Author Topic: Early Christian Schisms  (Read 164 times)

Online Shiranu

Early Christian Schisms
« on: July 17, 2018, 03:29:55 AM »
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This made me understand my childhood so much more, and it's crazy to think that things from 1900 years ago (like getting your foreskin removed before modern medicine) effected my life today, but also what culture the Western world would be today (Roman pagan vs Christian trinity).
« Last Edit: July 17, 2018, 03:42:42 AM by Shiranu »
I've Got Love, Fuck Your Money.

"Intellectualization creates a gap or lack of rapport between you and your life. You may think about things so much that you get into the state where you are eating the menu instead of the dinner." -Alan Watts

Offline Cavebear

Re: Early Christian Schisms
« Reply #1 on: July 17, 2018, 03:35:01 AM »
I know all about that stuff, but I appreciated the video being posted.  Some people could use it...
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Offline Baruch

Re: Early Christian Schisms
« Reply #2 on: July 17, 2018, 06:29:52 AM »
Shiranu - this might help
Cavebear - I already know everything

Often that series of animations on history are both to the point, and fairly accurate (but the Mongols are always the exception).

There was no unified Christianity before Constantine, and even for him, there was violent schism between Christians in Alexandria, 100 years before Hypatia.  The Arian controversy went on for 100 years.  But really it was about ... which bishop has the biggest prick.  St Cyril of Alexandria ultimately showed he was the biggest prick.  Pope Damasus was a pretty big prick too, a contested Papal election led to his followers murdering over a hundred supporters of another candidate in a neighboring church. Pope Damasus represented the upper class, the other guy represented the people and lower clergy. A council in Rome, in his anti-pontificate (which has invalidated all subsequent Popes IMHO), the RC determined for itself, the official Bible canon.  And in his Pontificate, the Emperor in Constantinople, supported anti-Semitism and made his own Christianity the only legal religion.
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Offline Cavebear

Re: Early Christian Schisms
« Reply #3 on: July 25, 2018, 12:36:34 PM »
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Shiranu - this might help
Cavebear - I already know everything

Often that series of animations on history are both to the point, and fairly accurate (but the Mongols are always the exception).

There was no unified Christianity before Constantine, and even for him, there was violent schism between Christians in Alexandria, 100 years before Hypatia.  The Arian controversy went on for 100 years.  But really it was about ... which bishop has the biggest prick.  St Cyril of Alexandria ultimately showed he was the biggest prick.  Pope Damasus was a pretty big prick too, a contested Papal election led to his followers murdering over a hundred supporters of another candidate in a neighboring church. Pope Damasus represented the upper class, the other guy represented the people and lower clergy. A council in Rome, in his anti-pontificate (which has invalidated all subsequent Popes IMHO), the RC determined for itself, the official Bible canon.  And in his Pontificate, the Emperor in Constantinople, supported anti-Semitism and made his own Christianity the only legal religion.

Hey, just because I'm an atheist doesn't mean I don't know history. 

But Hypatia, there's a rub of anger.  Cyril mounted a mob against her and they flayed the flesh off her bones, before burning the Library of Alexandria.  She, a scholar was skinned to death, and he was made a saint. 

One of the many reasons to not quite love the Christian church in its actuality.
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Offline Baruch

Re: Early Christian Schisms
« Reply #4 on: July 25, 2018, 12:57:38 PM »
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Hey, just because I'm an atheist doesn't mean I don't know history. 

But Hypatia, there's a rub of anger.  Cyril mounted a mob against her and they flayed the flesh off her bones, before burning the Library of Alexandria.  She, a scholar was skinned to death, and he was made a saint. 

One of the many reasons to not quite love the Christian church in its actuality.

Alexandrian politics was dirty and for keeps.  Think of the Jews, Pagans and Christians in the city then as competing mafias.
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Offline Cavebear

Re: Early Christian Schisms
« Reply #5 on: July 25, 2018, 05:35:18 PM »
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Alexandrian politics was dirty and for keeps.  Think of the Jews, Pagans and Christians in the city then as competing mafias.

Yeah, but a LIBRARIAN?  AND ABALONE SHELLS?

Abominably twisted from The Music Man':

"Hypatia...Hypatia Librarian
What can I say, my dear, to catch your ear I love you madly, madly
Madam Librarian...
Hypatia Heaven help us if the library caught on fire
And the Volunteer Hose Brigademen
Had to whisper the news to Hypatia...
Madam Librarian
What can I say, my dear, to make it clear I need you badly, badly,
Madam Librarian...
Hypatia If I stumbled and I busted my what-you-may-call-it
I could lie on your floor unnoticed
'Till my body had turned to carrion...Madam Librarian..."


Forgive me...
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Offline Baruch

Re: Early Christian Schisms
« Reply #6 on: July 25, 2018, 07:40:36 PM »
Sex starved celibates behave bizarrely.
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Offline Cavebear

Re: Early Christian Schisms
« Reply #7 on: August 01, 2018, 08:06:52 AM »
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Sex starved celibates behave bizarrely.

I suppose.  But it is always good to get word from those who know...  Thank you.
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Offline Baruch

Re: Early Christian Schisms
« Reply #8 on: August 01, 2018, 12:40:37 PM »
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I suppose.  But it is always good to get word from those who know...  Thank you.

So, still butt hurt about things that happened over 1000 years ago?  Well, that makes you fit to be ... religious ;-)
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Offline Cavebear

Re: Early Christian Schisms
« Reply #9 on: August 04, 2018, 04:26:55 AM »
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So, still butt hurt about things that happened over 1000 years ago?  Well, that makes you fit to be ... religious ;-)

The importance of what happened 1,000 years ago depends on the location...

World History 1000-1100 AD

Basil II Defeats Bulgarians, Canute II Rules England, Boleslav-King Of Poland, Ommiad Caliphate Of Spain Dissolved, Byzantine Empress Poison Husband, Sejuk Turks Take Bagdhad, Battle Of Hasting, Anwratha - Burma United, Tower Of London, Kingdom Of Ghana, Alfonso VI Conquers Toledo, El Cid Takes Valencia, First Crusades
1014 AD Basil II Defeats Bulgarians-The Byzantine Emperor Basil II routed the Bulgarians at the Battle of Cimbalugu. Basil killed most of the Bulgarian army, and then blinded 24,000 Bulgarian captives. The Bulgarians were forced to submit to Byzantine rule.
1016 AD Canute II Rules All Of England- On the death of Ethelred II the King of England, Edmund II succeeded to the throne. Canute II, a Dane, was chosen by the Witan- the advisory council to the King. Canute II battled Edmund at Ashington and defeated him. This led to Caunute II being crowned King of all England.
1025 AD Boleslav- First King Of Poland- Poland gained independence from the Holy Roman Empire when Boleslav I was crowned the first Polish King at Gniezno in 825. Poland quickly emerged as one of Europe's most powerful nations, extending from the Bugthe to the Elbe and from the Danube River to the Baltic Sea.
1031 AD The Ommiad Caliphate Of Spain Dissolved - After 30 years of anarchy, the Omayyad Caliphate of Spain dissolved on the death of Hisham III. Spain was divided into a number of small Muslim states.
1034 AD Byzantine Empress Poison Husband The Byzantine Empress Zoe poisoned her husband, Romanus III. She went on to marry Michael IV of Paphiagonia and then reigned together with him until 1041.
1055 AD Sejuk Turks Take Bagdhad- Seljuk Turks, under the command of Togrul, captured Baghdad. They ousted the Persian Buwayhid Dynasty. The Abbasides looked upon the Seljuks as liberators and supported them. The Seljuk Empire would reach it's zenith under Malik Shah who expanded the Empire to the point that it seriously threatened the Byzantine Empire's continued existence.
1057 AD Anwratha - Burma United - Anawratha, the Burmese king of Paga, conquered the Mon Kingdom of Thaton. For the first time, all of Burma was under unified rule.
Battle Of Hasting- At the Battle of Hastings, the Norman, William the Conqueror defeated Harold II, King of England. The victory led to the complete domination of England by the Normans. On December 25th, William was crowned King of England at Westminster Abbey.
1066 AD Tower Of London Constructed- William the Conquerer began building the Tower of London in 1066. It stands to this day.
1076 AD Kingdom Of Ghana Defeated- The Berber Almoravids conquered the Kingdom of Ghana. The capital Kumbi Saleh was sacked. The Ghanaian empire fell apart.
1085 AD Alfonso VI Conquers Toledo- Alfonso VI, the Christian King of Leon and Castile, captured Toledo from the Almoravids and made it his capital.
1094 AD El Cid Takes Valencia- Rodrigo Diaz de Vivar known as El Cid, captured the Moorish Kingdom of Valencia after a nine-month siege. Violating the terms of the surrender, El Cid had the Cadi ibn Djahaff burned alive.
1096 - 1099 First Crusades- The First Crusade began with a call By Alexius I in 1095 for assistance from other Christian states to counter repeated attacks made by Seljuk Turks. He also decried Muslim control of the Holy Land.

His call was echoed by the Pope. As many as 30,000 people responded and joined the Crusade. The Seljuk Muslims are easily defeated in Syria. In 1099, the Crusaders arrive in Jerusalem. They lay siege to the city, capture it and thoroughly sack it killing thousands of Muslims and Jews indiscriminately.
 -------
Amazing...
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Offline Baruch

Re: Early Christian Schisms
« Reply #10 on: August 04, 2018, 08:11:32 AM »
Yeah, they used to have fun in the "good old days".  It is always a good time to kill Jews.
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Offline Cavebear

Re: Early Christian Schisms
« Reply #11 on: August 04, 2018, 08:16:53 AM »
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Yeah, they used to have fun in the "good old days".  It is always a good time to kill Jews.

And mostly everyone else, too.  "Let God sort them out", as if being killed was a minor matter.  What inane butchery...
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Offline Baruch

Re: Early Christian Schisms
« Reply #12 on: August 04, 2018, 08:43:29 AM »
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And mostly everyone else, too.  "Let God sort them out", as if being killed was a minor matter.  What inane butchery...

Read the specifics of where that quote comes from.  Papal legate, at the sacking of Beziers France about 1209.  That is also where "dogs of war" come from.  They were ferrel teenage boys, not dogs.

You are not allowed to view links. Register or Loginéziers

The Catholic Church doesn't tolerate opposition (anti-Cathar Crusade).  Some of the Crusades were against fellow Europeans.  And the King of France (Paris and surrounds) was looking to extend his measly territory.
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