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Started by Arik, December 23, 2018, 10:31:59 AM

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Mike Cl

Quote from: Arik on February 14, 2019, 10:22:03 AM

So you say..........Humans have consciousness not from magical or mysterious ways, but from evolution...........

Whose evolution Mike?
Their own evolution trough many many lives or somebody else evolution?


Let us see if your answer make any sense.
All that you spew is fiction and nonsense.  Yet you want my answer to make sense.  All of my answers have made sense, but you filter all that is said to you thru your lens of fictional nonsense.  Just because you spend your live in a world of fiction and nonsense, don't expect me to understand or want to participate. 
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?<br />Then he is not omnipotent,<br />Is he able but not willing?<br />Then whence cometh evil?<br />Is he neither able or willing?<br />Then why call him god?

Unbeliever

Quote from: Arik on February 14, 2019, 09:19:23 AM
If the universe would end also God would but that is not possible as God is eternal. (according to yoga)

Which God?
God Not Found
"There is a sucker born-again every minute." - C. Spellman

Arik

Quote from: Blackleaf on February 14, 2019, 11:13:39 AM
I'm not being negative. I'm being realistic. You should try it sometimes.


You realistic?
Are you serious?
How can you think or doubt that a consciousness that took millions of years to evolve to this human stage can vanish into nothing as the physical death happen?


QuoteI have no idea what you just said, but I don't really care either so...


Nirvikalpa samadhi is a state of total bliss so to think that someone would want to end this supreme feeling doesn't make any sense.


QuoteThat's not evidence. You can't start with a presupposition and use it to justify your preconceived conclusion. The universe is expanding, and there is no reason to think it'll ever slow down or reverse itself. That's just wishful thinking.

I am not arguing that the universe is expanding or not.
In fact it make sense that it is expanding as this expansion is driven by an ever expanding spiritual love.
As far as evidence or not you are correct in saying that you do not have any evidence that is why at the end I wrote......according to yoga.
Evidence come with exercising and increase our level of consciousness and that is something that at this stage in time you still haven't done.






When you were born, you were crying and everyone around you was smiling. Live your life so that when you die, you’re the one smiling and everyone around you is crying. Tulsi Das

Arik

Quote from: Mike Cl on February 14, 2019, 11:28:32 AM
All that you spew is fiction and nonsense.  Yet you want my answer to make sense.  All of my answers have made sense, but you filter all that is said to you thru your lens of fictional nonsense.  Just because you spend your live in a world of fiction and nonsense, don't expect me to understand or want to participate.


I also can say that your beliefs are fiction and nonsense and that is tons more of nonsense considering that materialist think that what took millions of years to evolve such as the human consciousness will vanish into nothing in this short life of ours.
When you were born, you were crying and everyone around you was smiling. Live your life so that when you die, you’re the one smiling and everyone around you is crying. Tulsi Das

Blackleaf

Quote from: Arik on February 14, 2019, 06:47:41 PM

You realistic?
Are you serious?
How can you think or doubt that a consciousness that took millions of years to evolve to this human stage can vanish into nothing as the physical death happen?

Yes, I'm serious. I don't engage in wishful thinking. I have no reason to think consciousness survives the death of the brain, especially when the brain accounts for everything we call "consciousness." Your assertion makes no sense.

Quote from: Arik on February 14, 2019, 06:47:41 PMNirvikalpa samadhi is a state of total bliss so to think that someone would want to end this supreme feeling doesn't make any sense.

So basically, you lose your ability to feel but happiness and just become a happy machine. Like being permanently stuck in a drug induced high for all of eternity.

Quote from: Arik on February 14, 2019, 06:47:41 PMI am not arguing that the universe is expanding or not.
In fact it make sense that it is expanding as this expansion is driven by an ever expanding spiritual love.
As far as evidence or not you are correct in saying that you do not have any evidence that is why at the end I wrote......according to yoga.
Evidence come with exercising and increase our level of consciousness and that is something that at this stage in time you still haven't done.

Actually, I have. I used to be a very devout Christian, and spiritual growth was a high priority for me. Then I realized it was all bullshit.
"Oh, wearisome condition of humanity,
Born under one law, to another bound;
Vainly begot, and yet forbidden vanity,
Created sick, commanded to be sound."
--Fulke Greville--

Baruch

Just like an ex-smoker ;-)
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Arik

Quote from: Blackleaf on February 14, 2019, 06:59:07 PM
Yes, I'm serious. I don't engage in wishful thinking. I have no reason to think consciousness survives the death of the brain, especially when the brain accounts for everything we call "consciousness." Your assertion makes no sense.


You must have noticed that when you drive your car for a while it all seem like you and the car are one.
The car respond to your command and that make you feel that the car is you.
That is wrong because the car is not you.
The same thing happen with the relationship that has been build between you and your brain since you born.
This is not only a materialist dogma (false truth) but it goes a lot further because even a lot of non materialists think in the same way and that is very sad indeed.


QuoteSo basically, you lose your ability to feel but happiness and just become a happy machine. Like being permanently stuck in a drug induced high for all of eternity.


Not really BL.
We humans are equipped with a limited conscious-mind that obviously can not go over certain limits and that make us thinking that also God must have the same limitations.
We can only be in one place at the time and think at one thing at the time so our physical and mental activity is not multi-directional such as God which can be in a state of bliss and at the same time be in full control of everything. 


QuoteActually, I have. I used to be a very devout Christian, and spiritual growth was a high priority for me. Then I realized it was all bullshit.

Christianity as it is today is like a drop of water in the ocean as far as being able to increase our consciousness.
The first Christians had a proper system but that is history that is why you got nowhere.
Today Christianity is too corrupted to understand spirituality.
It also depend on the effort that you put.
Most people give it up soon after they started because they find too difficult to go on.
That also apply to all sort of studies and martial arts.





When you were born, you were crying and everyone around you was smiling. Live your life so that when you die, you’re the one smiling and everyone around you is crying. Tulsi Das

Baruch

Generally Asians are more woke, than Occidentals, in spite of Occidental chauvinism.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Blackleaf

Quote from: Arik on February 14, 2019, 07:26:18 PMYou must have noticed that when you drive your car for a while it all seem like you and the car are one.
The car respond to your command and that make you feel that the car is you.
That is wrong because the car is not you.
The same thing happen with the relationship that has been build between you and your brain since you born.
This is not only a materialist dogma (false truth) but it goes a lot further because even a lot of non materialists think in the same way and that is very sad indeed.

For your analogy to work, your consciousness would be uneffected if your brain was knocked out. The driver doesn't stop working if the car is turned off. So why is it if you take a blow to your head, you black out?

Quote from: Arik on February 14, 2019, 07:26:18 PMNot really BL.
We humans are equipped with a limited conscious-mind that obviously can not go over certain limits and that make us thinking that also God must have the same limitations.
We can only be in one place at the time and think at one thing at the time so our physical and mental activity is not multi-directional such as God which can be in a state of bliss and at the same time be in full control of everything.

Sounds like a lot of BS.

Quote from: Arik on February 14, 2019, 07:26:18 PMChristianity as it is today is like a drop of water in the ocean as far as being able to increase our consciousness.
The first Christians had a proper system but that is history that is why you got nowhere.
Today Christianity is too corrupted to understand spirituality.
It also depend on the effort that you put.
Most people give it up soon after they started because they find too difficult to go on.
That also apply to all sort of studies and martial arts.

Ah. The No True Scotsman argument. I figured as much. If effort is what matters, I graduated with my Masters a few years ago, and I think I made two B's my entire college career. All the rest were A's. I put more effort in my spiritual growth than my academic success. Few people put more effort into spirituality than I did, yet I came up empty.
"Oh, wearisome condition of humanity,
Born under one law, to another bound;
Vainly begot, and yet forbidden vanity,
Created sick, commanded to be sound."
--Fulke Greville--

Baruch

"Few people put more effort into spirituality than I did, yet I came up empty." .... everybody is different.

But not a knock on you ... "you did it wrong, quality beats quantity" as an encouragement for others.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Plu

QuoteNirvikalpa samadhi is a state of total bliss so to think that someone would want to end this supreme feeling doesn't make any sense.

In the words of the wise Jim Jefferies:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vPYN-hpF1hs&feature=youtu.be&t=78

Arik

Quote from: Plu on February 15, 2019, 06:50:24 AM
In the words of the wise Jim Jefferies:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vPYN-hpF1hs&feature=youtu.be&t=78


This Jeff is a total nut case.
I can understand a bit about his aversion towards religions considering all religious dogmas and non sense but to hate God for no reason is a total different story.
I wouldn't like to be in his shoes when the truth will hit straight in his face.
When you were born, you were crying and everyone around you was smiling. Live your life so that when you die, you’re the one smiling and everyone around you is crying. Tulsi Das

Arik

Quote from: Blackleaf on February 14, 2019, 09:47:59 PM
For your analogy to work, your consciousness would be uneffected if your brain was knocked out. The driver doesn't stop working if the car is turned off. So why is it if you take a blow to your head, you black out?


Simple BL.

Our consciousness is stuck inside the body-brain until physical death occur.
There is no escape unless the person commit suicide.
Anything that happen to our body-mind affect our consciousness because our consciousness rely on the body-brain to work as a driver rely on the vehicle to go somewhere and obviously a blow to our body-brain is felt to our consciousness that is unable to escape that situation.


QuoteSounds like a lot of BS.


I suppose that anything that doesn't follow your logic is BS.
The problem however is to find out whether your logic is good or is a load of BS.



QuoteAh. The No True Scotsman argument. I figured as much. If effort is what matters, I graduated with my Masters a few years ago, and I think I made two B's my entire college career. All the rest were A's. I put more effort in my spiritual growth than my academic success. Few people put more effort into spirituality than I did, yet I came up empty.


In most cases it is a lack of sincerity that prevent people from getting there but there may also be other reasons like being in two places at the same time.
Suppose you wish to be with a person and at the same time remember also somebody else.
You can trick this person in pretending that you are sincere but with God is a different story because God can read your mind.
In other words when your physical-material desires are stronger than your desire to reach God that will not work.



When you were born, you were crying and everyone around you was smiling. Live your life so that when you die, you’re the one smiling and everyone around you is crying. Tulsi Das

Plu

QuoteI wouldn't like to be in his shoes when the truth will hit straight in his face.

You might have been in his shoes hundreds of times already, but how would you know? You can't remember your previous lives anyway, right?

Arik

Quote from: Plu on February 15, 2019, 08:48:26 AM
You might have been in his shoes hundreds of times already, but how would you know? You can't remember your previous lives anyway, right?


That is 100% true Plu but the fact that I did grow up from that dark stage along my personal evolution means that I don't have to worry anymore unless all of a sudden I decide to behave like a total fool.
Your hero on the other hand is still stuck in that hell.
When you were born, you were crying and everyone around you was smiling. Live your life so that when you die, you’re the one smiling and everyone around you is crying. Tulsi Das