Author Topic: Checking in from California  (Read 386 times)

Checking in from California
« on: April 10, 2018, 11:23:09 PM »
Hiya ~looks like a good group of people and idea(l)s being shared on this forum. Happy to be on board. The atheist nature here caught my eye (raised Irish catholic ~ emancipated in early 2000's), but have moreso been impressed by the width of topics, intellect and good nature here.

--Kevin

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Offline SGOS

Re: Checking in from California
« Reply #1 on: April 11, 2018, 06:35:03 AM »
Welcome. 

Also, a former Christian, but never identified the hoax until I was in my mid 50s.  Hard to believe now.  While the teachings never really seemed reasonable, they did seem like something that could be true if you didn't think too much.  Finally, I couldn't do it anymore.  Truth cannot be found by not thinking too much.  If it has to be that shallow and absurd, it's not worth the bother.
« Last Edit: April 11, 2018, 07:22:47 AM by SGOS »

Offline PopeyesPappy

Re: Checking in from California
« Reply #2 on: April 11, 2018, 06:37:41 AM »
Welcome, Kevin!
Save a life. Adopt a Greyhound.


Re: Checking in from California
« Reply #3 on: April 11, 2018, 09:18:19 AM »
Welcome, Kevin.  My wife terms it 'recovering Catholic' since she began to see the religion of her birth for what it really is.
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent,
Is he able but not willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able or willing?
Then why call him god?

Re: Checking in from California
« Reply #4 on: April 11, 2018, 11:08:43 AM »
Welcome. 

Also, a former Christian, but never identified the hoax until I was in my mid 50s.  Hard to believe now.  While the teachings never really seemed reasonable, they did seem like something that could be true if you didn't think too much.  Finally, I couldn't do it anymore.  Truth cannot be found by not thinking too much.  If it has to be that shallow and absurd, it's not worth the bother.
Fortunately, I figured it out in my mid 30's. Following a difficult life experience, my wife - who was never involved in religion - got sucker-punched by a friend to come and visit her church. We both needed "something" at the time, and for two long years we participated in the madness. But I will say, we were having fun while it lasted. I mean, how could you not have fun being part of the chosen few who begged for forgiveness often enough to ensure passage through the pearly gates? At the end of those two years, we moved out of the area. During the move, we were met with hostility from our christian friends, to the point where most of them cut off communication with us. This got me thinking, which apparently one does not do while on the inside. It only takes a little *thought* for the entire dogma to start falling apart. It took my wife a little longer to get there, as I kept poking holes in her beliefs - till she ultimately passed me on the road to the truth. It was a longer road for me, as I had been indoctrinated at birth, and god was an addiction of habits, burned and buried in my brain. It's a difficult prison to escape, but worth the effort.

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Offline SGOS

Re: Checking in from California
« Reply #5 on: April 11, 2018, 11:43:08 AM »
Fortunately, I figured it out in my mid 30's. Following a difficult life experience, my wife - who was never involved in religion - got sucker-punched by a friend to come and visit her church. We both needed "something" at the time, and for two long years we participated in the madness. But I will say, we were having fun while it lasted. I mean, how could you not have fun being part of the chosen few who begged for forgiveness often enough to ensure passage through the pearly gates? At the end of those two years, we moved out of the area. During the move, we were met with hostility from our christian friends, to the point where most of them cut off communication with us. This got me thinking, which apparently one does not do while on the inside. It only takes a little *thought* for the entire dogma to start falling apart. It took my wife a little longer to get there, as I kept poking holes in her beliefs - till she ultimately passed me on the road to the truth. It was a longer road for me, as I had been indoctrinated at birth, and god was an addiction of habits, burned and buried in my brain. It's a difficult prison to escape, but worth the effort.
Yes, it's not easy shaking off the indoctrination.  Not like you must suffer from it or lose sleep.  It seems to follow a natural path that is probably more accurately described as absurdly time consuming.  Although, I've talked to some atheists that said that letting go of God did cause suffering on the order of withdrawal from an addiction.  Mine took so long that it was just a gradual adaptation, but I do remember clearly the day that I realized I was an atheist and fully embraced the recognition.  It was an epiphany and a thrill of self discovery.

I would think this experience must seem odd to those who grew up as atheists, although what I hear from those people, is that they, "simply never had that experience."  In retrospect, it may seem more odd to me.  How can it be so hard to accept that the whole religion thing is nonsense?  Everything about it defies logic and it's lesser cousin, common sense.  But that is the nature of indoctrination into the world of the occult during the formative years.
« Last Edit: April 11, 2018, 12:04:24 PM by SGOS »

Re: Checking in from California
« Reply #6 on: April 11, 2018, 01:11:02 PM »
but have moreso been impressed by the width of topics, intellect and good nature here.

You are very easily impressed.

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Winner of WitchSabrinas Best Advice Award 2012


We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark; the real
tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light. -Plato

Offline Baruch

Re: Checking in from California
« Reply #7 on: April 11, 2018, 01:18:27 PM »
Welcome.  But can we trust a cadaver in spandex?  You avatar is Deadpool, amIright?

Many Catholics are holiday-only church goers.  Fundie Protestants are the opposite.  Sounds like you were sucked into church activism, and burned out.  It happens even with religious folks.  My experience with congregations is ... they only care when y'all are in the same room, otherwise not so much.  The community part is rather shallow.  But having had that experience, you seem to be more mature than you would be otherwise.
שלום

Re: Checking in from California
« Reply #8 on: April 11, 2018, 01:21:28 PM »
Good on you to become an emancipated freethinker! I hope you'll have fun here, since this is the best atheist forum on the entire web. We talk about all kinds of stuff, though, not just religion, which is what makes it so much fun.

So welcome to our little band of apostates!
God Not Found
"I regard the brain as a computer which will stop working when its components fail. There is no heaven or afterlife for broken down computers; that is a fairy story for people afraid of the dark.”
Stephen Hawking

Re: Checking in from California
« Reply #9 on: April 11, 2018, 03:38:30 PM »


Welcome.  But can we trust a cadaver in spandex?  You avatar is Deadpool, amIright?

Many Catholics are holiday-only church goers.  Fundie Protestants are the opposite.  Sounds like you were sucked into church activism, and burned out.  It happens even with religious folks.  My experience with congregations is ... they only care when y'all are in the same room, otherwise not so much.  The community part is rather shallow.  But having had that experience, you seem to be more mature than you would be otherwise.

Precisely ~across the board. I believe I am better for having had the experience, and shaking it off, versus never having had it at all. I saw recently, in another forum, a user with no beliefs trying to shut down a bible thumper. Without any foundational information it was like two guys yelling at a wall, and expecting results - from the wall. I studied four years of theology in high school. And, while I can't say that I would start an argument with a believer (I just don't care that much) - I could definitely end such an argument.

And yes ~that would be Deadpool :)

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Re: Checking in from California
« Reply #10 on: April 11, 2018, 03:43:52 PM »
Good on you to become an emancipated freethinker! I hope you'll have fun here, since this is the best atheist forum on the entire web. We talk about all kinds of stuff, though, not just religion, which is what makes it so much fun.

So welcome to our little band of apostates!
It was the "other stuff" here that drew me in. I want to see and hear more of what atheists have to say, but keep running into the big argument that ~there is no proof (duh). I watched The Atheist Experience for a short while, till I figured out that every caller was met with the burden of proof argument. I want to hear other points of view - not just the easy knockout punch line of proof. I am finding that here. Good group - glad to be on board.

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Offline Sal1981

Re: Checking in from California
« Reply #11 on: April 11, 2018, 03:57:01 PM »
Hiya.

"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself - and you are the easiest person to fool" --- Richard P. Feynman

Re: Checking in from California
« Reply #12 on: April 11, 2018, 04:49:57 PM »
It was the "other stuff" here that drew me in. I want to see and hear more of what atheists have to say, but keep running into the big argument that ~there is no proof (duh). I watched The Atheist Experience for a short while, till I figured out that every caller was met with the burden of proof argument. I want to hear other points of view - not just the easy knockout punch line of proof. I am finding that here. Good group - glad to be on board.

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It seems to me that the theist needs to be the one to shoulder the burden of proof for what they believe.  It would be like me saying that Bugs Bunny is God--prove that He isn't.
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent,
Is he able but not willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able or willing?
Then why call him god?

Offline Hydra009

Re: Checking in from California
« Reply #13 on: April 11, 2018, 05:04:56 PM »
Good group - glad to be on board.
That might change as you get to know us, lol.  But thanks for the compliment.

Offline Hydra009

Re: Checking in from California
« Reply #14 on: April 11, 2018, 05:26:34 PM »
I want to see and hear more of what atheists have to say, but keep running into the big argument that ~there is no proof (duh). I watched The Atheist Experience for a short while, till I figured out that every caller was met with the burden of proof argument. I want to hear other points of view - not just the easy knockout punch line of proof.
Well, the proof thing is the polka-dotted elephant in the room.  In almost all discussions with theists, there are these big, grandiose claims thrown about with a telling lack of concern for whether or not these claims are actually supported by any facts on the ground.

Mostly, these people are operating on standards of evidence that would work in a church or mosque, and unaware that their "arguments" don't fly in mixed company, let alone an actively skeptical setting.

Because of that glaring weakness, all a skeptic has to do is ask for any supporting evidence, and viola, the topic has suddenly changed.

There are other arguments that have to be dealt with, most of which have to do with relevance (a billion Catholics can't be wrong, no one would die for a lie, etc), reversing the burden of proof, false dilemmas, assuming what you're trying to prove, special pleading, no true scotsman, courtier's reply, etc.

It all gets very tiresome and old hat after a while, to be honest.
« Last Edit: April 11, 2018, 05:37:53 PM by Hydra009 »

 

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