Christianity Defined

[Mike Cl]

I find it humorous that most christians think their particular Jesus was named Jesus Christ.  Most don't realize that 'Christ' is a title, not a name.  Jesus was a popular name in that time, since it means savior, same as the name Joshua--and he is the one who conquered Jericho in the Promised Land.  Moses never got to the promised land--Joshua conquered it.  So Jews were looking for another savior from the Romans.  Christ means anointed one, and that is what the Jews did, they anointed leaders and kings with sacred oil as a christ.  Usually that was a king and meant that God appointed that particular king (or leader).  From this flows the concept of the divine right of kings.   Yet, most christians think Jesus Christ is one particular man. 

[Unbeliever]

There were false messiahs.  Doesn't really matter if one was named Jesus or not.  The idea that the messiah is false, pretty much cuts the Christians off at the knees regardless.

False Messiah = the Romans weren't magically destroyed.

Instead they were just subsumed into a religious hierarchy, and became the Roman Catholic Church.

[Unbeliever]

All messiahs are false by logic.  If one was real, we wouldn't be sitting around discussing it, would we?

Jesus was a false messiah, or his character in the story was, because he didn't meet the qualifications to even be considered "The Messiah" to the Jews of the time:



Why Jews Don't Believe in Jesus

Jews do not accept Jesus as the messiah because:

1.Jesus did not fulfill the messianic prophecies.
2.Jesus did not embody the personal qualifications of the Messiah.
3.Biblical verses "referring" to Jesus are mistranslations.
4.Jewish belief is based on national revelation.

I don't know of any other messiahs that any other religious groups were expecting to come.

[Unbeliever]

Over at Debating Christianity a Christian objected to my saying that Christians pretend to eat the flesh of Christ and drink Christ's blood--so he thinks it's the real deal!

You could accuse them of cannibalism, but they'd probably be offended by that, as well! :-P

[Baruch]

Instead they were just subsumed into a religious hierarchy, and became the Roman Catholic Church.

Anarchists don't like that.  That is why the hermits and monks/nuns had to be subsumed into the hierarchy.  Controlled opposition.

[Baruch]

And many, many others.

Mithras etc ... all of which are ideas/memes held by some people at some time.  Not something to be ignored, because your memes are superior.

[Baruch]

The Jesus story could very easily be the rehashing of typical Cynic: a member of a school of ancient Greek philosophers founded by Antisthenes, marked by an ostentatious contempt for ease and pleasure. The movement flourished in the 3rd century BC and revived in the 1st century AD.

The Gospel of Thomas most likely came from such a source.

Per John Dominic Crossan.  But that discounts Kabbalah.  The Cynic view would say that Christianity was always Gentile and pagan.

[Baruch]

You could accuse them of cannibalism, but they'd probably be offended by that, as well! :-P

They were accused of cannibalism, by the ignorant.  And Jews still are (we kidnap Gentile children to use their blood to make Passover matzah).

[Cavebear]

Over at Debating Christianity a Christian objected to my saying that Christians pretend to eat the flesh of Christ and drink Christ's blood--so he thinks it's the real deal!

Cannibalism, in the sense of incorporating the power of your enemies, has a long history.

[Cavebear]

They were accused of cannibalism, by the ignorant.  And Jews still are (we kidnap Gentile children to use their blood to make Passover matzah).

Well, obviously that isn't true.  Matzah isnt red.  Or were only white corpuscles used?

[Cavebear]

Per John Dominic Crossan.  But that discounts Kabbalah.  The Cynic view would say that Christianity was always Gentile and pagan.

"Pagan" is such an interesting term.  The many-deity ancient Greeks would have called me that.  The medieval Catholics and Protestants would have called me that (if polite enough not to say "heretic").  Even a "non-adherent" friend says I am technically.  And each would have a separate and different definition

I suppose what it really means is "not one of us".

[Baruch]

Well, obviously that isn't true.  Matzah isnt red.  Or were only white corpuscles used?

It was called the "blood libel" ... thousands of Jews were murdered by Gentiles over this conspiracy theory.

[Baruch]

"Pagan" is such an interesting term.  The many-deity ancient Greeks would have called me that.  The medieval Catholics and Protestants would have called me that (if polite enough not to say "heretic").  Even a "non-adherent" friend says I am technically.  And each would have a separate and different definition

I suppose what it really means is "not one of us".

"pagani" = country bumpkin.  Christians originally were urban proletariat, not peasant.

[Blackleaf]

Very good video. I'm keeping this one saved.

[Mike Cl]

Very good video. I'm keeping this one saved.

And check out Carrier's latest book!  It is the best of the Jesus was not an actual person books.