We're screwed: Anthony Kennedy retiring.

[Hydra009]

My brain hurts

I'll make this simple.

There are two basic types of democracies: direct democracies (where people vote on policies directly) and representative democracies (where people vote for legislators, who then vote on policies).

The USA is by and large the latter (though some local/state policies are voted directly through referendums).

Our system of representative democracy also qualifies as a republic (a system with an elected or nominated president rather than a monarch).

[Hydra009]

Theocracy does not allow freedom of speech, freedom of conscience

Analysis.  So you consider yourself a supporter of secular government and an opponent of theocracy?

How does that square with your clear preference for Republicans (who worryingly assert that this is a "Christian nation" and assert that Christianity should be the national religion) over Democrats?

[_Xenu_]

There is SO MUCH to discuss about this sudden news. 

First. we have to recognize that Kennedy is essentially conservative (but not rabidly so).  But that he is retiring at a very awkward time that shows his true colors.  He could have waited a few months, and let it come after the 2018 elections, but chose not to.  By retiring at this time, he shows he wants Trump to appoint a new Justice almost certainly anti-freedom, anti moderate.

The consequences will be extreme.  Women will lose the right to abortion at any time beyond discovery of pregnancy.  Immigrants will continue have their children abducted.  Civil liberties will be reduced in all areas.  The verymost rich will become richer while the middle class vanishes and the poor grow poorer. 

We will gradually not become a democracy.  Trump is learning from world autocrats and implementing their strategies. He is diminishing our Federal Agencies dedicated to protecting our air, water, food, drugs, and equipment safety.  He is placing justices at lower levels who are against established court rulings like Roe v Wade and even Brown v The Board of Education.

He is gradually chipping away at the basic agreements of democracy like fair judges, objective Federal Agencies, and basic consensus.

This is not even Republican vs Democrat.  This is Trump vs democracy. 

Democracy can fail.   John Adams once said "Remember, democracy never lasts long. It soon wastes, exhausts, and murders itself. There never was a democracy yet that did not commit suicide."   

"Outside Independence Hall when the Constitutional Convention of 1787 ended, Mrs. Powel of Philadelphia asked Benjamin Franklin, "Well, Doctor, what have we got, a republic or a monarchy?" With no hesitation whatsoever, Franklin responded, "A republic, if you can keep it."

The question is, can we keep Democracy in the face of Trumpian autocratism and local laws of some States that want us to return to 1900.  I think we are at a tipping point. 

We will either go the way of the Romans losing their Republic to Dictators, and smaller nations failing to maintain their rights in the face of determined autocrats, or we will stand up and challenge them in all legal ways and regain our basic democracy on consensus and good will between political parties. 

We have had both at times in the US and we face that challenge again. 

All we have to do is lose JUST ONCE and then we are Russia.  Or China.  Or Iran.  Or North Korea.

Let's not go down that path...

Well spoken sir. Trump is a walking stress test on our democratic institutions.

[_Xenu_]

Actually, yes it is.

A republic is simply a democracy that has had limits placed on it. At the end of the day, both systems core principle is that the majority hold the majority of power; a republic just makes sure that the majority doesn't hold absolute power and provides protections to the minority.

Republics are merely a subset of democracy, not their own branch of politics.

In a pure democracy, people vote about everything. In a republic, we elect people to represent us. The US is a republic.

[Baruch]

Well spoken sir. Trump is a walking stress test on our democratic institutions.

Stress testing is good .... Obama a stress test also.  Otherwise people think that everything is just going along fine.  I haven't been comfortable with what the US is ... my whole life.

[Shiranu]

In a pure democracy, people vote about everything. In a republic, we elect people to represent us. The US is a republic.

The US is both, both because a republic is a democracy and we also have propositions which are directly voted on by the people.

There are democracies outside of pure democracies, and a republic is one of those.

[Draconic Aiur]

The US is both, both because a republic is a democracy and we also have propositions which are directly voted on by the people.

There are democracies outside of pure democracies, and a republic is one of those.

If we were a fucking democracy then the majority vote would win and people like Hilary would win. We are not a democracy thy are two separate things.

[Unbeliever]

Wow, this is like watching a verbal tennis match!

[Baruch]

Wow, this is like watching a verbal tennis match!

Ping pong with China ... call in Forrest Gump ;-)

[Draconic Aiur]

Wow, this is like watching a verbal tennis match!

It shouldn't be. But these Peeps are arguing against what the constitution says our government is.

[Unbeliever]

What possible difference can a word make in any practical way?

[Shiranu]

We are not a democracy...

From your own argument on the last page...

The United States is a federal republic and a constitutional representative democracy.

I would also like to note that you put "constitutional representative democracy" in bold quotation.

[Hakurei Reimu]

If we were a fucking democracy then the majority vote would win and people like Hilary would win. We are not a democracy thy are two separate things.

That's just the fact that you don't directly elect the president â€" you elect the electoral college, and they elect the next prez. Yet you still vote, and the votes do have an appreciable effect on who gets to be president because you can tell from the outcome of the vote who the next president will be. It's merely a more complicated game than simple majority. If Hillary got 95% of the popular vote, there is no way that Trump could have won.

[Shiranu]

Wow, this is like watching a verbal tennis match!

Only if you want to call the match 6-love, since he has yet to actually manage to even hit the ball back off the serve.

Shit, it's even triples for his side, and they cant come together to get the ball over the net.

[Draconic Aiur]

From your own argument on the last page...

I would also like to note that you put "constitutional representative democracy" in bold quotation.

For that is our similarity to democracy but are not a "democracy".  We are a republic. And Republic is not a king of democracy, because a republic is its own thing.

Stop flipping my words around.