How many GODS do you have?

[Arik]

Dearheart, the thinking that people have mind powers, souls and whatnot is somewhere where we've already been. To return to that thinking is going backwards, downwards down that train of steps in that cartoon you like showing. No, the future steps in our evolution is not going to be towards mind powers in the way you're thinking of them. When it's going to happen, it's going to be granting the powers of the mind through mind/machine interfaces augmenting our bodies with purpose-built machines, and granting immortality by making us actually immortal. People have tried your woo approach, and it doesn't work. When people try hard-nosed scientific investigation, it works and extremely well. I know where I'm putting my money.

You forget one important thing my friend and that is that humans are not only made of body.

You can do all the scientific investigation that you wish but that will not give you peace of mind and permanent happiness that is why by relying on that you will never be able fulfill the most human aspiration and longing.

You call it "worship" because it's the only way you can understand our zeal for it. It is so unlike worship of gods it is not even in the same category. There is no ritual we perform towards materialism to affirm our faiths, no creed we follow, no silly hats we wear, it's just a deep understanding of what we're talking about, and the fact that it actually makes sense of the world we see is the amazing part. There's simply no room for your woo. Science and the hard-nosed investigation and critical scrutiny of ideas is what has given us the wonders of the cosmological perspective, the understanding of the world of the very small, and the keys to the universe.

You can become the most expert in physical science but once again this science is unable to satisfy the human desire and longing for peace of mind and total bliss.

In short, we are so zealous, not because we don't understand the designs of entities unknown but assumed, but because we do understand to a substantial degree the entities we have verified and investigated.
Every cluless moron says the exact same thing: "You're confused; I'm talking sense; all people who are woke will agree with me." It gets old after a while.

The day you will have finish to investigate everything within this material dimension you still will be billions of miles away from any solution for the simple reason that what your subconscious wish does not belong in this material dimension.

All the best anyway.

[Cavebear]

You forget one important thing my friend and that is that humans are not only made of body.

You can do all the scientific investigation that you wish but that will not give you peace of mind and permanent happiness that is why by relying on that you will never be able fulfill the most human aspiration and longing.

You can become the most expert in physical science but once again this science is unable to satisfy the human desire and longing for peace of mind and total bliss.

The day you will have finish to investigate everything within this material dimension you still will be billions of miles away from any solution for the simple reason that what your subconscious wish does not belong in this material dimension.

All the best anyway.

Your assumption that we humans are not made of body is the basis of the failure of your understanding of reality.  There is a clear line of evidence that humans are just one of a long string on animals from the simplest to the most complex.    We are animals just as an octopus or microbe is.   We live in a physical existence and die in it.  We do not have a god-given soul any more than my cat does, my aquarium fish, or the hog that was killed to provide the bacon I ate this morning.

We humans are just the currently most self-aware creatures but also just animals.  And you really can't STAND that, can you? 

[Baruch]

Your assumption that we humans are not made of body is the basis of the failure of your understanding of reality.  There is a clear line of evidence that humans are just one of a long string on animals from the simplest to the most complex.    We are animals just as an octopus or microbe is.   We live in a physical existence and die in it.  We do not have a god-given soul any more than my cat does, my aquarium fish, or the hog that was killed to provide the bacon I ate this morning.

We humans are just the currently most self-aware creatures but also just animals.  And you really can't STAND that, can you?

The notion you have that a functioning radio has no program, just electronics ... maybe why you don't hear many songs ;-)

[Hakurei Reimu]

You forget one important thing my friend and that is that humans are not only made of body.

Mere assertion. Claiming things does not make them true.

You can do all the scientific investigation that you wish but that will not give you peace of mind and permanent happiness that is why by relying on that you will never be able fulfill the most human aspiration and longing.

Says you. I find it very fun finding things out. I devour books on science the same way I would eat candy. Why? Because it's intently fascinating. It's thrilling to see everything you have learned fit together into a coherent whole.

Actually, no. I don't even need a reason to find it fascinating. I just do.

You don't get to say what my aspirations are or what I long for. Only I get to do that.

You can become the most expert in physical science but once again this science is unable to satisfy the human desire and longing for peace of mind and total bliss.

You have obviously not talked to any scientist, ever, because if you did, and you get them to teach you about a subject they are currently investigating, they will enthusiastically talk your ear off about what they have discovered and how it fits into the overall picture. To do scientific investigation is the scientists' bliss. Even if they're wrong, they delight in finding out they're wrong.

You have no place telling ANYONE what their desire is, or what they long for, or how they find peace of mind or bliss. You are not them; they are not you; and scientists are not the gurus sitting on the mountains contemplating their navels.

The day you will have finish to investigate everything within this material dimension you still will be billions of miles away from any solution for the simple reason that what your subconscious wish does not belong in this material dimension.

You have no idea how my subconsious works any more than I do. You do not know what makes me tick. Don't presume to speak for my unconsious, you presumptuous prick.

All the best anyway.

That is a lie. You want me to follow slavishly in your belief that I'm somehow incomplete without spirituality, and the reason why you do this is because you are such an ignoramus about the material world, that you must invent the immaterial to be one of greater worth that you can lord over us. Sorry, chump, who's to say that your immaterial world is worth more than the material one, even if I were to grant that it exists? You can't. So stick that in your pipe and smoke it.

[Cavebear]

Mere assertion. Claiming things does not make them true.
Says you. I find it very fun finding things out. I devour books on science the same way I would eat candy. Why? Because it's intently fascinating. It's thrilling to see everything you have learned fit together into a coherent whole.

Actually, no. I don't even need a reason to find it fascinating. I just do.

You don't get to say what my aspirations are or what I long for. Only I get to do that.
You have obviously not talked to any scientist, ever, because if you did, and you get them to teach you about a subject they are currently investigating, they will enthusiastically talk your ear off about what they have discovered and how it fits into the overall picture. To do scientific investigation is the scientists' bliss. Even if they're wrong, they delight in finding out they're wrong.

You have no place telling ANYONE what their desire is, or what they long for, or how they find peace of mind or bliss. You are not them; they are not you; and scientists are not the gurus sitting on the mountains contemplating their navels.
You have no idea how my subconsious works any more than I do. You do not know what makes me tick. Don't presume to speak for my unconsious, you presumptuous prick.
That is a lie. You want me to follow slavishly in your belief that I'm somehow incomplete without spirituality, and the reason why you do this is because you are such an ignoramus about the material world, that you must invent the immaterial to be one of greater worth that you can lord over us. Sorry, chump, who's to say that your immaterial world is worth more than the material one, even if I were to grant that it exists? You can't. So stick that in your pipe and smoke it.

Oh don't hold it in, be direct.  ;)

[Baruch]

Anyone posting here ... "mere assertion".  All claimed evidence/proof ... not original, copied from Wikipedia etc.

[Arik]

Mere assertion. Claiming things does not make them true.
Says you. I find it very fun finding things out. I devour books on science the same way I would eat candy. Why? Because it's intently fascinating. It's thrilling to see everything you have learned fit together into a coherent whole.

Actually, no. I don't even need a reason to find it fascinating. I just do.

You don't get to say what my aspirations are or what I long for. Only I get to do that.
You have obviously not talked to any scientist, ever, because if you did, and you get them to teach you about a subject they are currently investigating, they will enthusiastically talk your ear off about what they have discovered and how it fits into the overall picture. To do scientific investigation is the scientists' bliss. Even if they're wrong, they delight in finding out they're wrong.

You have no place telling ANYONE what their desire is, or what they long for, or how they find peace of mind or bliss. You are not them; they are not you; and scientists are not the gurus sitting on the mountains contemplating their navels.
You have no idea how my subconsious works any more than I do. You do not know what makes me tick. Don't presume to speak for my unconsious, you presumptuous prick.
That is a lie. You want me to follow slavishly in your belief that I'm somehow incomplete without spirituality, and the reason why you do this is because you are such an ignoramus about the material world, that you must invent the immaterial to be one of greater worth that you can lord over us. Sorry, chump, who's to say that your immaterial world is worth more than the material one, even if I were to grant that it exists? You can't. So stick that in your pipe and smoke it.

I find very interesting when you say that I do not know what your desires, your aspirations and your subconscious means to you.

The things is that we all come from the same place and sooner or later we will all go back in the same place so obviously what my subconscious tell me is the same same for your subconscious.
The only difference is that we all have different degree of awareness and that is why not everybody can yet get the clear message from their subconscious mind due to the fact that the mind is stuck in the material dream.   

[Baruch]

Lack of self reflection is common among the autistic.

[Arik]

Your assumption that we humans are not made of body is the basis of the failure of your understanding of reality.  There is a clear line of evidence that humans are just one of a long string on animals from the simplest to the most complex.    We are animals just as an octopus or microbe is.   We live in a physical existence and die in it.  We do not have a god-given soul any more than my cat does, my aquarium fish, or the hog that was killed to provide the bacon I ate this morning.

We humans are just the currently most self-aware creatures but also just animals.  And you really can't STAND that, can you?

Wrong CB.

You can not read properly my post.
I didn't say that we humans are not made of body.
I instead said that we humans are not made only of body.

Can you see the difference CB?

But let me explain in details what I meant.
Suppose a cart or a buckboard is pulled by 3 horses.
Now suppose that only one of the 3 animals is strong while the other two are weak or very weak.






In this case the cart can not go straight but if all 3 animals are strong then the cart will go straight and fast right?





Now suppose that we humans are made of 3 elements which are BODY-BRAIN, OUTER MIND or the mind that you are aware of and INNER MIND or the subconscious mind.

It is in the human nature to have a balance among these 3 elements if we want to follow our human nature.
Of course you can say that you still have plenty of balance in your life without the need to follow anything but the fact that we all try to improve our life simply means that there is something else other than the physical-material dimension.

[aitm]

the clear message from their subconscious mind due to the fact that the mind is stuck in the material dream.   

More bull-shit. Pull a string out of your ass and call it a forklift. Simply making shit up as always for you types of people that think that material and immaterial must be separate instead of operating hand in hand with providing the vessel they both need to survive in a safer, easier and more enjoyable environment. You're wrong Arik. Our sub-conscious thrives and wants the material. The two work together for the mutual benefit. You are trying to separate the two and because you don't have the abilities or wherewithall to go out and GET the material....therefore you try to convince those who are successful that you are somehow better than they are because ...you ...know ....you... will ...never ...be.

[Hydra009]

Now suppose that we humans are made of 3 elements which are BODY-BRAIN, OUTER MIND or the mind that you are aware of and INNER MIND or the subconscious mind.

*cough*

I could suppose that roads are made out of candy and water towers are filled with milk chocolate, but that wouldn't make it so.

[aitm]

now suppose that we humans are made of 3 elements which are BODY-BRAIN, OUTER MIND or the mind that you are aware of and INNER MIND or the subconscious mind.

but what about the penis brain? ARIK!! WHAT ABOUT THE PENIS BRAIN? WHAT HAPPENS TO IT?

[Hakurei Reimu]

I find very interesting when you say that I do not know what your desires, your aspirations and your subconscious means to you.

The things is that we all come from the same place and sooner or later we will all go back in the same place so obviously what my subconscious tell me is the same same for your subconscious.

I don't "come from" the same place you did, out my mom's vagina. Are we siblings? No, because my only brother and sibling is not a mealy-mouthed woo-pusher like you. Even if this subconscious mind bullshit is true, I didn't go through the same experiences as you did. My makeup and my influences are not the same as yours. No false equivalence for you.

The only difference is that we all have different degree of awareness and that is why not everybody can yet get the clear message from their subconscious mind due to the fact that the mind is stuck in the material dream.   

And again, mere assertions. Again, you presume to know my subconscious mind better than I do, when even a psychotherapist I would be going to for years wouldn't be so bold. No, you don't get to do that no matter how many times you repeat the same drivel.

[Arik]

I don't "come from" the same place you did, out my mom's vagina. Are we siblings? No, because my only brother and sibling is not a mealy-mouthed woo-pusher like you. Even if this subconscious mind bullshit is true, I didn't go through the same experiences as you did. My makeup and my influences are not the same as yours. No false equivalence for you.
And again, mere assertions. Again, you presume to know my subconscious mind better than I do, when even a psychotherapist I would be going to for years wouldn't be so bold. No, you don't get to do that no matter how many times you repeat the same drivel.

Oh, well if you know everything then I suppose you also know where our consciousness come from.

(One tip for you mate)
The consciousness was part of the baby before the baby came out from your mum vagina.

One more thing Haku.
An old saying goes..........ALL ROAD LEAD TO ROME........
Obviously not everybody follow the same route to get to this place but that is totally irrelevant in the context that everybody sooner or later will get there.
But the point is...........WHY EVERYBODY WILL GET THERE?

Simple Haku.
Everybody is looking for peace of mind and permanent happiness.
Now considering that within this FINITE universe there is absolutely nothing permanent the permanent must be elsewhere right, so it doesn't really matter if right now your objectives are different from mine because sooner or later you too will understand where this ROME is located. 

[Arik]

More bull-shit. Pull a string out of your ass and call it a forklift. Simply making shit up as always for you types of people that think that material and immaterial must be separate instead of operating hand in hand with providing the vessel they both need to survive in a safer, easier and more enjoyable environment. You're wrong Arik. Our sub-conscious thrives and wants the material. The two work together for the mutual benefit. You are trying to separate the two and because you don't have the abilities or wherewithall to go out and GET the material....therefore you try to convince those who are successful that you are somehow better than they are because ...you ...know ....you... will ...never ...be.

More daydream aitm?

Wrong again because not only I never said that there should only be the subconscious but my previous post clearly indicate that I believe in a balance among physical-material and the various strata of the mind.

Your continuous insistence that I reject the material side is but a callous way to denigrate or perhaps you can't even read my posts properly which would be as bad as to denigrate.