Author Topic: Evolution Forced  (Read 1239 times)

Offline Cavebear

Re: Evolution Forced
« Reply #30 on: August 05, 2019, 02:40:33 PM »
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Are you sure? Antelopes probably can. Also grey wolves? Not to mention wolves can run long in freezing degrees.

Antelopes can't.  That's how wolves catch them.  Wolves do the heat exhaustion thing too, though they have to do it in series (panting is their only cooling method).  I suspect that is why we get along with dogs.   Same hunting techniques "back then".   
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Offline drunkenshoe

Re: Evolution Forced
« Reply #31 on: August 05, 2019, 02:42:05 PM »
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A pronghorn can run at a sustained speed of 30 mph for about an hour. At that speed it would take them about 52 minutes to run a marathon. World record for a mere human is a little over two hours.

That's like 48 kmh. Well, that's what you call stamina. Thank goodness they don't eat meat,lol. 
'the wise man does not seek enlightenment, he waits for it. so while ı was waiting, it occurred to me that seeking perplexity might be more fun.’ - lu-tze

Offline drunkenshoe

Re: Evolution Forced
« Reply #32 on: August 05, 2019, 02:49:38 PM »
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Antelopes can't.  That's how wolves catch them.  Wolves do the heat exhaustion thing too, though they have to do it in series (panting is their only cooling method).  I suspect that is why we get along with dogs.   Same hunting techniques "back then".

Oh yeah wolves. 40 mph. But as Pop posted antelopes do have really good stamina in the long run compared to humans. But then Unbeliever is right too, apparently humans can outrun most animals. 

Probably, all apex predators have excellent stamina. Grey wolves are apex predators. Actually, it just ringed a bell, this animal could even be the stamina champion. Not sure. I think there was a docu about this.
« Last Edit: August 05, 2019, 02:56:13 PM by drunkenshoe »
'the wise man does not seek enlightenment, he waits for it. so while ı was waiting, it occurred to me that seeking perplexity might be more fun.’ - lu-tze

Offline Cavebear

Re: Evolution Forced
« Reply #33 on: August 05, 2019, 02:53:06 PM »
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Oh they are called 'feral' in English. They are different. I think I even know a few feral related ones around. Just a guess of course. They are jaw dropping hunters and can jump so high it is a scene. LOL well they are cats after all, but it is something else.   

Americans house cats are so big. I've haven't seen a small or a medium sized one there yet. They probbaly have a serious impact on the nature around outside.

Small feral cats don't survive well.  The big ones just take any food they catch.

Housecats, on the other paw, do quite well at all sizes.  I have a 6 pound female Siamese, a 10 pound Female Tonkinese, and a 14 pound Orange Calico male domestic short hair*.  I had a 16 pound orange male domestic short hair before, and he could jump 6' straight up.  And with him, there was a Tuxedo female who was apparently and English Cobby cat.  Cobbies are all muscle.  It was "interesting" with those two...

* Yes Marley is a MALE calico cat.  Its rather rare.  It takes 2 X chromosomes, so he has to be a triploid if I understand it right.  Too bad he was neutered when I got him...
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Re: Evolution Forced
« Reply #34 on: August 05, 2019, 03:01:52 PM »
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A pronghorn can run at a sustained speed of 30 mph for about an hour. At that speed it would take them about 52 minutes to run a marathon. World record for a mere human is a little over two hours.

Pronghorns indeed have impressive speed and stamina, but nowhere near a human's speed and endurance for the last 100 years. It's only because it's not sporting that we don't hunt them from helicopters -- though Sarah Palin authorized hunting wolves from Helicopters and Obama put the kibosh on it.
Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the War Room! -- President Merkin Muffley

My mom was a religious fundamentalist. Plus, she didn't have a mouth. It's an unusual combination. -- Bender Bending Rodriguez

Offline Cavebear

Re: Evolution Forced
« Reply #35 on: August 05, 2019, 03:02:44 PM »
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Oh yeah wolves. 40 mph. But as Pop posted antelopes do have really good stamina in the long run compared to humans. But then Unbeliever is right too, apparently humans can outrun most animals. 

Probably, all apex predators have excellent stamina. Grey wolves are apex predators. Actually, it just ringed a bell, this animal could even be the stamina champion. Not sure. I think there was a docu about this.

I had to check about the antelope.  They are good runners.  But there seems to be documentary evidence from David Attenborough of Bushmen running down an antelope on open plains in high heat.  And it reminded me that it is called "persistence hunting".  Apparently, there is no prey animal a physically-fit human can't run down in the proper circumstances.
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Offline drunkenshoe

Re: Evolution Forced
« Reply #36 on: August 05, 2019, 03:08:05 PM »
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Small feral cats don't survive well.  The big ones just take any food they catch.

Housecats, on the other paw, do quite well at all sizes.  I have a 6 pound female Siamese, a 10 pound Female Tonkinese, and a 14 pound Orange Calico male domestic short hair*.  I had a 16 pound orange male domestic short hair before, and he could jump 6' straight up.  And with him, there was a Tuxedo female who was apparently and English Cobby cat.  Cobbies are all muscle.  It was "interesting" with those two...

* Yes Marley is a MALE calico cat.  Its rather rare.  It takes 2 X chromosomes, so he has to be a triploid if I understand it right.  Too bad he was neutered when I got him...

Ooo quite a family. We've only looked after street strays so far. Taken as a kitten. Current one, Peanut. Female, 3kg. Short haired, 8,5 year old multicoloured and a bitch. LOL She thinks she is one of the big cats, us. My dad looks after a group of cats at the summer house and she treats them very badly. She is the royalty you see. She is sweet on a big, dark tabby male this summer though. Figures. She screams at him full throttle and then watches him for hours close and he rolls on the floor show her his belly. Loool. I have never looked after a cat like this one. She is properly abstinate, distant, but wants attention all the time too. Come, go.  Oh my god, I just realised my cat has borderline personality disorder LOOL

'the wise man does not seek enlightenment, he waits for it. so while ı was waiting, it occurred to me that seeking perplexity might be more fun.’ - lu-tze

Offline Cavebear

Re: Evolution Forced
« Reply #37 on: August 05, 2019, 03:08:50 PM »
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Pronghorns indeed have impressive speed and stamina, but nowhere near a human's speed and endurance for the last 100 years. It's only because it's not sporting that we don't hunt them from helicopters -- though Sarah Palin authorized hunting wolves from Helicopters and Obama put the kibosh on it.

You mentioned helicoptors.  Forgive me repeating an anecdote about that.  Credit Ed Zern...

"In WWII in North Africa, 2 British pilots boasted of their hunting skills and wagered 2 pints of cold Stout on who could bag a lion first.  The first guy took up his rifle and set off.  The 2nd guy got in his airplane, shot the hell out of the nearest lion and returned to base and drank both Stouts.

Thus proving that the shortest distance between two pints is a strafed lion".

« Last Edit: August 05, 2019, 03:20:00 PM by Cavebear »
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Re: Evolution Forced
« Reply #38 on: August 05, 2019, 03:10:53 PM »
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Thus proving that the shortest distance between two pints is a strafed lion".

I'd tell my kids this dad joke, but they'd probably have to have strafing explained to them. I guess that's a good thing that kids rarely have reason to know what that means.
Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the War Room! -- President Merkin Muffley

My mom was a religious fundamentalist. Plus, she didn't have a mouth. It's an unusual combination. -- Bender Bending Rodriguez

Offline PopeyesPappy

Re: Evolution Forced
« Reply #39 on: August 05, 2019, 03:12:46 PM »
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I had to check about the antelope.  They are good runners.  But there seems to be documentary evidence from David Attenborough of Bushmen running down an antelope on open plains in high heat.  And it reminded me that it is called "persistence hunting".  Apparently, there is no prey animal a physically-fit human can't run down in the proper circumstances.

There are 135 different species of antelope. If Attenborough documented Bushmen running down an antelope on open plains in high heat it probably wasn't a pronghorn.
Save a life. Adopt a Greyhound.


Offline Cavebear

Re: Evolution Forced
« Reply #40 on: August 05, 2019, 03:18:11 PM »
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Ooo quite a family. We've only looked after street strays so far. Taken as a kitten. Current one, Peanut. Female, 3kg. Short haired, 8,5 year old multicoloured and a bitch. LOL She thinks she is one of the big cats, us. My dad looks after a group of cats at the summer house and she treats them very badly. She is the royalty you see. She is sweet on a big, dark tabby male this summer though. Figures. She screams at him full throttle and then watches him for hours close and he rolls on the floor show her his belly. Loool. I have never looked after a cat like this one. She is properly abstinate, distant, but wants attention all the time too. Come, go.  Oh my god, I just realised my cat has borderline personality disorder LOOL

From our POV, ALL cats have personality disorders.  "Dogs have masters; Cats have staff", etc.  ;)  But from their POV, they are entirely rational.  IOW, eat any food you can catch or steal (in my house, there is the infamous chicken thigh incident), sleep on whatever is warm, stay near anything that will protect you, hide from threats, bury your poop, and don't waste energy.

And pretend to obey the Human who picks the Catnip Leaves and opens the Cans Of Stinky Goodness!

MOL!*

*"Meowing Out Loud"  I invented that...
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Offline drunkenshoe

Re: Evolution Forced
« Reply #41 on: August 05, 2019, 03:27:54 PM »
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From our POV, ALL cats have personality disorders.  "Dogs have masters; Cats have staff", etc.  ;)  But from their POV, they are entirely rational.  IOW, eat any food you can catch or steal (in my house, there is the infamous chicken thigh incident), sleep on whatever is warm, stay near anything that will protect you, hide from threats, bury your poop, and don't waste energy.

And pretend to obey the Human who picks the Catnip Leaves and opens the Cans Of Stinky Goodness!

MOL!*

*"Meowing Out Loud"  I invented that...

LOL I know. But see, she doesn't do that. She doesn't steal food! All of the others did. And she eats very little. She doesn't even ask for meat or fish when cooked freshly scent all over everywhere. She meows for certain little kind of fish we have in the country at north, and it comes here rarely. But it must be very fresh. OK I'll give her that, it is worth a lot. But I give her meat, I give her salmon -and I don't share my salmon!- she turns her head away, lol.

All my other cats used to declare war on the kitchen when cooking fish. And they always had their portion to begin with. Different personality.

 
'the wise man does not seek enlightenment, he waits for it. so while ı was waiting, it occurred to me that seeking perplexity might be more fun.’ - lu-tze

Offline Cavebear

Re: Evolution Forced
« Reply #42 on: August 05, 2019, 03:29:25 PM »
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There are 135 different species of antelope. If Attenborough documented Bushmen running down an antelope on open plains in high heat it probably wasn't a pronghorn.

You may be correct.  I can't prove that one way or another and won't try.  There can always be an exception.  And, for example, you couldn't kill a crocodile that way.  For all I know, the only pronghorn an early human ever ate was killed by ambush.  But the basic idea remains.

But, heh-heh, I will remind you that You made the claim about the Pronghorn being the exception.  Doesn't that place the burden of proof on you?  ;)

Don't worry about it.  In general, persistence hunting was successful and humans are one of the very few who could and can do it.

Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Offline Cavebear

Re: Evolution Forced
« Reply #43 on: August 05, 2019, 03:38:44 PM »
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I'd tell my kids this dad joke, but they'd probably have to have strafing explained to them. I guess that's a good thing that kids rarely have reason to know what that means.

They have probably seen more violence in cartoons, but I agree.  If they haven't, no need to push it. 

I know a few long, complicated puns, but they all seem wrong for children.  I'm not sure whether that says more about me or the nature of complicated puns... But have you heard the one about Sherlock Holmes and the tent?

" Sherlock Holmes and Dr. Watson decide to go on a camping trip. After dinner and a bottle of wine, they lay down for the night, and go to sleep in their tent.

Some hours later, Holmes awoke and nudged his faithful friend.

"Watson, look up at the sky and tell me what you see."

Watson replied, "I see millions of stars."

"What does that tell you?"

Watson pondered for a minute.

"Astronomically, it tells me that there are millions of galaxies and potentially billions of planets."
"Astrologically, I observe that Saturn is in Leo."
"Horologically, I deduce that the time is approximately a quarter past three."
"Meteorologically, I suspect that we will have a beautiful day tomorrow."
"What does it tell you, Holmes?"

Holmes was silent for a minute, then spoke: "Watson, you idiot. Someone has stolen our tent!
"
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Re: Evolution Forced
« Reply #44 on: August 05, 2019, 03:50:14 PM »
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There are 135 different species of antelope. If Attenborough documented Bushmen running down an antelope on open plains in high heat it probably wasn't a pronghorn.

Pronghorns are colloquially called antelope, but they're not in that family. Antelope have antlers and pronghorns have, well, horns. Their closest living relatives are giraffes.
Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the War Room! -- President Merkin Muffley

My mom was a religious fundamentalist. Plus, she didn't have a mouth. It's an unusual combination. -- Bender Bending Rodriguez

 

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