Author Topic: Hello to All  (Read 953 times)

Re: Hello to All
« Reply #15 on: December 02, 2018, 06:43:44 PM »
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You need to be specific in terms of what belief I assumed you had that you do not have.

In terms of relevance to this post, I don't intend to argue for Christianity ever. In my post, I clearly defined God as a conscious being who caused the universe to be created, without any other assumptions about God.
Do you have any sort of proof for that assertion? 
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent,
Is he able but not willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able or willing?
Then why call him god?

Offline Hijiri Byakuren

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Re: Hello to All
« Reply #16 on: December 02, 2018, 06:46:01 PM »
What you do or don't believe about a god is irrelevant until you prove that said god exists.
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Re: Hello to All
« Reply #17 on: December 02, 2018, 06:52:01 PM »
And why do you care to share your beliefs with us? Why come to an atheist forum to "discuss" your beliefs, or our lack of same?
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If something cannot logically exist due to incompatible properties, then it does not exist. The God of the Bible has such incompatible properties, and so it does not exist.    You are not allowed to view links. Register or Loginο»Ώ

Offline Baruch

Re: Hello to All
« Reply #18 on: December 02, 2018, 06:52:31 PM »
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The New Testament, parts of it.

This isn't a belief system I am going to debate, just an FYI sort of thing.

As a philosophical/psychological system, or as history?
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luu shalmaata luu balt’aata
May you be well, may you be healthy

Re: Hello to All
« Reply #19 on: December 02, 2018, 06:56:44 PM »
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The New Testament, parts of it.

This isn't a belief system I am going to debate, just an FYI sort of thing.
You apparently don't realize that all four gospels were written as political fiction. There never was any such person as Jesus Christ. There was never a place called Nazareth for him to have lived in. It was all lies, every bit of it.
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If something cannot logically exist due to incompatible properties, then it does not exist. The God of the Bible has such incompatible properties, and so it does not exist.    You are not allowed to view links. Register or Loginο»Ώ

Re: Hello to All
« Reply #20 on: December 02, 2018, 07:04:23 PM »
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And why do you care to share your beliefs with us? Why come to an atheist forum to "discuss" your beliefs, or our lack of same?

There is something dangerous about developing opinions on philosophical matters without discussing them with other people to see how they think. Comparing viewpoints is all.

Re: Hello to All
« Reply #21 on: December 02, 2018, 07:05:14 PM »
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Do you have any sort of proof for that assertion?

We can discuss it on the other thread.

Re: Hello to All
« Reply #22 on: December 02, 2018, 07:14:39 PM »
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There is something dangerous about developing opinions on philosophical matters without discussing them with other people to see how they think. Comparing viewpoints is all.
OK, works for me.
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If something cannot logically exist due to incompatible properties, then it does not exist. The God of the Bible has such incompatible properties, and so it does not exist.    You are not allowed to view links. Register or Loginο»Ώ

Offline Hydra009

Re: Hello to All
« Reply #23 on: December 02, 2018, 07:38:57 PM »
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A belief system typical of atheism is the belief in the Big Bang created by a force that does not have awareness. Naturally, that includes the belief that that is possible without a conscious force, which is a belief.
Yes, people who don't believe in god do not, by definition, believe that God kickstarted the universe with the Big Bang.  Not particularly surprising.

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Another typical belief is belief that the awareness goes away upon death, which is a belief.
The belief that awareness ends at death is kinda implicit in the term death.  But whatever.  Technically, an atheist could believe any of number of things about death: death is the end, reincarnation, we all wake up in Riverworld, we all become sprites in computer games, etc.  But yes, generally speaking, atheism is associated with a recognition of mortality.

Quote
It's kind of hard to shift between a belief in God and atheism without changing a whole bunch of other beliefs.
You'd be surprised.  There are people out there who more or less see things in a secular lens, just with a dash of theism or deism on top.  The Big Bang happened, but goddidit -> The Big Bang happened.  The only really big hangup is this fantastical heavenly realm stuff.  Immortality, endless bliss, etc.  Basic wish-fulfillment stuff.  That's really hard for people to move past, so a lot of them don't.

Re: Hello to All
« Reply #24 on: December 02, 2018, 07:52:23 PM »
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Yes, people who don't believe in god do not, by definition, believe that God kickstarted the universe with the Big Bang.  Not particularly surprising.
The belief that awareness ends at death is kinda implicit in the term death.  But whatever.  Technically, an atheist could believe any of number of things about death: death is the end, reincarnation, we all wake up in Riverworld, we all become sprites in computer games, etc.  But yes, generally speaking, atheism is associated with a recognition of mortality.
You'd be surprised.  There are people out there who more or less see things in a secular lens, just with a dash of theism or deism on top.  The Big Bang happened, but goddidit -> The Big Bang happened.  The only really big hangup is this fantastical heavenly realm stuff.  Immortality, endless bliss, etc.  Basic wish-fulfillment stuff.  That's really hard for people to move past, so a lot of them don't.

Death means the physical body and brain die. No, my definition of death does not include the death of awareness.

If belief in life after death is basic wish-fulfillment, than what's this about everyone who isn't "saved" by Jesus burning in hellfire for all eternity? Do you think all these people who adhere to this belief system, only care about fellow Christians/people who are probably "saved?" Don't you think it might cause them distress to think that some people they care about are going to hell or might already be in hell?

Re: Hello to All
« Reply #25 on: December 02, 2018, 08:05:50 PM »
There is no Hell, that's just something the religious powers that be made up to control the masses.
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If something cannot logically exist due to incompatible properties, then it does not exist. The God of the Bible has such incompatible properties, and so it does not exist.    You are not allowed to view links. Register or Loginο»Ώ

Re: Hello to All
« Reply #26 on: December 02, 2018, 08:15:23 PM »
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There is no Hell, that's just something the religious powers that be made up to control the masses.

That said, it's not basic wish-fulfillment.

Other than that, it may have been a belief that served a purpose in a time when people were in general underdeveloped morally. I don't believe in hell myself.

Offline Hydra009

Re: Hello to All
« Reply #27 on: December 02, 2018, 08:26:48 PM »
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Death means the physical body and brain die. No, my definition of death does not include the death of awareness.
Sounds like a pretty incomplete definition.

Quote
If belief in life after death is basic wish-fulfillment, than what's this about everyone who isn't "saved" by Jesus burning in hellfire for all eternity?
Carrot, meet stick.  Again, pretty basic stuff.

Quote
Do you think all these people who adhere to this belief system, only care about fellow Christians/people who are probably "saved?" Don't you think it might cause them distress to think that some people they care about are going to hell or might already be in hell?
Probably.  The whole thing sounds pretty distressing to me.

Offline Baruch

Re: Hello to All
« Reply #28 on: December 02, 2018, 09:36:11 PM »
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That said, it's not basic wish-fulfillment.

Other than that, it may have been a belief that served a purpose in a time when people were in general underdeveloped morally. I don't believe in hell myself.

Heaven and hell are emotions.  They apply to the here and now, depending on how you feel about that.
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luu shalmaata luu balt’aata
May you be well, may you be healthy

Re: Hello to All
« Reply #29 on: December 03, 2018, 02:18:19 AM »
Welcome, Birdy. With a name like that, I'll have to keep my eye on you. lol

When theists talk about atheist "beliefs," it means they're trying to lower us to their level. Ken Ham does this a lot when he says, "I admire the evolutionist's faith." It takes the same amount of faith not to believe in gods as it does to not believe in fairies, unicorns, and Santa Clause. That is none at all. Skepticism in unsupported claims is the default position, and it's the only intellectually honest position.

The Big Bang isn't a belief either. We know that it happened. What caused the Big Bang, if there even was a cause, is up to debate. This doesn't really have anything to do with atheism, though. The only thing atheists have in common with each other is their lack of belief in any gods. Beyond that, they could be flat earthers, believe that crop circles are evidence that extraterrestrials have been visiting Earth, or even that an afterlife exists. It doesn't really matter what an atheist's positions on matters other than the existence of gods are. We have no creed.
« Last Edit: December 03, 2018, 02:20:23 AM by Blackleaf »
"Oh, wearisome condition of humanity,
Born under one law, to another bound;
Vainly begot, and yet forbidden vanity,
Created sick, commanded to be sound."
--Fulke Greville

 

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