Slavery. The Bible and Quran.

[Unbeliever]

The word "slave" only appears once in the KJV:

Jeremiah 2:14
Is Israel a servant? is he a homeborn slave? why is he spoiled?

And the word "slaves" also only once:

Revelation 18:13
And cinnamon, and odours, and ointments, and frankincense, and wine, and oil, and fine flour, and wheat, and beasts, and sheep, and horses, and chariots, and slaves, and souls of men.

[Baruch]

Yeah, but it calls them "servants" instead of "slaves."


Ephesians 6:5
Servants, be obedient to them that are your masters according to the flesh, with fear and trembling, in singleness of your heart, as unto Christ;


Colosians 3:22
Servants, obey in all things your masters according to the flesh; not with eyeservice, as menpleasers; but in singleness of heart, fearing God:

Translation BS ...

https://www.biblestudytools.com/lexicons/greek/kjv/doulos.html

Doulos is used 120 times including Ephesians 6:5 and Colossians 3:22.  Read the original languages or guess wrong.

[pr126]

Quran 4:24
Sahih International: And [also prohibited to you are all] married women except those your right hands possess. [This is] the decree of Allah upon you. And lawful to you are [all others] beyond these, [provided] that you seek them [in marriage] with [gifts from] your property, desiring chastity, not unlawful sexual intercourse. So for whatever you enjoy [of marriage] from them, give them their due compensation as an obligation. And there is no blame upon you for what you mutually agree to beyond the obligation. Indeed, Allah is ever Knowing and Wise.

"except those your right hands possess"  meaning female sex slaves obtained as a booty in battle.

ISIS following Quran 4:24 

[Hydra009]

Yeah, but it calls them "servants" instead of "slaves."

Iirc, that's a euphemism.  At least, that's what I read long ago - the translations add a lot of euphemistic language to paper over that whole slavery thing.

*edit - here's a link to what I'm talking about.

[Baruch]

Iirc, that's a euphemism.  At least, that's what I read long ago - the translations add a lot of euphemistic language to paper over that whole slavery thing.

*edit - here's a link to what I'm talking about.

BLB is one of my go-to sources.

Translation isn't agenda free.  That is why I read the original languages.

[popsthebuilder]

Cool! Lets us start with this verse then!
A prophet must inflict a MASSACRE in a country before he can take slaves! And consume what you took as booty (from this we know why Muhammad and his soldiers raped the women of the tribes who he massacred.
Q 8: 67 â€" 70 It is not for a prophet to have captives [of war] until he inflicts a massacre [upon Allah ‘s enemies] in the land. …
So consume what you have taken of war booty [as being] lawful and good, and fear Allah. Indeed, Allah is Forgiving and Merciful. (69)

Please explain this one to me.
And while you are busy, tell me again why I should not use Al Bukhari to show you what Muhammad said and did?

Obviously, you want to hide who Muhammad really was.
But, be as it may, tell me what does this verse in the Quran instructed Muhammad and Muslims to do.

I must admit that even in the version of the Quran I employ for personal studies, that it mentions regular bloody fighting in reference to a prophet of GOD.

this is undefendable in my poor sight.

I however, did not see anything about sex slaves though.

8:67. It does not behove a Prophet to keep captives unless he has triumphed after a regular bloody fighting in the land. You desire the temporary and frail goods of this world, while Allâh desires the Hereafter. And Allâh is All-Mighty, All-Wise.

It doesn't seem to promote violence in that verse though to me.

peace



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[Baruch]

Either G-d is some ideal Mahatma Gandhi or MLK or Santa Claus ... or nothing at all?  That of course is a straw man argument.  The actual Mahatma Gandhi or MLK weren't always nice people (but they did give a good faith effort ... both were spiritual men).  Let the seculars compare with Voltaire etc.  Who was a nasty man indeed!

Scriptures reflect actual or ideal human conditions (duh).  They are written by ordinary people (double duh).  We need to focus on the ideal.  But don't forget that people are constantly subject to error in all respects.  Utopia won't ever happen, except with the extinction of humanity.  Only the dead are at peace.

Men in all cultures have exploited young women (triple duh).  We are dirty Earth angels.

[popsthebuilder]

No.  And I can hear the whoosh sound from here.

*edit - hint: I'm referring to a famous idea associated with existentialism.

*edit - super hint

Existentialism says we have purpose and reasons for existing. Freedom in no way negates purpose in itself.



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[popsthebuilder]

And do not even attempt to use Taquiah with me sir!
There is no mercy in the Quran, except for those that are Muslim.
You definitely have another publication of the Quran that what is used in the Islamic world!

Anyhow, I showed you from your own Quran that you can
go out and decimate non Muslim countries,
rape their women
whilst you behead the husbands.
Sell them as slaves when you are done with them,

Even Mohammad had no less than 9 sex slaves himself!

And Mohammad very conveniently received a revelation from Gabriel (Satan) that he dont have to worry, he should tell these sex slaves whom some of their husbands, he tortured to death to get hold of the Jewish tribe's treasury,

that it is the Best thing to have happened to them, because Allah knows best and Allah is all knowing and Mercyfull!

Tell you what, you can go and show me how I opiniated the verses I posted here, and I will show you that what you try to magically change the understanding of what the Quran verses say,

I will prove to you from Sahee Al Bukhari that this was not how Muhammad taught the first Muslims!

Muhammad taught to attack the innocent tribes in Arabia, (Arab, Jewish, and Christian).
to kill the men,
to ransack the cities for booty,
to rape the women on the spot!
to sell the children as slaves!
to steal and to give him 20% of everything!
This includes the most beautiful women, which he kept as sex slaves for himself!

...AND...Gone is the wonderful magic on a Muslim who interpreted the Quran as Merciful, teaching a religion of Peace!
Try to prove me wrong pal!

All I will do is to show you what Muhammad said and did!

Muhammad was an impostor who pretended to have been a prophet of the Jewish God YHWH!

He gained an army of thugs, rapists, and thiefs who dressed up in white as a great show of pious.

Islam is the greatest show on earth!
Everything is to be explained, and Muhammad must be made out as this best example of what a human can me!

But once we go and learn who Muhammad was, we discover he was a rapist, murderer, slave monger, narcissist, psychopath, sociopath, pedophile, torturer....

But again, Allah knows best and Mo was his prophet!

"except for thaose that are Muslim" meaning those who ultimately submit to the will of GOD in their own life.

What version of the Quran do I read?

This is the description of the app

(The complete English translation with the option of having the original Arabic text shown
* Tafseer/Commentary (revised version by scholars across the world)
* Stream or download 10 different recitations including English (by Imam Benjamin Bilal) and by great Arabic reciters like Maher Al-Muaiqly, Said Al Ghamdi, Abul Basit, Muhammad Ayyoub, Minshary Alafasy, Muhammad Al-Minshawi and more.
* Audio controls made easy using the screen-lock player or player widget for the home screen
* Full-text search including searching for exact search terms in "quotes"
* Unlimited bookmarks with note function and Google backup to sync across devices
* Glossary/Index with thousands of topics and the direct link to the corresponding passage in the Holy Qur'an
* 10 different backgrounds/themes plus 'Night Mode' and four font sizes and to choose from
* Discover the Holy Quran with numerous topics for the Muslim and non-Muslim reader
* Landscape mode support as well as tablet optimized HD version with 3 columns side-by-side

* Share verses (Ayat) through email, text/SMS or social media

...and many more features

While no translation of the Quran can be perfect, the translation we chose for this app was done by scholars in the United States and is part of no particular sect or school of thought. We compared many different translations and this one is easy to understand and comes with a powerful English recitation by Imam Benjamin Bilal, so the user can follow along with the English audio. For side-by-side comparison of this and other Holy Quran renderings into English, please visit our online Quran-comparison project at EnglishQuran.com
We strove hard to avoid any errors. However, should you find any mistakes or any reproducible bugs please email us and we will try to fix it as soon as possible with the next update.)


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[Jason Harvestdancer]

Mouse, a word of advice.

If you're trying to prove that Christianity is better than Islam, you might be able to do so.  But not on this issue.  You've picked a really bad issue on which to make your case.

[Jason78]

7 posts filled with walls of text. 

Just to say "Nuh uh!  Those bits of the bible telling you how to beat your slave doesn't mean what it says it means!"

[Unbeliever]

It means what mousetrap says it means, nothing more, nothing less.

[Mousetrap]

I must admit that even in the version of the Quran I employ for personal studies, that it mentions regular bloody fighting in reference to a prophet of GOD.

this is undefendable in my poor sight.

I however, did not see anything about sex slaves though.

8:67. It does not behove a Prophet to keep captives unless he has triumphed after a regular bloody fighting in the land. You desire the temporary and frail goods of this world, while Allâh desires the Hereafter. And Allâh is All-Mighty, All-Wise.

It doesn't seem to promote violence in that verse though to me.

peace

Realy?

A prophet MUST decimate the inhabitants of a country, BEFORE he is allowed to take BOOTY!
AND ONLY then may he CONSUME / ENJOY the booty!

How on on earth do you make these verses out at 'bloody wars' where Muhammad were forced to engage into?
Muhammad attacked all the neighboring Jewish and Christian tribes, and raided Arab caravans on this verse revealed by Allah!

Muhammad and his Arab thugs murdered the men, and raped the women on the battlefield!
then went and sell the children and women after wards.

It is not for a prophet to have captives [of war] until he inflicts a massacre [upon Allah ‘s enemies] in the land. …
If not for a decree from Allah that preceded, …
So consume what you have taken of war booty [as being] lawful and good, and fear Allah. Indeed, Allah is Forgiving and Merciful. (69)
O Prophet, say to whoever is in your hands of the captives, “If Allah knows [any] good in your hearts, He will give you [something] better than what was taken from you, and He will forgive you; and Allah is Forgiving and Merciful.” (70)

Please read the verses in full, and dont attempt to dilute what it says.
Here it says that Allah DECREED Muhammad to massacre the inhabitants of a country,
Then to take slaves and to tell them not to worry, they are slaves now, but it is better than what they had before!


Anyhow, why did you not give us the full version of these verses?

[Mousetrap]

.

I however, did not see anything about sex slaves though.

8:67. It does not behove a Prophet to keep captives unless he has triumphed after a regular bloody fighting in the land. You desire the temporary and frail goods of this world, while Allâh desires the Hereafter. And Allâh is All-Mighty, All-Wise.

It doesn't seem to promote violence in that verse though to me.

SAHIH INTERNATIONAL
It is not for a prophet to have captives [of war] until he inflicts a massacre [upon Allah 's enemies] in the land. Some Muslims desire the commodities of this world, but Allah desires [for you] the Hereafter. And Allah is Exalted in Might and Wise.

If not for a decree from Allah that preceded, you would have been touched for what you took by a great punishment.

So consume what you have taken of war booty [as being] lawful and good, and fear Allah . Indeed, Allah is Forgiving and Merciful.

O Prophet, say to whoever is in your hands of the captives, "If Allah knows [any] good in your hearts, He will give you [something] better than what was taken from you, and He will forgive you; and Allah is Forgiving and Merciful."

Sorry Pal,
One thing I can do is to read what the Quran says.
Would you like it in an Arabic transliteration?
Go to Corpus Quran .com and see that what is written in English, agrees with what I read in the Sahee International.
Definately not what you watered down!

By the way, would you like me to show you in the Al Bykhari how Muhammad attacked inocent tribes, killed and tortured the men, and allowed his Muslim jihadi's to rape the women?

[Mousetrap]

Mouse, a word of advice.

If you're trying to prove that Christianity is better than Islam, you might be able to do so.  But not on this issue.  You've picked a really bad issue on which to make your case.

Never will I even attempt to do that!
Christianity is but a name for people who would like to associate them self with the thought of being in a social club where so called good people are members who want to associate with others, with their interpretation of what this religion should be. There are, just as in any other religion, wide horizons far removed from each other in Christianity, where many are no more than pretentious liars.
Then there are real sincere people, who live the way they do as if there is a God present at all times of their lives.

Again, Islam is also just as wide and multifaceted, and many Muslims are sincere in their religion.

So, what is the difference between the 2?

This is the core of the troubles on this Earth for over 2 000 years!

The difference is:

The Bible and the Quran!

If we investigate the Bible, and the Quran, then I will have the right to learn what the contents shows, and to make a conclusion.

This is the only true method in establishing if a Christian or Muslim is talking the truth about what their Holy Books teaches.

Therefore, if it concerns Slavery in the Bible and Quran, the Quran instructs Muslims to engage in sex slavery.
Many Muslims does not know this, simply because they never read what the Quran says.
This is why so called moderate Muslims turn into Jihadi's and terrorists when they learn what Muhammad did upon the instruction of the Quran.

And why would someone think the Bible condones slavery?
Because they also never read what the Bible said on the topic.

In short, I will never try to make Christianity great, and Islam bad.

This they counter them-self.
All I do is to compare the Bible and Quran.