Author Topic: Adventures in Garage Door Openers  (Read 413 times)

Offline SGOS

Re: Adventures in Garage Door Openers
« Reply #15 on: June 10, 2018, 12:58:57 AM »
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I also heard that a good rating by better business bureau is worthless. It was started by a shifty person trying to make a quick buck. If you are not a paying member of the BBB you automatically have a bad rating. and if you are one of the biggest financial supporters you automatically have a good rating. has about as much value as the phrase FDA approved ; just another cigarette paper
This actually doesn't surprise me at all, what with the same thing happening with Moody's and Standard and Poor's simply selling ratings on stocks and bonds along with the fake ratings I've seen for all sorts of stuff on the Internet, while the Consumer Protection Agency along with other originally good ideas put forth by politicians to rounds of self applause while patting themselves on the back have been underfunded and reorganized into helpless eunuchs by the same politicians that created them.  Gas cans and safety devices are probably mandated on certain products based on campaign contributions by manufacturers of those devices.

Offline SGOS

Re: Adventures in Garage Door Openers
« Reply #16 on: June 10, 2018, 08:15:24 AM »
One of the funky things I've found about garage doors and openers is that the doors are assumed to be substandard in construction, and they require reinforcements.  I wasted a lot of time questioning whether this could be true.  Why would they build them this way, and if it is true, why don't places like Lowes sell the required reinforcements?  One Utube video went so far as to say, "Never use the door bracket that comes with the opener.  It will not hold."  That's a very sweeping claim.

As you might guess, the truth is that some doors are strong enough to withstand the stress of the opener, and some are strong enough not to require every one of the reinforcements.  But how do you know which door you have?  Some of the things are intuitive, and the claim that the door bracket in the opener kit should never be used was one that stopped my installation for several days while I worried over the answer and started looking for the necessary parts.  If I could have gone out an bought one locally, I would have just done it even if it amounted to overkill.

Then I thought of maybe just looking up an installer and asking if he could sell me the parts.  Surely, a guy like that would have the things on hand.  So I looked one up and paid him a visit, a guy that did only one thing; Install garage doors.  But it was an 80 mile round trip with my gas guzzling pickup because I was going to need a part that was 8 ft long, so I made a list of big city shopping to help justify the trip.  Turns out, the guy would not only sell me parts, but he was an encyclopedia of information, willing to share, and this is where things came together for me.

First, the door bracket.  I was right in questioning the utube information about buying a different one.  The door guy asked me if the center of my doors had a vertical style with a thin piece of sheet metal sandwiched in the style.  He showed me a floor sample of a door identical to mine.  The rest of the door was nothing buy insulating foam fluff with an aluminum outside facing.  He said a larger bracket would be better, but not necessary in that door as I suspected.

Second, he said, the most important reinforcement was either 8 feet of angle iron to cover the top edge of the door, or better yet a door strut, which everyone may have noticed on most garage doors and wondered what it was there for.  It's just a piece of folded over galvanized sheet metal that doesn't look like it serves a purpose.  He sold me two struts for $25 each and gave me the proper self threading screws to attach them.  He also corrected my assumptions about where to place the screws.  Incidentally, Amazon was selling this same strut for $499, which was more than the door opener itself.  Sheesh!

I told him I'd been on this project for a week and suggested it was probably a four hour job.  Again he corrected me, and said he calculates that it takes his crew 1 hour for just an opener, and we both had a good laugh over that misconception.  It was a worth while trip, and the most important part of my learning curve.

Online Cavebear

Re: Adventures in Garage Door Openers
« Reply #17 on: June 11, 2018, 04:19:15 AM »
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I'm nearing the end of my learning curve, and I won't go into details of why this has taken so long, but there is one strange thing that I really don't like in the design of apparently all newer garage door openers.  There is a safety feature which must be hooked up to reverse the direction of the door if an obstruction, (like a little kid) is in the way.  I know it's a safety issue and it's been mandated by Federal law that this must be part of the system, but it's a very poor design where the beam sensors are designed to take up an inordinate amount of space on the floor, stick almost a foot out from the wall, and will eventually be kicked and broken if not just kicked off the door.  They merely clamp on into place on the rails of the door, and are not secured with screws.

While I haven't tried the doors yet, I've been told all doors already include a pressure sensitive reversing feature when the door hits something, anyway.  I think the sensitivity can be adjusted with this feature,  too, but I haven't located that adjustment on my opener.  The additional beam sensor must be installed on the floor, so kids, dogs, cats, and cars could easily straddle the beam and fail to activate the reversal if it's needed.

It sounds like Federally mandated gas cans.  Bought one lately?  Every year they try to design them safer, but they are becoming less useable.  Yeah, if you can't get the gas out, they are probably safer, but something seems impractical about this.

My garage door sensors (30 years old) are small and efficient.  About the size of an extension cord plug.  And they work perfectly.  If I stick my foot in there, the door reverses to open.  You might want to look at the attachments.  Perhaps the installer failed to finish that part.

I agree with you about gas cans and some other safety devices.  My Very Safe Gas Can is hard to use (but not yet impossible).  It is harder to fill than empty.

And here is one for you.  I sometimes get serious finger cramps after weeding for a couple hours.  The last time, I could not actually open my bottle of aspirin.  So I stabbed it to death until 2 pills surrendered and fell out.  Given that there are no children here, and that stabbing the container in frustration with a big damn knife was dangerous, what was the child-proof bottle protecting?

I appreciate the Govt protecting me from real dangers, but the definition of "protection" could be discussed more.  I want to be safe from loose lawn-mower blades, but I don't need excessive protection from my aspirin. 
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Offline Baruch

Re: Adventures in Garage Door Openers
« Reply #18 on: June 11, 2018, 06:47:04 AM »
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My garage door sensors (30 years old) are small and efficient.  About the size of an extension cord plug.  And they work perfectly.  If I stick my foot in there, the door reverses to open.  You might want to look at the attachments.  Perhaps the installer failed to finish that part.

I agree with you about gas cans and some other safety devices.  My Very Safe Gas Can is hard to use (but not yet impossible).  It is harder to fill than empty.

And here is one for you.  I sometimes get serious finger cramps after weeding for a couple hours.  The last time, I could not actually open my bottle of aspirin.  So I stabbed it to death until 2 pills surrendered and fell out.  Given that there are no children here, and that stabbing the container in frustration with a big damn knife was dangerous, what was the child-proof bottle protecting?

I appreciate the Govt protecting me from real dangers, but the definition of "protection" could be discussed more.  I want to be safe from loose lawn-mower blades, but I don't need excessive protection from my aspirin.

Violate the law by transferring some pills to a pill box.  Your frustrated behavior you described, was truly Cavebear ;-)
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Offline SGOS

Re: Adventures in Garage Door Openers
« Reply #19 on: June 11, 2018, 08:02:35 AM »
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My garage door sensors (30 years old) are small and efficient.  About the size of an extension cord plug.  And they work perfectly.  If I stick my foot in there, the door reverses to open.  You might want to look at the attachments.  Perhaps the installer failed to finish that part. 
I'm the installer, and they are in place, but not wired.  I will wire them in after I buy some wire covers to tidy the installation up to my satisfaction.  And when I said they stuck out a foot, that was a guess.  I measured them, and it's only 7 1/2 inches, but still enough in the path to get kicked when walking around the car.

I visited a forum dedicated to sensors, and one guy asked how to deactivate them, so they wouldn't be a nuisance.  A couple of guys admitted they installed them in the ceiling next to the opener drive, so they could effectively be taken out of the loop and act as if they weren't there.  Most of the responses were in the form of lectures about safety or horror stories about watching garage doors crush steel Radio Flyer wagons that were left in the way.  Then other responders started calling bullshit because other safety features wouldn't allow that, and the whole thing started a flame war, until finally one guy stepped in and suggested they simply answer the guy's question.  I didn't register so I couldn't jump in, but I have to admit, the place seemed like home.  Well, like this place, anyway.

Online Cavebear

Re: Adventures in Garage Door Openers
« Reply #20 on: June 11, 2018, 08:56:38 AM »
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I'm the installer, and they are in place, but not wired.  I will wire them in after I buy some wire covers to tidy the installation up to my satisfaction.  And when I said they stuck out a foot, that was a guess.  I measured them, and it's only 7 1/2 inches, but still enough in the path to get kicked when walking around the car.

I visited a forum dedicated to sensors, and one guy asked how to deactivate them, so they wouldn't be a nuisance.  A couple of guys admitted they installed them in the ceiling next to the opener drive, so they could effectively be taken out of the loop and act as if they weren't there.  Most of the responses were in the form of lectures about safety or horror stories about watching garage doors crush steel Radio Flyer wagons that were left in the way.  Then other responders started calling bullshit because other safety features wouldn't allow that, and the whole thing started a flame war, until finally one guy stepped in and suggested they simply answer the guy's question.  I didn't register so I couldn't jump in, but I have to admit, the place seemed like home.  Well, like this place, anyway.

Ah, nothing like getting involved in a flame war just for seeking information!  I run into that often enough.

Yes, of course you want the sensors at the bottom.  That's where they matter.  And there is no harm and possibly some good in having them.   Now, mine are about 2" inside the spot where the door actually closes.  As long as the door itself doesn't trigger the door reversal, it's fine.  I wouldn't think they should be much more inside the door than that or you might defeat the purpose. 

I expect the trickiest part will be getting both sensors to "see" each other.  Unless things have changed, you will have a minor light beam emitting from one side and read by the other.  I didn't install my own, but I watched the guy who did it, and he had to fuss with the sending and receiver sensors a bit before they connected.  And the first time he closed the door, the closing of the door moved them slightly and he had to re-adjust.

Or for all I know, they are wifi now and don't care.

But if this helped any, I will be pleased.  I kind of view this site as "atheists talking to each other and helping one another on anything"

Let us know how the garage door sensors work.  And if they don't, I'll take close-up pictures of mine in case that helps.

Cavebear
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Offline SGOS

Re: Adventures in Garage Door Openers
« Reply #21 on: June 11, 2018, 09:19:26 AM »
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Ah, nothing like getting involved in a flame war just for seeking information!  I run into that often enough.

Let us know how the garage door sensors work.  And if they don't, I'll take close-up pictures of mine in case that helps.
I have no doubt that they will work.  I notice that the bracket that attaches them to the door tracks is designed so the beams can be swiveled to meet, and then tightened in that position with a wing nut, which I thought would require some fussing over before I even saw how they were designed to accommodate the necessary fussing.  And the brackets do clamp quite tightly to the tracks, even without provisions for some actual fasteners, but are still vulnerable to getting bumped.  There is a provision to screw them to the wall, but for me, that puts the door tracks right in the middle of the beam.

This is one of those things I can stop thinking about for now, and as often happens, a solution might pop into my head when I'm not focused on it.  I've had that happen twice in the last week with other problems in the installation.

Online Cavebear

Re: Adventures in Garage Door Openers
« Reply #22 on: June 11, 2018, 09:24:21 AM »
Well, I'm glad to see they still operate as they used to and it will just take some adjustments.  I once accidentally kicked one and set it out of place, but it wasn't hard to get it aimed right again.
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Offline SGOS

Re: Adventures in Garage Door Openers
« Reply #23 on: June 11, 2018, 12:11:52 PM »
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And here is one for you.  I sometimes get serious finger cramps after weeding for a couple hours.  The last time, I could not actually open my bottle of aspirin.  So I stabbed it to death until 2 pills surrendered and fell out.   
In the last few years, I've had flare ups of something called pseudo gout, which I had never heard of but is an actual thing.  It can attack ankles, knees, and wrists.  It is very painful and can last for weeks if untreated.  A few days ago, one of those started, but they start so gently that they seem like one of those kinks that's going to work itself out in an hour, but instead they slowly get worse instead of better, until they get worse really fast.  By that time know what it is, and you can't sleep because of the pain, and whatever got hit becomes an immobilized and useless organ.  I couldn't open a jar, and it was one with a loose lid too.  I wrapped it in a towel and jammed a kitchen drawer closed on it, so I could use my good hand to unscrew the lid, and I felt proud of myself for that.

I've found that the standard course of prednisone, which takes about a week, will knock it out in short order.  After I couldn't open the jar yesterday, I started a course of prednisone, which I keep on hand expressly for these attacks, and two hours later I was working in the garage, and then I mowed the lawn, all in what I would call a comfortable physical state.  It's almost completely gone today.  One time they gave me a shot of dexamethasone, which is the stuff they give to immobilized mountain climbers suffering from cerebral and pulmonary bleeding.  They lovingly call it dex:  "Give him a shot of dex, and maybe we can get him down out of the death zone into some air with oxygen in it."  It worked fast too, and as a bounus, I got higher than a kite for three days.  I went to see Dr. Strange at the theater three times, and thought it was the best film ever made in Hollywood.  I was openly jabbering with strangers who seemed quite responsive too.  At least I thought they were, but who knows?

Online Cavebear

Re: Adventures in Garage Door Openers
« Reply #24 on: June 11, 2018, 12:59:11 PM »
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In the last few years, I've had flare ups of something called pseudo gout, which I had never heard of but is an actual thing.  It can attack ankles, knees, and wrists.  It is very painful and can last for weeks if untreated.  A few days ago, one of those started, but they start so gently that they seem like one of those kinks that's going to work itself out in an hour, but instead they slowly get worse instead of better, until they get worse really fast.  By that time know what it is, and you can't sleep because of the pain, and whatever got hit becomes an immobilized and useless organ.  I couldn't open a jar, and it was one with a loose lid too.  I wrapped it in a towel and jammed a kitchen drawer closed on it, so I could use my good hand to unscrew the lid, and I felt proud of myself for that.

I've found that the standard course of prednisone, which takes about a week, will knock it out in short order.  After I couldn't open the jar yesterday, I started a course of prednisone, which I keep on hand expressly for these attacks, and two hours later I was working in the garage, and then I mowed the lawn, all in what I would call a comfortable physical state.  It's almost completely gone today.  One time they gave me a shot of dexamethasone, which is the stuff they give to immobilized mountain climbers suffering from cerebral and pulmonary bleeding.  They lovingly call it dex:  "Give him a shot of dex, and maybe we can get him down out of the death zone into some air with oxygen in it."  It worked fast too, and as a bounus, I got higher than a kite for three days.  I went to see Dr. Strange at the theater three times, and thought it was the best film ever made in Hollywood.  I was openly jabbering with strangers who seemed quite responsive too.  At least I thought they were, but who knows?

Well, I suspect you posted this in the wrong thread, but you are talking straight to me about the problems and solutions, so what the heck...

In my early job year, I had to unload tires off a truck throwing them off our shoulders to roll into the warehouse.  For 6 months, I had 3 hot dogs and drank a quart of Gatorade for lunch,

But when we had to reload tires, we 5 guys had to monkey-climb up the steel stacks and toss them down.  And it was HOT in there in Summer.  I finally fell once 20' (onto a pile of tires) and got fired for being "inept".  But we didn't use drugs, I just wanted to mention that. 

But what I DID do using drugs was haul huge pallets of antifreeze and motor oil from a department store loading dock  to the far end of the store to the auto department.  And that is where the drugs came in.  My boss gave me a few "White Crosses" (a mild amphetimine) and OH BOY I could haul that pallet then and unload it onto the shelves.  I babbled...

"I was openly jabbering with strangers who seemed quite responsive too.  At least I thought they were, but who knows? "  THe good part was that my boss was a bad dealer and liked the pills himself, so I bought them from him is 50 packs for $10 and sold them back to him $1 each.  LOL, I made a profit.  And the day I quit was the last pill like that I ever took.  I'm completely unaddictable.

But I did suffer gout or pseudo-gout a few times.  So I understand what you are saying (took the long way around the barn didn't I).  I took Ibuprofen under DR orders.  The first attack was horrible.  My toe was so sensitive I couldn't sleep and I was away on travel, at a conference I was addressing in part, so I couldn't just call in sick.    After my presentation, I was in so much misery, the hotel drove me to an emergency clinic at 2 am.

Keep in mind I was in Mormon territory.  The DOCTOR told me I had sinned!  I'm not joking.  He said it was gout caused by SIN of drinking beer.  And there I was thinking that "gout" was one of those made-up conditions from medieval times and the DOCTOR was telling me I had SINNED!  And I was in pain, away from home at a conference I didn't want to attend (out in the middle of NOWHERE,  where you couln't even BUY beer BTW), and I had SINNED...

It was altogether unreal...  You can't take aspirin when you are having an attack of gout (its a real thing, I learned later) because
acetylsalicylic acid" actually crystilizes into your joints which is exactly what "gout" is (minerl crytals in the joints) !  But Ibuprofen doesn't, so I could take that.

And when I got back to the office and mentioned the episode to a couple of co-workers, word got around.  All sorts of fine upstanding people from all over the agency told my had had gout attacks too (some almost every year)   Our physical experiences were nearly identical.  Painful big toe, sometimes even an ankle.  Ibuprofen (our wonder drug). And limping around for days...

I had 2 more attacks of gout in the following year.  They say, once is common, but if it is twice it is forever.  I had it 3 times in 1982, and never since.  I never do fit a pattern, LOL! 



Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Offline Baruch

Re: Adventures in Garage Door Openers
« Reply #25 on: June 11, 2018, 01:06:03 PM »
My father developed gout, late in life, from eating shellfish.  He loved cold boiled shrimp.
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