Islam in America

[aitm]

Just think how atheists would die if it was not for God fearing surgeons and doctors who discovered all the workings of Biology.

I am sure to be corrected if wrong, but the church stymied our early doctors from using corpses to help learn more about the human body. God fearing? Highly unlikely. If it was up to "god" every town in the world would have a tent city outside of the town where them nasty stinky bloody women go once a month for 7 days. Your god is a clown. Clowns like other clowns.

[Baruch]

I am sure to be corrected if wrong, but the church stymied our early doctors from using corpses to help learn more about the human body. God fearing? Highly unlikely. If it was up to "god" every town in the world would have a tent city outside of the town where them nasty stinky bloody women go once a month for 7 days. Your god is a clown. Clowns like other clowns.

Yes and know.  Early anatomists, post Galen, who worked on gladiators and Roman soldiers, had to steal bodies from graves.   Nobody was donating their bodies to science.  And, bodies have to carefully handled in crime, per "corpus delecti".  Under early coroner laws, that is why Franklin's basement in London looks like a "cold case" serial killer crime scene.

[Blackleaf]

I am sure to be corrected if wrong, but the church stymied our early doctors from using corpses to help learn more about the human body. God fearing? Highly unlikely. If it was up to "god" every town in the world would have a tent city outside of the town where them nasty stinky bloody women go once a month for 7 days. Your god is a clown. Clowns like other clowns.

You are correct. Even in early American history, doctors had to resort to robbing graves of their corpses in order to study them. The church has always been, and always will be, resistant to scientific advancement. Hell, when gas lighting was invented, the church complained that it was "unnatural" for people to be awake after dark.

[Baruch]

You are correct. Even in early American history, doctors had to resort to robbing graves of their corpses in order to study them. The church has always been, and always will be, resistant to scientific advancement. Hell, when gas lighting was invented, the church complained that it was "unnatural" for people to be awake after dark

Ghouls for science?  So people shouldn't have funerals and burials etc ... because Dr Frankenstein needs anatomy parts?

Some people have disturbed sleep because of city noise and light.

[SGOS]

Hell, when gas lighting was invented, the church complained that it was "unnatural" for people to be awake after dark.

It does seem unnatural, and I more and more find myself awake in the middle of the night prowling around the house like a zombie.  Then I get tired and fall asleep in the middle of the day like a vampire.  Yeah, it's unnatural.

But even in my younger days going to bed at sundown would have seemed unnatural.  There was no way I was going to fall asleep before 10 or 11.

[Mousetrap]

I am sure to be corrected if wrong, but the church stymied our early doctors from using corpses to help learn more about the human body. God fearing? Highly unlikely. If it was up to "god" every town in the world would have a tent city outside of the town where them nasty stinky bloody women go once a month for 7 days. Your god is a clown. Clowns like other clowns.

It still does not change the fact that Christians established medicine we have today.
Why the Straw Puppet argument to attempt dust in other's eyes?
Do you think it is appropriate to build an argument against facts, that has nothing to do with Christians who achieved the science we have today?

Not a verygood argument anyhow!

[Cavebear]

It still does not change the fact that Christians established medicine we have today.
Why the Straw Puppet argument to attempt dust in other's eyes?
Do you think it is appropriate to build an argument against facts, that has nothing to do with Christians who achieved the science we have today?

Not a verygood argument anyhow!

Christians did not establish our medical practices.  Actually Moslems did most of that until the Crusades.  Non-christian doctors in Europe carried on past that (christianity forbade vivisection).

[Baruch]

Christians did not establish our medical practices.  Actually Moslems did most of that until the Crusades.  Non-christian doctors in Europe carried on past that (christianity forbade vivisection).

vivisection = dissecting a living being
surgery = cutting patient
dissection = dissecting a dead being

surgery was always allowed.  vivisection was and still is, illegal, on humans.  dissection of humans was prohibited.

[Blackleaf]

It's absolutely moronic to claim that Christians established anything in science. In a world where being a skeptic can get you killed, of course scientists are going to say they're Christian, even when they're not. Science did not grow because of Christianity, but in spite of it. Christianity has been opposed to science from the very beginning, and the scientists who existed would have been put to death if they expressed dissent from the religion. Why do you think that most scientists today are atheists? It's because we no longer live in a society were atheism is a punishable offense. Science flourishes today because of secularism.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dPOMNdvKZtQ

"Historically, this has been Christianity's typical MO: Fight a war against progress, lose that war against progress, and when that progress turns out to be a good thing after all, claim credit for that progress."

"If we look at our top scientists now, they are mostly atheists. That's true even in the United States, where atheists are still a tiny minority. Let that sink in. As soon as you're no longer allowed to kill this tiny minority, suddenly that same tiny minority becomes the majority of your top minds."

[pr126]

It's absolutely moronic to claim that Christians established anything in science.

List of Christians in science and technology

Francis Bacon, Copernicus, Galileo, Pascal, Leibnitz, Newton, Darwin, Kepler, Lavoisier, Volta, Ampere, Faraday, Babbage, Lister, Maxwell, Kelvin, Joule, Mercali, Rontgen, Mendel, Marconi, Heisenberg and many more.

[Baruch]

All secret atheists in Taqiyah from the Inquisition ;-)

Humans prove every day that there is no progress.

Most scientists today ... are secular.  That wasn't always true.

The average person is threatened by change, so feel threatened by new knowledge.  This is lower than religion.

Knowledge isn't everything, but it is useful.  Understanding is better.  Wisdom better still.  Science doesn't aid understanding or wisdom.  In Logical Positivism ... all philosophy was denied, all art was denied ... only logic and empirical science allowed.  This died out in the 1950s.  It was replaced by tripping on acid and attending Beatles concerts while they pretended to be Hindu.

[Mousetrap]

There are 2 roots we should applaud  on why science advanced in the West.
The Renaissance and Reformation.

I can only shake my head when an Atheist tries to tell me that the Christians did not want scientists to advance with Science.
They have this huge capacity to generalize anything they need to change into a straw puppet.

There might have been some Jesuits Catholics who wanted to stop certain published observations because of their pre conceived bias, but they eventually were silenced by men such as Newton who was safe in England, and not in a Catholic country.
As soon as the Catholic Church saw what the Reformers achieved on science, they stopped their foolishness and joined in the feast of scientific discoveries!

One should actually compare the Catholic Church of the 14th and 15th century with Atheism of today!
Just as when the priests then hated scientific truth, so does Atheism today!

[Hakurei Reimu]

There are 2 roots we should applaud  on why science advanced in the West.
The Renaissance and Reformation.

I can only shake my head when an Atheist tries to tell me that the Christians did not want scientists to advance with Science.

They were willing to go along with science at first because they thought their religious beliefs would be vindicated. When that changed, they stopped being so in support of science.

[Baruch]

They were willing to go along with science at first because they thought their religious beliefs would be vindicated. When that changed, they stopped being so in support of science.

Luther wasn't fooled, he immediately condemned Copernicus, same as the Pope did.  But back then, science was natural philosophy, and philosophy was the handmaid of theology.

[Blackleaf]

List of Christians in science and technology

Francis Bacon, Copernicus, Galileo, Pascal, Leibnitz, Newton, Darwin, Kepler, Lavoisier, Volta, Ampere, Faraday, Babbage, Lister, Maxwell, Kelvin, Joule, Mercali, Rontgen, Mendel, Marconi, Heisenberg and many more.

And? Again, Christianity was slowing scientific progress, not advancing it. Which you'd know if you'd read beyond the first sentence, or watched the fucking video. Want to know how many ancient scientists were atheists? So would I, but those people were either playing the part or dead. Early scientists had to walk a fine line between advancement and heresy. Discover something that the church deems incompatible with church doctrine? Keep quiet or face the consequences.