contrast to an atheist ideology, secularism is not threatened by religion in the least.  Secularism embraces the basic truth that people are religious by nature,  and protects the maximum freedom of religion by keeping religion out of government.  Yet atheists cannot even tolerate secularism, as seen by the multiple attacks on ANY expression of religion in public.  Face the facts guys, atheists are monsters in government, pathetic at self-reflection, and intolerant of diversity & creativity; but mostly they are intolerant of theism.

Thus atheism = opposition to theistic beliefs.

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josephpalazzo

Quote from: Absolute_Agent on August 07, 2019, 10:16:37 PM
That's unconvincing.  If any of that were honest you wouldn't find it necessary to butt into every conversation.  You're obviously threatened by my beliefs, which if they were of no account as you pretend, you wouldn't waste energy in attacking.   Where there's smoke there's fire.  If you, as most atheists, find theism a threat, then it obviously has an innate power which you feel but cannot account for--since you reject feelings as irrelevant. 

In contrast to an atheist ideology, secularism is not threatened by religion in the least.  Secularism embraces the basic truth that people are religious by nature,  and protects the maximum freedom of religion by keeping religion out of government.  Yet atheists cannot even tolerate secularism, as seen by the multiple attacks on ANY expression of religion in public.  Face the facts guys, atheists are monsters in government, pathetic at self-reflection, and intolerant of diversity & creativity; but mostly they are intolerant of theism.

Thus atheism = opposition to theistic beliefs.

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Sure, atheists who have been a tiny minority for as long as 10,000 years, couldn't even get elected in the US until very recently and in some countries face a death sentence, are the oppressors. Your logic stinks.


It is only recently that atheists have been active on the political scene. Twenty years ago, atheists had to hide because of political and social repercussions. When they did become political active with the internet, it was to remind everyone that we live in a secular society, and such things as "In God we trust" on our money, prayers in the public school, or the teaching of creationism in a science curriculum had to be fought. And these were hard battles as the Christian right was ensconced in every facets of society. Now that we won a few battles, we're the oppressors, and the Christians, still a majority with a lot of power, are the victims!! Yeah, right. Get lost asshole. Your ignorance is disgusting.

Absolute_Agent

Quote from: josephpalazzo on August 08, 2019, 06:45:55 AM
Sure, atheists who have been a tiny minority for as long as 10,000 years, couldn't even get elected in the US until very recently and in some countries face a death sentence, are the oppressors. Your logic stinks.


It is only recently that atheists have been active on the political scene. Twenty years ago, atheists had to hide because of political and social repercussions. When they did become political active with the internet, it was to remind everyone that we live in a secular society, and such things as "In God we trust" on our money, prayers in the public school, or the teaching of creationism in a science curriculum had to be fought. And these were hard battles as the Christian right was ensconced in every facets of society. Now that we won a few battles, we're the oppressors, and the Christians, still a majority with a lot of power, are the victims!! Yeah, right. Get lost asshole. Your ignorance is disgusting.
How touching, you see yourselves as victims.  "In God We Trust" is what makes America who we are.  The problem is you confuse secularism with the abolishment of religious expression.  Secularism was invented by religious people, for religious people primarily.  Atheists are welcome but as a group you are incapable of maintaining a neutral attitude towards theistic paradigms, with some rare exceptions.  Now if you want political power so much, explain to me from what standard your moral foundation for just laws is derived?  You can't because there is none.  But, now you want to run things?  All I see in atheist groups is something like a pack of housecats.  Each to his own devices.  Amusing when you are kept as pets, but catastrophic when your ideology gets the upper hand. Guess where Hitler derived his eugenics program?  Yeah, Darwinism.  Yet @MikeCI over here writes a rambling treatise on how it's such a benign principle.  Everything is benign until you try to subtract God from the equation.  Then it's mayhem. 

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Cavebear

Quote from: Baruch on August 06, 2019, 04:07:05 PM
You missed some of my better posts.  It is not wrong to kill people.  It is right to kill the right people, and wrong to kill the wrong people.  As to the killing, I leave that to our authorities.

The difficulty is that it is hard to be sure of "the right people to kill".  Partial fingerprints are too often presented as complete, hair samples that were once thought undoubtable are a joke.  Even DNA tests can be pooched!  Wrongful convictions are estimated to be between 2-10%.
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!