Author Topic: Turkland Communist Party leader is wearing an Apple Watch.  (Read 1012 times)

Offline Cavebear

Re: Turkland Communist Party leader is wearing an Apple Watch.
« Reply #15 on: May 19, 2018, 02:53:23 PM »
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We are talkin' about you, not me.
But when it comes to me, let me say.
I am a member of humanity. And ı am a world citizen. at least, ı feel in that way.

Then my congratulations to you!  And I really mean that...
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Offline Baruch

Re: Turkland Communist Party leader is wearing an Apple Watch.
« Reply #16 on: May 20, 2018, 01:08:40 AM »
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I am wondering very much that why you are referring to United S. as us. Any explanation to this.
THe country you were born in affect your consciousness that so much,
The USA do it, you say: ''We do it''...

Let's go into your childhood : ) why you are behaving in this way.

That is an interesting question ... you get a gold star for that.

I was born in Texas, that is " a whole other country" as advertised ;-)
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Offline Draconic Aiur

Re: Turkland Communist Party leader is wearing an Apple Watch.
« Reply #17 on: May 20, 2018, 05:45:37 AM »
This makes much sense as Trump having a android, and the android's company is evil company bent on world deestruction
« Last Edit: May 20, 2018, 05:47:51 AM by Draconic Aiur »

Offline trdsf

Re: Turkland Communist Party leader is wearing an Apple Watch.
« Reply #18 on: May 20, 2018, 02:35:48 PM »
No, there's actually no paradox.  This is the deep and profound misunderstanding of what Marxism and Communism actually are, as opposed to what was done in their name by the Eastern bloc throughout the 20th century.

There's nothing in Marxism that says you can't be wealthy.  There's nothing in Marxism that says you can't own things for yourself, even quite nice things.  Marx didn't object to wealth, he objected to wealth derived from other people's labor, and communal ownership refers only to the means of production, not to everything.  His thesis was not that ownership is bad per se, but that the guy whose only contribution to production is to own the facility is not actually earning his wealth, he's getting it through other people's work rather than his own.

I'm not going to get into whether or not Marx had a point, I'm just correcting the common misunderstanding about what ownership means to Marx.

The practical upshot is no, there's no paradox, provided he bought it with fairly earned money.  And that's a question of whether or not his compensation as head of the party is commensurate with his work.  That, I don't have the information to judge.
Sir Terry Pratchett, on being told about the theory that the universe is a computer simulation: "If we all get out and in again, would it start to work properly this time?"

Offline Baruch

Re: Turkland Communist Party leader is wearing an Apple Watch.
« Reply #19 on: May 20, 2018, 03:25:41 PM »
Yes, communism is great, so is capitalism, if it wasn't for the idiots who do it wrong ;-(
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Offline Cavebear

Re: Turkland Communist Party leader is wearing an Apple Watch.
« Reply #20 on: May 22, 2018, 04:02:23 AM »
There are many "pure" political ideologies.  Some are rational, some not.  Pure capitalism means that a few people are unbelievably rich and the rest live in poverty because they didn't succeed at the game.  Pure Authoritarianism and Monarchy are about the same.  Pure Communism is not (and I am not a communist) and pure commutarianism is not.  I do sometimes see value in managed commutarianism...

But since nothing can be pure "anything", I rather like social democracy.  It means opportunity, but consequences for failure.  But also survival to the ones who cannot succeed and support for their children who might.  Any functional system of government has to be a blend that rewards some people to some extent, but also offers hope to children for a future.

Just me thinking out loud, I suppose...
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Offline Baruch

Re: Turkland Communist Party leader is wearing an Apple Watch.
« Reply #21 on: May 22, 2018, 06:40:19 AM »
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There are many "pure" political ideologies.  Some are rational, some not.  Pure capitalism means that a few people are unbelievably rich and the rest live in poverty because they didn't succeed at the game.  Pure Authoritarianism and Monarchy are about the same.  Pure Communism is not (and I am not a communist) and pure commutarianism is not.  I do sometimes see value in managed commutarianism...

But since nothing can be pure "anything", I rather like social democracy.  It means opportunity, but consequences for failure.  But also survival to the ones who cannot succeed and support for their children who might.  Any functional system of government has to be a blend that rewards some people to some extent, but also offers hope to children for a future.

Just me thinking out loud, I suppose...

Too bad few agree with that ;-(
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Offline trdsf

Re: Turkland Communist Party leader is wearing an Apple Watch.
« Reply #22 on: May 22, 2018, 11:13:21 AM »
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But since nothing can be pure "anything", I rather like social democracy.  It means opportunity, but consequences for failure.  But also survival to the ones who cannot succeed and support for their children who might.  Any functional system of government has to be a blend that rewards some people to some extent, but also offers hope to children for a future.
I recall our Political Theory class (required for the major so some sadist put it at 8am), the first day of which the professor stated up front that the only political theorist whose ideas could go straight from page to practice was Machiavelli; everyone else needs modification, interpretation and negotiation to become something workable.
Sir Terry Pratchett, on being told about the theory that the universe is a computer simulation: "If we all get out and in again, would it start to work properly this time?"

Offline Baruch

Re: Turkland Communist Party leader is wearing an Apple Watch.
« Reply #23 on: May 22, 2018, 08:43:45 PM »
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I recall our Political Theory class (required for the major so some sadist put it at 8am), the first day of which the professor stated up front that the only political theorist whose ideas could go straight from page to practice was Machiavelli; everyone else needs modification, interpretation and negotiation to become something workable.

Machiavelli theory still works, but only in the Mafia.
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Offline Cavebear

Re: Turkland Communist Party leader is wearing an Apple Watch.
« Reply #24 on: May 25, 2018, 11:27:56 AM »
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I recall our Political Theory class (required for the major so some sadist put it at 8am), the first day of which the professor stated up front that the only political theorist whose ideas could go straight from page to practice was Machiavelli; everyone else needs modification, interpretation and negotiation to become something workable.

Well, actually that IS a sort of political theory.  Just not one I agree with.  I had various poli-sci professors with everything from good old Machiavelli to Lenin, and we had to adjust or fail the courses.  Professor A was a dedicated Leninist, Professor B was a Rockefellerist, Professor C was something else. etc.  We learned to think about all views.  Heck, I had one class where the Professor consider all males scum of the earth and required that we write a class paper proving it (I got a C writing about how women were diminished in TV ads in 1970).

I went to college thinking moderate-left politics were good and I left that way, LOL. 
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Offline Baruch

Re: Turkland Communist Party leader is wearing an Apple Watch.
« Reply #25 on: May 25, 2018, 11:47:39 AM »
Those of you who went to college, and didn't do STEM, need to demand a refund ;-)
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Offline Cavebear

Re: Turkland Communist Party leader is wearing an Apple Watch.
« Reply #26 on: May 25, 2018, 11:53:30 AM »
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Those of you who went to college, and didn't do STEM, need to demand a refund ;-)

I never "stemed".  But I did learn something about reality.  No refund requested.
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Offline Baruch

Re: Turkland Communist Party leader is wearing an Apple Watch.
« Reply #27 on: May 25, 2018, 06:43:00 PM »
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I never "stemed".  But I did learn something about reality.  No refund requested.

Unfortunately political science has nothing to do with reality, just saying.  Like Cheney said, politics is about making reality, not studying it.  Usually making some bad reality in fact.

If you learned about reality, then you learned it like everyone else, not for a school or a book (though I love those).  You learned if from living your daily life, same as a Medieval peasant did.
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Offline Cavebear

Re: Turkland Communist Party leader is wearing an Apple Watch.
« Reply #28 on: May 29, 2018, 02:15:11 AM »
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Unfortunately political science has nothing to do with reality, just saying.  Like Cheney said, politics is about making reality, not studying it.  Usually making some bad reality in fact.

If you learned about reality, then you learned it like everyone else, not for a school or a book (though I love those).  You learned if from living your daily life, same as a Medieval peasant did.

Cheney's view of the reality of politics is not everyone's view of it.  I personally don't think he understood "reality" very well.  Many people who view politics as a "game" get kicked out out of the game.  Trump is going to go out with the same lack of understanding.
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Offline Baruch

Re: Turkland Communist Party leader is wearing an Apple Watch.
« Reply #29 on: May 29, 2018, 08:43:44 PM »
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Cheney's view of the reality of politics is not everyone's view of it.  I personally don't think he understood "reality" very well.  Many people who view politics as a "game" get kicked out out of the game.  Trump is going to go out with the same lack of understanding.

Cheney says ... "So!".  Trump is as scary as a plush toy.  Cheney in the light is dangerous, even more so in the dark.
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