Hi

[Cavebear]

Cats are usually nocturnal.  Smart predators usually are.

Crepuscular...

[Unbeliever]

I always did think the snake got the worst part of the story.

Yeah, especially since it was the serpent who told the truth, and God that lied his ass off - if God can be said to have an ass. Presumably he does though, since Moses could only see his "back parts", and not his face...

And it shall come to pass, while my glory passeth by, that I will put thee in a clift of the rock, and will cover thee with my hand while I pass by:
And I will take away mine hand, and thou shalt see my back parts: but my face shall not be seen.

Exodus 33:22-23

[Blackleaf]

Actually, I just read chapter 3:1, which says, "Now the serpent was more crafty than any of the wild animals the Lord God had made." So there you go. The serpent was an animal created by God, and not at all the devil. Case closed. Also, apparently animals can talk, unless Adam speaks Parseltongue. But this wouldn't be the only time animals have talked for no explained reason...

Numbers 22:28-30 - "Then the Lord opened the donkey’s mouth, and it said to Balaam, "What have I done to you to make you beat me these three times?"

Balaam answered the donkey, "You have made a fool of me! If only I had a sword in my hand, I would kill you right now."

The donkey said to Balaam, "Am I not your own donkey, which you have always ridden, to this day? Have I been in the habit of doing this to you?"

"No," he said."

I like how the guy doesn't even bat an eye. If a donkey just starting talking to me, I'd be like, "Whoa! WTF?" But this guy is like, "The animals are talking. Is it Tuesday again already?"

[Baruch]

Even a jackass is better than a pagan prophet ;-)  The donkey did him a favor (guess he liked his stall and feed).

So did you protest any other fantasy literature ... Harry Potter perhaps?

[Blackleaf]

Even a jackass is better than a pagan prophet ;-)  The donkey did him a favor (guess he liked his stall and feed).

So did you protest any other fantasy literature ... Harry Potter perhaps?

If Hedwig suddenly started talking and Harry Potter didn't question it, and people claimed the Harry Potter books to be literally true, I absolutely would protest it. lol

[Baruch]

If Hedwig suddenly started talking and Harry Potter didn't question it, and people claimed the Harry Potter books to be literally true, I absolutely would protest it. lol

In Britain, people can list Jedi as their religion.  You are being rationalist.  A distinct minority among the monkey population.

[Unbeliever]

If Hedwig suddenly started talking and Harry Potter didn't question it, and people claimed the Harry Potter books to be literally true, I absolutely would protest it. lol

And if they were vying for supremacy on the national and global stage. Then we'd worry about their "holy" books.

[Baruch]

And if they were vying for supremacy on the national and global stage. Then we'd worry about their "holy" books.

They are ... but you are hypnotized by CNN and BBC to ignore the Daleks among us ;-)

[ferdmonger]

I understand. Looking around... it can be hard to believe, or even want to. However, that's actually part of what I've come through. I had an amazing family and, unfortunately, a pretty rough childhood. And yet, I am beginning to understand why.. even if only a little...

However, I understand that this is still personal evidence. ðŸ™,

Don't think you're the only one.

I was chased down the road being hit with a board when I was 14 years old.  My father was a a staunch Catholic.  He always said a man should never raise a hand to his wife.  His children were a completely different matter.

I vowed that I would break the cycle, and not strike my children.  My wife is also an atheist (which helps in the grand scheme of things), and we raised our kids corporal punishment free. and we have very nice responsible kids.

My father is one of the reasons I'm atheist. 

[ferdmonger]

I was fishing for trout six miles by foot into a wilderness area at a glacier fed lake in Montana.  I had with me a purse sized canvas bag for my fishing gear, and place to put the fish.  I can't remember why, but I unslung the bag from my shoulder and laid it on the shore, and pushed through some brush to a different spot to cast from.

When I got back to my bag to add another trout to my catch, a snake slithered out of the bag with one of my fish.  I chased the snake.  I don't know why, because the idea of eating a fish that had been in the mouth of a snake is repulsive.  As I chased  the snake down the shore, a mink jumped out of the brush and pounced on the snake, took the fish, and disappeared back into the brush.

I related the incident to my hiking companion back at the campsite, and he said it sounded like one of Outdoor Life Magazine's "True Life Adventures."  While I thought the story was of some interest, the overall experience for me was disgusting and revolting, although I did actually cheer for the mink when he wrestled the fish from the snake.  But the thought that some snake had been slithering around in my bag full of fish is enough to create a gag reflex in me.

I'm still catching up to this thread, but this provoked memories from long ago.

I was hunting grouse and knew there were some ahead, when I heard a faint thumping sound from behind.

A timber wolf -and I'm not exaggerating - loped past not six feet to my right.  It had not a clue I was there, as the wind was at its back, and I was crouched in the scrum.

This was a massive animal and I was scared shit-less. 

I told the story to a warden who said I saw a brush wolf.  Yeah.  A 150 lb black and white brush wolf. 

It never had a clue I was there, and I got to see a timber-wolf up close.

Cool as hell.  (Not at the time though.)

[SGOS]

A timber wolf -and I'm not exaggerating - loped past not six feet to my right.  It had not a clue I was there, as the wind was at its back, and I was crouched in the scrum.

Those experiences alone in the woods at odd hours of the day can sometimes seem like being in another world detached from bustle of society.  Just to have one of those is to experience a completely different side of life.  OK, you will think I'm making this one up, but I swear it's true:

I was bow hunting and I had set up a portable tree stand a few hundred yards down a game trail from my truck.  I couldn't see in every direction as it was right at the interface of tall dense brush and a more open viewing area in front of me.  As twilight approached, I heard an intermittent rustling in the brush behind me.  I turned my head but it was impossible to see anything.  This went on for a few minutes, and all of a sudden a mountain lion appeared out of the brush.  Not only that.  He was exactly below my tree stand 8 feet under me.  I could have spit on him.  I was nervous, but not terrified.  I just sat quietly, and watched him proceed up the game trail toward my truck, and eventually out of sight.  He never saw me.  I had been in Montana 30 years by that time, and this was the first mountain lion I ever saw.  After that, they started showing up, and I ended up seeing five in my lifetime, but nothing as magical as the first one.

[Unbeliever]

I've seen one mountain lion up close and personal, and it didn't see me until I spoke to it.

I was watching a pile of brush we were burning, and was sitting in a folding chair in the middle of a dirt road (this was just outside of Willits, Ca.), when I looked up and saw coming toward me the aforementioned mountain lion, walking down the dirt road, which was looking off toward the fire, so it didn't know I was there. but it was walking exactly toward where I was sitting! So I just said "hey buddy, I'm here too." It looked up at me, but since I wasn't moving it may not have even been able to seem me well. So after staring in my direction for a few seconds it went off into the adjoining wooded area and went about it's own business. I was never really scared, since I've been around a lot of wildlife, but I was kind of stoked that I'd been that close to such a magnificent creature. It really made my day!

[SGOS]

I was never really scared, since I've been around a lot of wildlife, but I was kind of stoked that I'd been that close to such a magnificent creature. It really made my day!

They are breath taking moments for me too.  The first time my father took me bow hunting around the age of 16, I had a couple of those moments the first weekend.  It was surprising because I had never made an effort to sit quietly by myself in the woods before then.  I was always walking or thrashing about or gabbing with a partner.  I remember a few years after that first hunt.  In mid summer, I decided to spend a afternoon sitting quietly in the woods.  I don't think I was sitting more than 15 minutes before a buck walked right by me.  I wonder how many different animals are watching from behind a tree when you are busy making noise.  It's most exciting when they don't know you are there.  Sometimes they get within 5 yards before they take notice.  I get so excited I feel like screaming, not out of fear, just from the experience.

And with a rare sighting like a lion or bear up close, the excitement is magnified by the uniqueness: "Can this really be happening?"  It's like being part of another world for a brief time."  It's actually hard to explain what the experience is like.  You can talk about it intellectually, but you can't share the emotional experience other than through words, which is a poor substitute.

[Unbeliever]

One morning, on Thanksgiving (this was also in Willits), I was doing a bit of dawn hiking, and at one point I was standing among some bushes just looking around, when a doe approached me. I stood perfectly still, and the doe came right up and sniffed at me! Then she just turned to the bush and started eating the leaves, for about five minutes. I could see a buck on the other side of the bush, and he seemed to sense my presence, but he didn't seem to be at all afraid of me. I just stood stock still until the doe and buck wandered far enough away that my moving wouldn't startle them. Best Thanksgiving I've ever had!

[Baruch]

When I came upon a doe in a small clearing, when I was 14 was great.  When my dad and I were covered with ticks when I was 16, not so great.

Been to Willits several times.  Twice by steam train from Ft Bragg.