### Author Topic: How many GODS do you have?  (Read 11375 times)

#### Baruch

##### Re: How many GODS do you have?
« Reply #1110 on: August 14, 2019, 01:55:34 PM »
Comparing genetic programming to computer programming??? Every biologists must be rolling their eyes...

Where is your computer degree?  Oh yes, PhD means ... I know everything ;-)  Too bad for you, I worked with medical doctors.  None of them are atheists, because they don't have to know everything, they are gods ;-))

Next you will be telling me that quantum computers change everything (sarc).  Actually quantum algorithms running on quantum computers are more capable than genetic programming.  That is why all the development money has moved into that, and dropped out from the other AI scams.
« Last Edit: August 14, 2019, 01:57:09 PM by Baruch »
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luu shalmaata luu baltβaata
May you be well, may you be healthy

#### aileron

##### Re: How many GODS do you have?
« Reply #1111 on: August 14, 2019, 02:25:03 PM »
So yeah, in a subject I know something about, you could learn from me.  I am happy to learn in areas where I am deficient (if they exist ;-)).

I make a living in genetic programming, among other so-called AI techniques. I hate the term since my kids and even dog show a level of intelligence I cannot get from a computer. Here comes the big "however." However, we're barely getting started.

I'll first take issue with your use of "carefully selected pseudo-random number". Simply put, no. We're using quantum-effect RNG that we regularly check for entropy. I'm puzzled why you think genetic programming would need pseudorandom numbers.

As far as the computer not doing anything that humans didn't tell it to do, that's true only in the most trivial of senses. You did not address my point that the output of our genetic programming finds ways to solve complex problems that no human really understands.

We've been in the age of Turing complete machines, what, approaching seven decades? Where do you think we'll be in seven centuries? What about seven millenia? What about giving evolution 13 billion years to work?

Now we're both stating ways that Turing complete machines can exist without direction or planning. My way supposes physical laws and mathematics that we know exist and prove increasingly powerful in their predictive ability. You postulate one that has all that plus personality, omniscience, omnipotence, desires, emotion, and a lot more. You're making a profligate assumption. Occam's Razor is more likely to shave your hypothesis than mine.
Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the War Room! -- President Merkin Muffley

My mom was a religious fundamentalist. Plus, she didn't have a mouth. It's an unusual combination. -- Bender Bending Rodriguez

#### aileron

##### Re: How many GODS do you have?
« Reply #1112 on: August 14, 2019, 02:30:55 PM »
Comparing genetic programming to computer programming??? Every biologists must be rolling their eyes...

Not at all, Joe. Genetic programming is an emerging technology in computer science that was inspired by and is modeled on limited aspects of evolution, and is often applied to solving problems in microbiology. The non-biologists in the field hopefully understand the key difference is that it has a goal in mind, whereas evolution has no goal in mind.
« Last Edit: August 14, 2019, 02:33:40 PM by aileron »
Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the War Room! -- President Merkin Muffley

My mom was a religious fundamentalist. Plus, she didn't have a mouth. It's an unusual combination. -- Bender Bending Rodriguez

#### Hydra009

##### Re: How many GODS do you have?
« Reply #1113 on: August 14, 2019, 02:46:00 PM »
Near death is just a name given.
That does not mean that the bloke is not dead.
Bruh....

Quick rule of thumb since you're having a surprisingly hard time telling near death apart from death.

Near death:  wakes up and walks around after flatlining for a while

Death:  doesn't move, goes cold, rigor mortis, buried/cremated

Was that really so difficult?

#### aileron

##### Re: How many GODS do you have?
« Reply #1114 on: August 14, 2019, 02:51:23 PM »
Bruh....

Quick rule of thumb since you're having a surprisingly hard time telling near death apart from death.

Near death:  wakes up and walks around after flatlining for a while

Death:  doesn't move, goes cold, rigor mortis, buried/cremated

Was that really so difficult?

For him... Apparently.
Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the War Room! -- President Merkin Muffley

My mom was a religious fundamentalist. Plus, she didn't have a mouth. It's an unusual combination. -- Bender Bending Rodriguez

#### Unbeliever

##### Re: How many GODS do you have?
« Reply #1115 on: August 14, 2019, 03:55:51 PM »
What's so hard to understand about an NDE - a not-death experience?
"The Christian resolution to find the world ugly and bad has made the world ugly and bad.β
Friedrich Nietzsche

#### josephpalazzo

##### Re: How many GODS do you have?
« Reply #1116 on: August 14, 2019, 05:34:56 PM »
What's so hard to understand about an NDE - a not-death experience?
Not as hard as rigor mortis ...
βReligion was invented when the first con man met the first fool.β - Mark Twain

#### Unbeliever

##### Re: How many GODS do you have?
« Reply #1117 on: August 14, 2019, 05:36:12 PM »
Yeah, I've heard it said that a hard body is good to find - but not when it's in rigor mortis! LOL
"The Christian resolution to find the world ugly and bad has made the world ugly and bad.β
Friedrich Nietzsche

#### aileron

##### Re: How many GODS do you have?
« Reply #1118 on: August 14, 2019, 06:30:12 PM »
Yeah, I've heard it said that a hard body is good to find - but not when it's in rigor mortis! LOL

Unless you're into that sort of thing.
Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the War Room! -- President Merkin Muffley

My mom was a religious fundamentalist. Plus, she didn't have a mouth. It's an unusual combination. -- Bender Bending Rodriguez

#### Unbeliever

##### Re: How many GODS do you have?
« Reply #1119 on: August 14, 2019, 06:31:18 PM »
Yeah, as Seinfeld might say, "not that there's anything wrong with that..."   LOL
"The Christian resolution to find the world ugly and bad has made the world ugly and bad.β
Friedrich Nietzsche

#### Baruch

##### Re: How many GODS do you have?
« Reply #1120 on: August 14, 2019, 06:33:18 PM »
I make a living in genetic programming, among other so-called AI techniques. I hate the term since my kids and even dog show a level of intelligence I cannot get from a computer. Here comes the big "however." However, we're barely getting started.

I'll first take issue with your use of "carefully selected pseudo-random number". Simply put, no. We're using quantum-effect RNG that we regularly check for entropy. I'm puzzled why you think genetic programming would need pseudorandom numbers.

As far as the computer not doing anything that humans didn't tell it to do, that's true only in the most trivial of senses. You did not address my point that the output of our genetic programming finds ways to solve complex problems that no human really understands.

We've been in the age of Turing complete machines, what, approaching seven decades? Where do you think we'll be in seven centuries? What about seven millenia? What about giving evolution 13 billion years to work?

Now we're both stating ways that Turing complete machines can exist without direction or planning. My way supposes physical laws and mathematics that we know exist and prove increasingly powerful in their predictive ability. You postulate one that has all that plus personality, omniscience, omnipotence, desires, emotion, and a lot more. You're making a profligate assumption. Occam's Razor is more likely to shave your hypothesis than mine.

I made a living from working for the most evil organization on Earth ... US Federal Government.  I have a satellite laser pointed at you right now ;-)

Yes, there are more details to X kind of algorithm or Y kind of programming language.  All those things matter.  I know, been doing computers since the 1970s.  And that is a fine thing to know/do.  My speciality was database management.  But I got into cryptology on the side, because I was bored.  So no need to think I attacked your profession.  Even if you were a used car salesman, I wouldn't judge.  It happens I do know a lot about a couple of things.  Including computer science.  You can have your own philosophy of math/science ... but that doesn't make that math/science.  It is an interpretation.  As an engineer/programmer, I don't have the knockers for original research.  But thanks to Google, I don't have to.  Did you see the great 4 part series on deep learning/3-level neural nets?

These guys do wonderful stuff, on a lot of technical topics.  Better than my college professors ;-)

If you want to share what you know of genetic programming, in the computer section of this web site, if it isn't proprietary, then I would be happy to read.

I can't show you my computer work, because it is classified.  There are countless topics now on algorithms and computer languages, that nuances all this Turing Machine stuff.  But at the bottom, it is just a Turing Machine on paper from 1938.  And that doesn't touch all the engineering stuff at someplace like IEEE Spectrum.  But computers aren't magic, not even the quantum kind.  The problem with technology, and the public domain, is that so many people think this is a "Wishing Tree".  That any scifi that someone can imagine, is an eventual, and cheap, technical thing.
« Last Edit: August 14, 2019, 06:48:30 PM by Baruch »
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luu shalmaata luu baltβaata
May you be well, may you be healthy

#### Baruch

##### Re: How many GODS do you have?
« Reply #1121 on: August 14, 2019, 06:34:43 PM »
Yeah, I've heard it said that a hard body is good to find - but not when it's in rigor mortis! LOL

You just excited all the necrophile and zombies.  Thanks!
πππππππππππππππππππππππππ
luu shalmaata luu baltβaata
May you be well, may you be healthy

#### Baruch

##### Re: How many GODS do you have?
« Reply #1122 on: August 14, 2019, 06:36:27 PM »
Yeah, as Seinfeld might say, "not that there's anything wrong with that..."   LOL

I hope that zombies rape Seinfeld (sarc)
πππππππππππππππππππππππππ
luu shalmaata luu baltβaata
May you be well, may you be healthy

#### aileron

##### Re: How many GODS do you have?
« Reply #1123 on: August 14, 2019, 06:42:27 PM »
I made a living from working for the most evil organization on Earth ... US Federal Government.  I have a satellite laser pointed at you right now ;-)

I'll take a look at the vid a bit later, and we can move this to the computing topic area. I'm not deluded into thinking that AI is real - for now. It's just a ridiculous marketing word and I hate the term. I just don't see where the magic enters into the chain from particle to brain whether intelligence or consciousness.
Gentlemen, you can't fight in here! This is the War Room! -- President Merkin Muffley

My mom was a religious fundamentalist. Plus, she didn't have a mouth. It's an unusual combination. -- Bender Bending Rodriguez

#### Baruch

##### Re: How many GODS do you have?
« Reply #1124 on: August 14, 2019, 06:53:27 PM »