Author Topic: Babylonian Debt Wisdom  (Read 1063 times)

Offline Baruch

Re: Babylonian Debt Wisdom
« Reply #15 on: December 09, 2018, 03:35:46 PM »
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You may want to recall that I am basically a Kant-man with some Hume tossed into the blender.

And Nietzsche can't do Kant.  So do you support the Super-man idea or not?
πŽπŽœπŽœπŽŸπŽŒπŽ€πŽπŽŽπŽ€πŽ€πŽšπŽ€πŽŸπŽπŽœπŽœπŽŸπŽπŽ€πŽπŽ‰πŽ€πŽ€πŽšπŽ€
luu shalmaata luu balt’aata
May you be well, may you be healthy

Re: Babylonian Debt Wisdom
« Reply #16 on: December 10, 2018, 12:39:41 AM »
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It probably wouldn't have made much difference.  Christianity was a belief among the poor and weak seeking salvation from a hard life of slavery and persecution.  I don't see much sense in it myself, but when you are poor and enslaved, almost anything different looks better.


I don't know about that.  Xtians were a minimal part of the population and really only grew because of Imperial favor in the 4th century.  If it was Constantine's head on a pike I doubt that Maxentius would have been rewarding his enemies.  Besides, no one gave a rat's ass about the poor and enslaved.
The Christian church, in its attitude toward science, shows the mind of a more or less enlightened man of the Thirteenth Century. It no longer believes that the earth is flat, but it is still convinced that prayer can cure after medicine fails.

-- H. L. Mencken

Offline Baruch

Re: Babylonian Debt Wisdom
« Reply #17 on: December 10, 2018, 12:56:00 AM »
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I don't know about that.  Xtians were a minimal part of the population and really only grew because of Imperial favor in the 4th century.  If it was Constantine's head on a pike I doubt that Maxentius would have been rewarding his enemies.  Besides, no one gave a rat's ass about the poor and enslaved.

The poor and enslaved care.  That is why the institution of bishops was such a betrayal.  Jews noted, on redemption of slaves that the wealthy Jews would redeem other Jews out of slavery, but the Christians would do it for anyone, including Jews.
πŽπŽœπŽœπŽŸπŽŒπŽ€πŽπŽŽπŽ€πŽ€πŽšπŽ€πŽŸπŽπŽœπŽœπŽŸπŽπŽ€πŽπŽ‰πŽ€πŽ€πŽšπŽ€
luu shalmaata luu balt’aata
May you be well, may you be healthy

Re: Babylonian Debt Wisdom
« Reply #18 on: December 10, 2018, 12:30:18 PM »
And does anyone care what the poor think in the US?  Only the upper 1% call the shots.

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The Christian church, in its attitude toward science, shows the mind of a more or less enlightened man of the Thirteenth Century. It no longer believes that the earth is flat, but it is still convinced that prayer can cure after medicine fails.

-- H. L. Mencken

Offline Cavebear

Re: Babylonian Debt Wisdom
« Reply #19 on: December 18, 2018, 07:28:11 AM »
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I don't know about that.  Xtians were a minimal part of the population and really only grew because of Imperial favor in the 4th century.  If it was Constantine's head on a pike I doubt that Maxentius would have been rewarding his enemies.  Besides, no one gave a rat's ass about the poor and enslaved.

The christians won when they stopped being gladiator and tiger fodder and the poor identified with them.  Their numbers weren't important.  Their identification with the poor and downtrodden was.  As odd as it may seem. the poor usually win.  There are just more of them when push comes to shove...

And they don't have very great allegiance to the leaders either.  ;)
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Offline Baruch

Re: Babylonian Debt Wisdom
« Reply #20 on: December 18, 2018, 07:33:13 AM »
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The christians won when they stopped being gladiator and tiger fodder and the poor identified with them.  Their numbers weren't important.  Their identification with the poor and downtrodden was.  As odd as it may seem. the poor usually win.  There are just more of them when push comes to shove...

And they don't have very great allegiance to the leaders either.  ;)

Correct.  Constantine only thought the Christians were useful idiots ... and they mostly were.  Don't see any socialism at work until the Ottoman Empire killed the last of the Romans (zikat and dhimmi taxes).
πŽπŽœπŽœπŽŸπŽŒπŽ€πŽπŽŽπŽ€πŽ€πŽšπŽ€πŽŸπŽπŽœπŽœπŽŸπŽπŽ€πŽπŽ‰πŽ€πŽ€πŽšπŽ€
luu shalmaata luu balt’aata
May you be well, may you be healthy

Offline Cavebear

Re: Babylonian Debt Wisdom
« Reply #21 on: December 18, 2018, 07:38:14 AM »
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Correct.  Constantine only thought the Christians were useful idiots ... and they mostly were.  Don't see any socialism at work until the Ottoman Empire killed the last of the Romans (zikat and dhimmi taxes).

The Byzantines only ended in 1453.  The Christians were in full control of The Rest Of Europe by then.  Stop bothering me with fake history a la Trump.
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Offline Baruch

Re: Babylonian Debt Wisdom
« Reply #22 on: December 18, 2018, 12:42:52 PM »
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The Byzantines only ended in 1453.  The Christians were in full control of The Rest Of Europe by then.  Stop bothering me with fake history a la Trump.

All history is fake, being a compilation of fake news.  Only Hillary is the one true god?

Yes, didn't deny that the Papacy wasn't powerful in 1453 ... but their hold was weakening, and soon to blow up in their face.
πŽπŽœπŽœπŽŸπŽŒπŽ€πŽπŽŽπŽ€πŽ€πŽšπŽ€πŽŸπŽπŽœπŽœπŽŸπŽπŽ€πŽπŽ‰πŽ€πŽ€πŽšπŽ€
luu shalmaata luu balt’aata
May you be well, may you be healthy

Offline Cavebear

Re: Babylonian Debt Wisdom
« Reply #23 on: December 21, 2018, 10:37:07 AM »
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All history is fake, being a compilation of fake news.  Only Hillary is the one true god?

Yes, didn't deny that the Papacy wasn't powerful in 1453 ... but their hold was weakening, and soon to blow up in their face.

Brightening up your resume for Trump?  Stop using the term "fake news" when people mention facts.  It's both annoying and even More Annoying.

When you say idiotic things like "Only Hillary is the one true god", I want to send you to one of those reality shows just so that they will all vote you off...
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Re: Babylonian Debt Wisdom
« Reply #24 on: December 21, 2018, 12:26:44 PM »
Quote
The christians won when they stopped being gladiator and tiger fodder and the poor identified with them.


Read Candida Moss'  The Myth of Persecution

Xtian suffering under the Romans was vastly overstated by later propagandists.
The Christian church, in its attitude toward science, shows the mind of a more or less enlightened man of the Thirteenth Century. It no longer believes that the earth is flat, but it is still convinced that prayer can cure after medicine fails.

-- H. L. Mencken

Offline Baruch

Re: Babylonian Debt Wisdom
« Reply #25 on: December 21, 2018, 01:07:41 PM »
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Brightening up your resume for Trump?  Stop using the term "fake news" when people mention facts.  It's both annoying and even More Annoying.

When you say idiotic things like "Only Hillary is the one true god", I want to send you to one of those reality shows just so that they will all vote you off...

All your (or anyone's) ideology/politics is complete BS.
All your (or anyone's) history is complete BS.

The difference between you and me .. you judge this fake and that not fake.  I call it all fake.  Because being a centrist, I am not corn-holed by the partisan genie.
πŽπŽœπŽœπŽŸπŽŒπŽ€πŽπŽŽπŽ€πŽ€πŽšπŽ€πŽŸπŽπŽœπŽœπŽŸπŽπŽ€πŽπŽ‰πŽ€πŽ€πŽšπŽ€
luu shalmaata luu balt’aata
May you be well, may you be healthy

Offline Baruch

Re: Babylonian Debt Wisdom
« Reply #26 on: December 21, 2018, 01:10:05 PM »
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Read Candida Moss'  The Myth of Persecution

Xtian suffering under the Romans was vastly overstated by later propagandists.

Yes.  And all those Germans were harmless tourists.  Sorry, any quoted study is ... BS.  You have to ask ... in what way, given that Trump is the one true Time Lord, who has messed up every narrative thru all time and space ... does the author have to gain.  Qui bono as they say in court.

Quite a few non-Christians were persecuted too.  But then the Romans were bloodthirsty bastards.  Just like people today.
πŽπŽœπŽœπŽŸπŽŒπŽ€πŽπŽŽπŽ€πŽ€πŽšπŽ€πŽŸπŽπŽœπŽœπŽŸπŽπŽ€πŽπŽ‰πŽ€πŽ€πŽšπŽ€
luu shalmaata luu balt’aata
May you be well, may you be healthy

Offline Cavebear

Re: Babylonian Debt Wisdom
« Reply #27 on: December 21, 2018, 01:15:16 PM »
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Read Candida Moss'  The Myth of Persecution

Xtian suffering under the Romans was vastly overstated by later propagandists.

It was advantageous for the christians to seem as persecuted as possible.  Their target audience (slaves and gladiators, mostly) were also targeted and persecuted.  Persecution has a wonderful effect on group solidity.
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Offline Baruch

Re: Babylonian Debt Wisdom
« Reply #28 on: December 21, 2018, 07:50:36 PM »
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It was advantageous for the christians to seem as persecuted as possible.  Their target audience (slaves and gladiators, mostly) were also targeted and persecuted.  Persecution has a wonderful effect on group solidity.

Correct, anyone not a Roman millionaire was oppressed.  The idea that Christians weren't (because of being Christian) is BS.  They got oppressed for being lower classed, and being Christian was a capital offense if caught.  Just like you pagans would love to do today ... while being all woke and virtue signaling about how all your orgies are benefit raising parties for the poor.
πŽπŽœπŽœπŽŸπŽŒπŽ€πŽπŽŽπŽ€πŽ€πŽšπŽ€πŽŸπŽπŽœπŽœπŽŸπŽπŽ€πŽπŽ‰πŽ€πŽ€πŽšπŽ€
luu shalmaata luu balt’aata
May you be well, may you be healthy

Re: Babylonian Debt Wisdom
« Reply #29 on: December 21, 2018, 10:07:25 PM »
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Yes.  And all those Germans were harmless tourists.  Sorry, any quoted study is ... BS.  You have to ask ... in what way, given that Trump is the one true Time Lord, who has messed up every narrative thru all time and space ... does the author have to gain.  Qui bono as they say in court.

Quite a few non-Christians were persecuted too.  But then the Romans were bloodthirsty bastards.  Just like people today.



Have you been drinking?
The Christian church, in its attitude toward science, shows the mind of a more or less enlightened man of the Thirteenth Century. It no longer believes that the earth is flat, but it is still convinced that prayer can cure after medicine fails.

-- H. L. Mencken

 

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