So It Seems That Brexit Has Become a Category 5 Shitstorm

Started by Minimalist, December 13, 2018, 07:21:51 PM

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Baruch

Quote from: trdsf on May 26, 2019, 04:34:20 AM
Russia isn't communist -- and never was.  Since the collapse of the old Soviet state, they've swung hard to plutocracy, bandit capitalism, and miscellaneous thuggery.  They retained the oligarchy.

So?  Should we invade them because Putin is baby Hitler?

And whoever is communist, I nuke them.  They are the worst kind of sociopath.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Baruch

Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Cavebear

Quote from: Baruch on May 26, 2019, 04:26:49 AM
Good think Hitler wasn't bombing them with tea and crumpets, or they would have surrendered immediately ;-)

If it were up to Churchill's contemporaries, they would have surrendered.  Fighting the cattle car on the way to Auschwitz would have been too little too late.  Once Churchill provided the example, the others found their missing gonads.  i have the same problem with America First people in 1941.

Churchill was a good leader and the right person in the right spot at the right time.  Successful nations tend to have that happen because there are many secondary leaders waiting behind...
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Baruch

Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Cavebear

Quote from: Baruch on May 26, 2019, 07:05:12 AM
Brexit support by the Czechs ... not just the Brits ...

Brexit is evil. Some Brit-twits decided they were too good for Europe (as if they weren't part of it) and got a narrow majority to force it.  It's all been downhill from there.  Its like me fighting the poison ivy and vinca major that keeps coming in from the neighbor's yards.   If I was PM Theresa May, I would have finally stood up and said "I'm leaving, good luck, have fun" and walked out...

Of course that's WHY I was never the Brit PM, but still...
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Munch

Quote from: Cavebear on May 26, 2019, 07:56:22 AM
Brexit is evil. Some Brit-twits decided they were too good for Europe (as if they weren't part of it) and got a narrow majority to force it.  It's all been downhill from there.  Its like me fighting the poison ivy and vinca major that keeps coming in from the neighbor's yards.   If I was PM Theresa May, I would have finally stood up and said "I'm leaving, good luck, have fun" and walked out...

Of course that's WHY I was never the Brit PM, but still...

"Brexit is evil" rofl. you sound as crazy the the idiots being easily roasted by Carl (sargon) Benjamin.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=42WxnU0Q9BI
(thinks it only democratic if the vote goes there way otherwise a new vote needs to happen again and again until it does)

The only evil in this situation is the lack of democracy by the political system not upholding what the people voted for. A system without democracy heads towards anarchy.

And lets not pretend that you wouldn't be calling this out if something you voted for and won was stalled. you'd be then calling that 'evil'. lol.
'Political correctness is fascism pretending to be manners' - George Carlin

Baruch

Cavebear just wants what was true in 1999 to continue forever.  Older people dred change for some strange reason ;-)

In many cases the EU never allowed referenda on their major accessions into their spider hole.  And when a referenda failed, they simply retried until they got the vote the way they wanted it.  Germany-France are not very democratic in practice, in fact they are rather tyrannical.  Napoleon tried to conquer the whole continent, before Hitler tried.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Munch

Quote from: Baruch on May 26, 2019, 10:32:13 AM
Cavebear just wants what was true in 1999 to continue forever.  Older people dred change for some strange reason ;-)

In many cases the EU never allowed referenda on their major accessions into their spider hole.  And when a referenda failed, they simply retried until they got the vote the way they wanted it.  Germany-France are not very democratic in practice, in fact they are rather tyrannical.  Napoleon tried to conquer the whole continent, before Hitler tried.

and as sargon himself said, the EU just carried on that same trend, only they did it though the back door instead of the front.
'Political correctness is fascism pretending to be manners' - George Carlin

trdsf

Quote from: Munch on May 26, 2019, 10:01:11 AM
The only evil in this situation is the lack of democracy by the political system not upholding what the people voted for. A system without democracy heads towards anarchy.
But it's not the Brexit that was voted for.  Leave sold a complete unicorn-and-fairy-dust version where the UK could just walk away and have billions and billions of extra pounds to play with.  You cannot say that the Brexit agreement resembles what Leave "promised" Brexit would be.  The lie about £350 million a week for the NHS got walked back almost as soon as the referendum results were in.

If the UK wants to leave the EU, fine â€" but I don't think it's unfair to suggest the public ratify the real Brexit, not the made-up one the Leave campaign sold.  It's pretty clear that the government doesn't know what it's doing at this point; the only parties that have a clear message one way or the other are the minor ones.

Quote from: Munch on May 26, 2019, 10:01:11 AM
And lets not pretend that you wouldn't be calling this out if something you voted for and won was stalled. you'd be then calling that 'evil'. lol.
You mean like how the candidate who got the most votes in our last presidential election isn't president?
"My faith in the Constitution is whole, it is complete, it is total, and I am not going to sit here and be an idle spectator to the diminution, the subversion, the destruction of the Constitution." -- Barbara Jordan

Baruch

Not the correct leave?  So the Leavers should have put out a 10,000 details position paper on how the whole UK government and UK commercial sector will be re-written?  Yes, but then like the Obama care bill, people could vote on it, but will have never read the damn thing.

That isn't how elections or referenda go.  Without radical simplification and successful mischaracterization (stereotyping) the public can't form any opinion.  On the other hand, this is why I am against referenda in the first place, both Scot devolution and Brexit.  Both terrible Tory ideas, for which they should be liquidated as a party.  There is a reason to have "representative" government, not direct democracy.

PS - the way they do things in UK is very different than the US ... sufficiently different that the blood sport is more interesting to watch from here (not so much fun if you live in the UK).  And to think, that if we were Brit, as some of us are, then the US way of doing things is bullocks in general ;-)

Relatively speaking, things are stabilizing for now, in the US, compared to the UK ... they are still entering the eye of the storm ;-(  Like being a movie goer watching Jurassic Park fall apart, with consequences for the people in the movie itself.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Minimalist

Quote from: Baruch on May 25, 2019, 01:38:03 AM
Roger Scruton would be a good choice for GB.  He is smart, mature and isn't worthless SJW.

So what you are saying is that he is unelectable?
The Christian church, in its attitude toward science, shows the mind of a more or less enlightened man of the Thirteenth Century. It no longer believes that the earth is flat, but it is still convinced that prayer can cure after medicine fails.

-- H. L. Mencken

Baruch

Quote from: Minimalist on May 26, 2019, 03:27:42 PM
So what you are saying is that he is unelectable?

Good people never run for office.  Only marginally sociopathic folks run for office.  FDR for instance.  Some sociopaths are better than others.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Sal1981

UKIP has basically been slaughtered at the EU elections, as results roll in, while the Brexit Party and Conservatives pretty much scooped up most of the votes.

Baruch

Quote from: Sal1981 on May 26, 2019, 05:59:09 PM
UKIP has basically been slaughtered at the EU elections, as results roll in, while the Brexit Party and Conservatives pretty much scooped up most of the votes.

Correct.  But Brexit Party really didn't pull from Ukip, but from Conservative/Tory.  Seems Lib/Dem and Green are pulling from Labor.

The first failure was Tzipras in Greece, who ignored his referendum and fired Virofakis.  And Tzipras' party is having further problems today.  Ignore your voters?  Pay at the polls.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Cavebear

Quote from: trdsf on May 26, 2019, 12:06:12 PM
But it's not the Brexit that was voted for.  Leave sold a complete unicorn-and-fairy-dust version where the UK could just walk away and have billions and billions of extra pounds to play with.  You cannot say that the Brexit agreement resembles what Leave "promised" Brexit would be.  The lie about £350 million a week for the NHS got walked back almost as soon as the referendum results were in.

If the UK wants to leave the EU, fine â€" but I don't think it's unfair to suggest the public ratify the real Brexit, not the made-up one the Leave campaign sold.  It's pretty clear that the government doesn't know what it's doing at this point; the only parties that have a clear message one way or the other are the minor ones.
You mean like how the candidate who got the most votes in our last presidential election isn't president?

Spot-on!  The original vote was falsely-described.  And all the pain follows...

At the risk of seeming the usual "The US will solve everything", do you think that that a non-dysfunctional US President might have made, could make, a difference?
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!