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Straight pride parade.

Started by Munch, June 08, 2019, 01:51:17 PM

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Hijiri Byakuren

Quote from: Munch on June 09, 2019, 08:27:33 PM
no offense, well, maybe some, but modern sjws are born from modern sociology teachings in universities. My own boyfriend witnessed this himself when he attended his university in scotland to study computer engineering, and witnessed the kinds of 'enlightened' individuals who think the same thing, that everyone who isn't part of the clique is a far right nazi and they are going to save the world by battling the evil conservatives. 
Yeah, and anti-vaxxers are born from the University of Google, does that mean we should discard all knowledge gained from one of the most advanced research tools ever known to man? Obviously not.

My professors were not SJWs, nor were most of my classmates.For every anecdote you have, I probably have at least one that runs contrary and vice-versa. So I suggest we not play the anecdote game and focus on things we can all independently verify.
Speak when you have something to say, not when you have to say something.

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Shiranu

Quoteit just seems ridiculous to do so, given the times we live in.

"Given the times we live in"? You mean the times where we have a self-proclaimed Theocrat as the Vice President of the strongest Western nation? The times we live in where we have an extremely socially conservative Supreme Court? The times we live in where LGBT+ rights and protections, particularly in regards to housing and healthcare, are being undermined in multiple states across the union without any hope of the Federal government protecting them? The times we live in where the number of violent attacks on transgendered Americans, particularly transgendered Americans of colours, are on the rise?

Those times we live in? You really don't see how an event intentionally meant to steal attention from, and demean, the LGBT community and those who stand up for their rights is a problem in those times we live in?
"A little science distances you from God, but a lot of science brings you nearer to Him." - Louis Pasteur

Shiranu

By the way, multiple posters have asked now and we have yet to get a response...

Who, exactly, is oppressing the straights? Can we please get a Congressman, a President, a Governor, a Justice, a Judge, a police department, corporations and churches, anyone who is oppressing them? What laws are currently enacted that strip rights away from straight people for being straight? How many straight people are attacked on the street for being a straight couple?


Anyone?
"A little science distances you from God, but a lot of science brings you nearer to Him." - Louis Pasteur

Hakurei Reimu

Quote from: Draconic Aiur on June 09, 2019, 07:31:22 PM
So your saying it could be sinister or fake? Maybe. However its most often like the slogan "It's okay to be white" will have later sinister effects of the bigoted because they're a bunch of dicks.  The parade is for straight pride but most think of that as bigoted which is their emotions going crazy and their victimization is more important than other peoples rights or freedoms.
Can you blame them? You've already acknowledged that Straight Pride is "maybe" sinister or fake, yet you turn around to say that the parade is for straight pride as if its definitively for people taking pride in their straightness. Well, it wouldn't be a very good dog whistle if it didn't fool the unweary into thinking it's innocuous.

While it is important to defend rights and freedoms against the victimization complexes of twits, it's also important to be good stewards of those rights and freedoms. I do not believe this is a good use of the right and freedom of assembly. If straight people had from the start given gay people the same shot at life, treat them as first class citizens, and their sexuality treated as if a it were a preference for a flavor of ice cream, then I don't believe for a damn second there would have ever been or be a gay pride parade for straights to ape. Whatever it is now, the gay pride parade is an artifact of oppression, and quite obviously so. To copy an artifact of oppression, by the oppressors no less, is really damn tacky at the very least. At worst, Munch in marching in SP may be legitimizing a movement that works against his interests. That thing you are supporting, may not be the thing you think you are supporting.

While offense by proxy is nonsense I can do without, I do acknowledge that they may have a point that someone may legitimately take issue with my words and actions. Unless you are the directly injured party, I'm not interested in your offense. But if you are, I don't want to needlessly antagonize you and if I offend I want to know about it, because I'm not That Guy. I try to exercise my rights and freedoms in the most harmless way possible (unless you somehow deserve it). That is what being a good steward of my rights and freedoms means: I exercise them for my benefit, and not to the detriment of anyone else.

If this was genuinely a dig at SJW twits, I would prefer it be a more surgical strike than this ham-fisted carpetbombing. My demographic has quite enough bad karma already, thank you very much.
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Munch

Quote from: Cavebear on June 09, 2019, 08:30:19 PM
I think when it comes to minority groups, assemblies make sense.  Not to raise a new subject, but you may have read about a woman who had high testosterone levels and was ordered to take a drug that reduced it or stop participating in "womens sports".  My immediate reaction was "hell no"!  But then I read a letter that explained that womens sports only exist because it allows women to compete among themselves fairly. 

It set me back in my chair.  I don't know the right answer to this question, but I see some sense to the decision even though I don't LIKE it.  To make  some things "equal", allowances have to be made. 

I don't know if I'm making any sense here, its difficult.

And the same is true for some other groups.   I wish it wasn't so.  But the LGBTQ community needs a bit of leeway to organize and collect themselves.

One day about December 1986, I stumbled across a Dial An Atheist 800 number in the course of my job.  I called it as soon as I got home.  It mentioned a "Solstice Gathering" nearby.  I went.  Back then, I thought I was the only atheist in the world other than that "Crazy Woman".  So I stood in the doorway and saw others there, "just like me".  I just stared in shock at first...  People like me...

Everyone deserves the company of their kind in the difficult parts of their lives...   John Lennon said "Let It Be".  Paul Simon said "Diamonds On The Soles Of His Shoes".

Let it be...

You won't believe what the radio just played after I typed this.  Yes, "Let It Be".  OK, I'm hitting post...

The womens sports thing with some women having more testosterone is something needing to figure out balance wise. Its like the issue of trans sports players, where they belong on the spectrum, should people who were once men now women be allowed to compete in a womens sport, would that count as fair? Same if a woman became a man, could they compete in a mens sport the same as a regular man? This is a more complicated issue then just trying to be fair, because there are a lot of mitigating factors.

And yes, we as a species being descended from an ape like species are creatures that operate in group dynamics, so finding commonality in others is a drive most people have. That doesn't necessarily mean it has to be tied to just one aspect of what you are of course, your gender, your sexuality, maybe a disability, a common interest like gaming or reading. And yes, religion as much plays a part in that with people, just another form of group dynamic.



'Political correctness is fascism pretending to be manners' - George Carlin

Draconic Aiur

Quote from: Hijiri Byakuren on June 09, 2019, 07:59:20 PM
Bitch I don’t even have television service and I hardly ever listen to my car’s radio. Your rants about “the media” mean nothing to me. I have taken actual university courses on this shit. I know the historical and sociological context of anti-lgbt oppression and heterosexual hegemony. If I say straight people aren’t oppressed, it’s because they aren’t. If you don’t want my educated opinion, feel free to fuck off. I didn’t pay thousands of dollars to study this shit just to have some jackoff recite Conservapedia bullshit to me.

Yet I am going to University level shit too, so don't play the "educated scholar" in front of an educated scholar and expect that your better because your opinion comes from your elitism.  Also stop stereotyping the left. Like all of us are the same. Seriously we are not apparently.

Hakurei Reimu

Quote from: Shiranu on June 09, 2019, 08:38:50 PM
Who, exactly, is oppressing the straights? Can we please get a Congressman, a President, a Governor, a Justice, a Judge, a police department, corporations and churches, anyone who is oppressing them? What laws are currently enacted that strip rights away from straight people for being straight? How many straight people are attacked on the street for being a straight couple?
Let me point out that pointing to another demographic in demonstration, even if it supports the notion of an ostensible victim victimizing an ostensible victimizer, is a red herring fallacy. You know who you are.
Warning: Don't Tease The Miko!
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Spinny Miko Avatar shamelessly ripped off from Iosys' Neko Miko Reimu

Munch

Quote from: Shiranu on June 09, 2019, 08:36:34 PM
"Given the times we live in"? You mean the times where we have a self-proclaimed Theocrat as the Vice President of the strongest Western nation? The times we live in where we have an extremely socially conservative Supreme Court? The times we live in where LGBT+ rights and protections, particularly in regards to housing and healthcare, are being undermined in multiple states across the union without any hope of the Federal government protecting them? The times we live in where the number of violent attacks on transgendered Americans, particularly transgendered Americans of colours, are on the rise?

Those times we live in? You really don't see how an event intentionally meant to steal attention from, and demean, the LGBT community and those who stand up for their rights is a problem in those times we live in?

are straight people having a parade going to stop gay marriage? Will it cause them to stop accepting blood donations from LGBTQ? Will is cause segregation as a result? I'm inclined to say no.
Also, its only people like yourself who create such a negative stigma around something like this that makes it an issue. Its like having a beer festival, yet if someone said alcohol killed a family member and so promoting beer drinking is offensive, should they stop such an event? Hardly, people just need to learn to suck it up.
'Political correctness is fascism pretending to be manners' - George Carlin

Draconic Aiur

Quote from: Hakurei Reimu on June 09, 2019, 08:48:45 PM
Can you blame them? You've already acknowledged that Straight Pride is "maybe" sinister or fake, yet you turn around to say that the parade is for straight pride as if its definitively for people taking pride in their straightness. Well, it wouldn't be a very good dog whistle if it didn't fool the unweary into thinking it's innocuous.

While it is important to defend rights and freedoms against the victimization complexes of twits, it's also important to be good stewards of those rights and freedoms. I do not believe this is a good use of the right and freedom of assembly. If straight people had from the start given gay people the same shot at life, treat them as first class citizens, and their sexuality treated as if a it were a preference for a flavor of ice cream, then I don't believe for a damn second there would have ever been or be a gay pride parade for straights to ape. Whatever it is now, the gay pride parade is an artifact of oppression, and quite obviously so. To copy an artifact of oppression, by the oppressors no less, is really damn tacky at the very least. At worst, Munch in marching in SP may be legitimizing a movement that works against his interests. That thing you are supporting, may not be the thing you think you are supporting.

While offense by proxy is nonsense I can do without, I do acknowledge that they may have a point that someone may legitimately take issue with my words and actions. Unless you are the directly injured party, I'm not interested in your offense. But if you are, I don't want to needlessly antagonize you and if I offend I want to know about it, because I'm not That Guy. I try to exercise my rights and freedoms in the most harmless way possible (unless you somehow deserve it). That is what being a good steward of my rights and freedoms means: I exercise them for my benefit, and not to the detriment of anyone else.

If this was genuinely a dig at SJW twits, I would prefer it be a more surgical strike than this ham-fisted carpetbombing. My demographic has quite enough bad karma already, thank you very much.

I was saying they "MIGHT" have one. Not admitting they are sinister. Stop cherry picking. Also the "sins of the father" and victimization based on the past are getting old really fast. Cultural and demographic appropriation is terrible.

Hakurei Reimu

Quote from: Draconic Aiur on June 09, 2019, 08:57:46 PM
I was saying they "MIGHT" have one. Not admitting they are sinister. Stop cherry picking.
I did not cherry pick. "MIGHT" means you acknowledge the possibility. That's all I need and all I took from that.

Quote
Also the "sins of the father" and victimization based on the past are getting old really fast. Cultural and demographic appropriation is terrible.
It's a reality. People do judge based on what others in your group do and did. It's part of the reason why we're in this clusterfuck right now, and you ignore it at your peril.
Warning: Don't Tease The Miko!
(she bites!)
Spinny Miko Avatar shamelessly ripped off from Iosys' Neko Miko Reimu

Munch

Quote from: Hakurei Reimu on June 09, 2019, 09:02:15 PM
It's a reality. People do judge based on what others in your group do and did. It's part of the reason why we're in this clusterfuck right now, and you ignore it at your peril.

Well fact is, these things are happening now, but that doesn't mean people shouldn't get to call others out on it. We live in a time of heavily social and political tension, and the open access to debate and conversation so easily now means there will be more shit flung either end of the spectrum.
'Political correctness is fascism pretending to be manners' - George Carlin

Hijiri Byakuren

Quote from: Draconic Aiur on June 09, 2019, 08:51:54 PMYet I am going to University level shit too, so don't play the "educated scholar" in front of an educated scholar and expect that your better because your opinion comes from your elitism.
"Elitism?" Lol, okay bud, now I know you're bullshitting.

"University level shit" is vague enough to include math 100, and certainly doesn't mean you've studied sociology (or more importantly passed the class). Also, your attempt at ad hominem doesn't change the fact that you clearly don't know your shit. You haven't even been able to name the oppressor(s) that are supposedly trying to take away straight rights. And no, "teh ebul SJWs" don't count. Which congressman, president, governor, justice, judge, police department, corporation, or church is exercising power on a large enough scale to be a credible threat to straight people? Back up your bullshit or STFU.
Speak when you have something to say, not when you have to say something.

Sargon The Grape - My Youtube Channel

Draconic Aiur


Shiranu

Quoteare straight people having a parade going to stop gay marriage?

Yes.


Edit - I misread that as, "having a parade to stop gay marriage.". However those parades against LGBT+ rights do lead to an energized voting base that elects politicians who want to deny these groups of their rights, so in a not-so-very abstract way, they do still stop gay marriage.

QuoteWill it cause them to stop accepting blood donations from LGBTQ?

If certain churches and organizations had their way, probably.

QuoteWill is cause segregation as a result?

Probably not, since segregation is not what the anti-LGBT+ community want anyways.






None of which actually addressed the question we have asked you multiple times; how many straight rights are under attack? What laws currently put limitations and restrictions upon the rights of straight people? How many elected officials or people of power are actively (or even suggesting) oppression of straight people? How many straight people are being bullied, beaten, committing suicide, being killed because they are straight?
"A little science distances you from God, but a lot of science brings you nearer to Him." - Louis Pasteur

Hydra009

Quote from: Shiranu on June 09, 2019, 08:36:34 PM
"Given the times we live in"? You mean the times where we have a self-proclaimed Theocrat as the Vice President of the strongest Western nation? The times we live in where we have an extremely socially conservative Supreme Court? The times we live in where LGBT+ rights and protections, particularly in regards to housing and healthcare, are being undermined in multiple states across the union without any hope of the Federal government protecting them? The times we live in where the number of violent attacks on transgendered Americans, particularly transgendered Americans of colours, are on the rise?

Those times we live in? You really don't see how an event intentionally meant to steal attention from, and demean, the LGBT community and those who stand up for their rights is a problem in those times we live in?
The POTUS also floated the idea of straight up banning transgendered people from the military simply for being transgendered.