Texas Contemplates Homicide/Death Penalty for Abortion

Started by Shiranu, April 12, 2019, 10:08:38 PM

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Shiranu

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2019/4/11/18304825/abortion-texas-tony-tinderholt-death-penalty-bill


QuoteA bill recently introduced in Texas would make it possible for women to get the death penalty for having abortions.The bill would criminalize all abortions, with no exceptions for rape or incest, and would make it possible to charge a woman with homicide for having the procedure, according to the Washington Post. The state of Texas allows capital punishment for homicide.
Rep. Tony Tinderholt, a Republican state legislator who introduced the bill, says it would make people “consider the repercussions” of having sex.
“My bill simply accomplishes one goal,” Tinderholt said in a statement to media on Wednesday. “It brings equal treatment for unborn human beings under the law.”

Thankfully, it didn't pass; the head of the committee refused to let it be voted on. Before you get excited that a Republican shut this down, keep in mind that he only won his district by 200 votes last election... he realises he now is in a purple county and has to appeal to both sides.
That said, Ohio just recently banned abortion bringing the total number of states that have criminalized it to 4. If it is taken to the Supreme Court, which is now stacked with Republican candidates *nominees who have been pretty strongly against abortion, it is quite possible that Roe v. Wade could be completely gutted or overturned.

And let's just think for a moment the fact that, in a first world nation, in the United States, the second largest state was legitimately allowing a bill that could lead to the death penalty for abortion. If Texas was it's own country, it would have the 19th largest economy in the world and a population larger than Australia.

It would be one thing if it was Pakistan or Egypt or Mali or wherever considering legislation like this... but that's how far we have fallen socially.
"A little science distances you from God, but a lot of science brings you nearer to Him." - Louis Pasteur

Baruch

Where is all this "Texas going Blue" I have been hearing about, besides Austin?  Seems pretty conservative that this would even be brought to a vote in the first place.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Shiranu

Quote from: Baruch on April 13, 2019, 02:30:30 AM
Where is all this "Texas going Blue" I have been hearing about, besides Austin?  Seems pretty conservative that this would even be brought to a vote in the first place.

It goes towards what I was saying above... Texas is much more akin to a country (and would be one of the largest and most powerful ones in the world, at that) than a State, so the diversity of politics is going to be much larger. It's why you can have states like New Mexico and Colorado which lean progressive right next to states like Arizona or Utah that are ultra-conservative, even though they fall into the (roughly) same cultural region and are all part of one country.

El Paso, Houston, Dallas, San Antonio, the Valley and basically every metro-region of Texas is blue (and spread apart over a region larger than New England), it's just once you get about 30 minutes outside of the city you pass through old-white money conservatives and then into uneducated towns and villages that are either oil, farming or drug towns (or a mixture of the three).

Small towns here are dying, while the major metro-regions continue to expand exponentially... and with that many progressives are either immigrating to the State or being homegrown. So while the state can be trending towards being more purple and progressive, you can still have pockets of deep red with extremely regressive view points.

Like I said, it was a Republican who blocked this from going through, and it's largely because he won by only 200-some votes. As for the guy who proposed it, he is in a predominately white and upper-class district, and even then he only won by 7% of the vote... which means even in his own district there is not overwhelming support for his policies.

My guess is this bill will not make him popular with a decent amount of Republican voters in his district, and even less so for independents... and that come next election that margin of victory (or even loss) will be much closer.
"A little science distances you from God, but a lot of science brings you nearer to Him." - Louis Pasteur

Mr.Obvious

Meanwhile, South Korea must end its abortion ban by 2020. Their court has declared.
"If we have to go down, we go down together!"
- Your mum, last night, requesting 69.

Atheist Mantis does not pray.

Gawdzilla Sama

Non-USians, and frankly a lot of USians, tend to be lazy and think that a "Red" state is entirely Republican. Need to do better, people.
We 'new atheists' have a reputation for being militant, but make no mistake  we didn't start this war. If you want to place blame put it on the the religious zealots who have been poisoning the minds of the  young for a long long time."
PZ Myers

Hijiri Byakuren

Speak when you have something to say, not when you have to say something.

Sargon The Grape - My Youtube Channel

Baruch

Quote from: Mr.Obvious on April 13, 2019, 05:54:00 AM
Meanwhile, South Korea must end its abortion ban by 2020. Their court has declared.

Complicated by all the Korean Christians.  Though perhaps not as "throw back" as the African Christians.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Baruch

Quote from: Gawdzilla Sama on April 13, 2019, 07:45:02 AM
Non-USians, and frankly a lot of USians, tend to be lazy and think that a "Red" state is entirely Republican. Need to do better, people.

Like the NT analogy of yeast in the dough.  One little bit of yeast makes the whole loaf un-kosher for Passover.  That is the puritan view.  On any given election, one third of the electorate isn't tribal (the Independents) unlike the spear chucking bone in the nose D-R savages.

Meanwhile if one Marxist professor is at your college, the whole mess is Communist and should be defunded to zero.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Baruch

Quote from: Hijiri Byakuren on April 13, 2019, 11:05:08 AM
I fear for this country.

The Fear Brigade ... 1775, 1860, 1917, 1941, 1962 ... see the pattern?  Right now we are in a moral panic, like 1951 or 1680.  Paranoia really.

It was the best of times, it was the worst of times, it was the age of wisdom, it was the age of foolishness, it was the epoch of belief, it was the epoch of incredulity, it was the season of Light, it was the season of Darkness, it was the spring of hope, it was the winter of despair, we had everything before us, we had nothing before us, we were all going direct to Heaven, we were all going direct the other way â€" in short, the period was so far like the present period, that some of its noisiest authorities insisted on its being received, for good or for evil, in the superlative degree of comparison only.  A Tale of Two Cities - by Charles Dickens

IMHO ... there are no good revolutions.  Gradual change by thinking people is good.  But all societies are mob rule or tyrannies.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Cavebear

Quote from: Baruch on April 13, 2019, 12:30:44 PM
The Fear Brigade ... 1775, 1860, 1917, 1941, 1962 ... see the pattern?  Right now we are in a moral panic, like 1951 or 1680.  Paranoia really.

It was the best of times, it was the worst of times, it was the age of wisdom, it was the age of foolishness, it was the epoch of belief, it was the epoch of incredulity, it was the season of Light, it was the season of Darkness, it was the spring of hope, it was the winter of despair, we had everything before us, we had nothing before us, we were all going direct to Heaven, we were all going direct the other way â€" in short, the period was so far like the present period, that some of its noisiest authorities insisted on its being received, for good or for evil, in the superlative degree of comparison only.  A Tale of Two Cities - by Charles Dickens

IMHO ... there are no good revolutions.  Gradual change by thinking people is good.  But all societies are mob rule or tyrannies.

Well, most successful societies "get a grip" when they approach one extreme or the other.
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Baruch

Quote from: Cavebear on April 14, 2019, 02:04:27 AM
Well, most successful societies "get a grip" when they approach one extreme or the other.

But do we have rubber no slip soles on our sneakers? ;-)  France, Russia, China are counterexamples.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

drunkenshoe

It's hard to imagine what comes to these people's mind, when they think about sex.

"...Tony Tinderholt, a Republican state legislator who introduced the bill, says it would make people “consider the repercussions” of having sex. ..."

OK. I have something to ask about the 'logic' of this perversity. Does this mean they would also execute the father too -which would be of course more problematic in practice- or only the women? I am not sure if they are aware, but nature needs a female and a male to have sex; do it together to produce pregnancy. Should men "consider the repurcussions" of having sex in their world?

I wish more people would realise that more than the never ending abortion issue in itself; their definition of murder; a fetus vs human debates, this is actually about preventing women from having casual sex, having multiple partners; not at all if they are not married or having kids. It's the same agenda in every religion.

Scaring women. And trust me, even reading this piece of news would scare a lot of them living that region and impact their lives. I know what I felt when the equivalent of this understanding tried to ban abortion over here. Even though they failed, they managed to manipulate people; certain hospitals even acted as if it was banned. It's also very easy to manipulate, coerce women to do something else than they actually want about this issue, esp. if they are single. It's so disgusting. It's a huge can of worms.

John Oliver has 2 episode on this regarding the US, about what is going on in some places where actually abortion is legal, but made inaccesible to women.   

             
"science is not about building a body of known 'facts'. ıt is a method for asking awkward questions and subjecting them to a reality-check, thus avoiding the human tendency to believe whatever makes us feel good." - tp

Baruch

Don't worry, the new Puritanism has arrived in America.  No more one night stands.  The Scarlett Letter "A" now stands for America.  And hypocrisy too.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Cavebear

Quote from: drunkenshoe on April 14, 2019, 05:26:05 AM
It's hard to imagine what comes to these people's mind, when they think about sex.

"...Tony Tinderholt, a Republican state legislator who introduced the bill, says it would make people “consider the repercussions” of having sex. ..."

OK. I have something to ask about the 'logic' of this perversity. Does this mean they would also execute the father too -which would be of course more problematic in practice- or only the women? I am not sure if they are aware, but nature needs a female and a male to have sex; do it together to produce pregnancy. Should men "consider the repurcussions" of having sex in their world?

I wish more people would realise that more than the never ending abortion issue in itself; their definition of murder; a fetus vs human debates, this is actually about preventing women from having casual sex, having multiple partners; not at all if they are not married or having kids. It's the same agenda in every religion.

Scaring women. And trust me, even reading this piece of news would scare a lot of them living that region and impact their lives. I know what I felt when the equivalent of this understanding tried to ban abortion over here. Even though they failed, they managed to manipulate people; certain hospitals even acted as if it was banned. It's also very easy to manipulate, coerce women to do something else than they actually want about this issue, esp. if they are single. It's so disgusting. It's a huge can of worms.

John Oliver has 2 episode on this regarding the US, about what is going on in some places where actually abortion is legal, but made inaccesible to women.   

           

I will say there is a solution to all of this.  Women should just willfully expel all their eggs!  Reproductive problems solved!

Sarc...
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Baruch

Cavebear ... we aren't part of the Vagina Dialogues.  Shh!
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.