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9/11 Conspiracy Theory

Started by cabinetmaker, January 31, 2018, 02:48:20 PM

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cabinetmaker

I participate on a theology forum (Well there's a shocker!!) and I run into a fair amount of people there that truly believe that 9/11 was an inside job.  I am curious to see what the fine people on this forum think of 9/11.
“Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside in a cloud of smoke, thoroughly used up, totally worn out, and loudly proclaiming "Wow! What a Ride!”
Hunter S. Thompson

Unbeliever

I don't know that "Terrible Tuesday" was an inside job, but I do know that many questions weren't answered to my satisfaction. I don't think the official version was the entire truth of it. But I don't especially want to talk about it here, either, since it won't do a bit of good. I, and the world, have moved on.
God Not Found
"There is a sucker born-again every minute." - C. Spellman

Hakurei Reimu

The only conspiracy I have ever seen in play on 9/11 was the obvious one of twenty-someodd Muslim extremists hijacking and crashing 4 planes. All the others fail to live up to any sort of credibility.
Warning: Don't Tease The Miko!
(she bites!)
Spinny Miko Avatar shamelessly ripped off from Iosys' Neko Miko Reimu

Mike Cl

Not much of a conspiracy theory kind of guy.  Don't know if it was an inside job or not.  I think not.  But what was sort of brushed aside then and now, is that most of the participants were  Saudies and not from Iraq or Iran.  And Bush was pretty quick to use that as an excuse to attack Iraq.
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?<br />Then he is not omnipotent,<br />Is he able but not willing?<br />Then whence cometh evil?<br />Is he neither able or willing?<br />Then why call him god?

Mike Cl

Well, cabinetmaker, what do you think about it??
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?<br />Then he is not omnipotent,<br />Is he able but not willing?<br />Then whence cometh evil?<br />Is he neither able or willing?<br />Then why call him god?

Baruch

#5
I watched the second plane live hit the second tower while I was at work.  My parents only experienced news reals of Pearl Harbor.  The TV was on in the patient waiting room, and the first news report on the first plane had stirred some interest.  And of course later in the day we heard about the crash into the Pentagon, and into that field in Pennsylvania.  Where I worked, we went to FPCON Delta (highest level of lockdown, worldwide).  That is the only time I have experienced that.  I wasn't particularly afraid.  I was still married, and my daughter was still young.

Having worked with the US government for several decades ... I can tell you that nothing the government tells you is the complete truth, nor is it a complete lie.  That isn't how government rolls.  The public isn't entitled to anything, including the full truth ... other than death and taxes.  That was certainly true concerning the US invasion of Iraq in 2003.  National security dictates that the truth is used, only if it is of benefit to the current operation, and falsehood is used, only if it is of benefit to the current operation.  Winning is the only standard of comparison.

Other than that, I don't know anything more than any other American about 9/11, then nor now ... and if I did, it would be wrong of me to share it.  I don't support Edward Snowden (though I understand what he did and why), anymore than I supported the Vietnam War demonstrations (though I understand what they did and why).  I have sympathy for all parties in a political conflict, but usually few wins are to be had, if any.  Not all anti-government activity can cover itself with virtue signaling.

Snowden had predecessors:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4N2Iw953cc4
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Baruch

Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Baruch

This is pretty funny, to spot this the same day as I passed the new 501 series Security + certification test ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WLh4kuaFKlI
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Johan

I think its not even the slightest bit surprising that people on a theology forum would also be big into conspiracy theory. Once you've gotten to the point where evidence isn't required or even desired, you'll more or less believe anything anyone tries to sell you so long as it aligns with your own internal narrative.
Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false and by the rulers as useful

Baruch

Quote from: Johan on January 31, 2018, 08:20:09 PM
I think its not even the slightest bit surprising that people on a theology forum would also be big into conspiracy theory. Once you've gotten to the point where evidence isn't required or even desired, you'll more or less believe anything anyone tries to sell you so long as it aligns with your own internal narrative.

Except that real shit does happen ... including double agents etc.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Johan

Real shit does happen. And when it does, there is evidence. There is ALWAYS evidence.
Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false and by the rulers as useful

Baruch

Quote from: Johan on January 31, 2018, 08:47:28 PM
Real shit does happen. And when it does, there is evidence. There is ALWAYS evidence.

Not unambiguous evidence.  And not any that you or I would ever be allowed to see.  How long before a story about Enigma (but maybe not the real story) was allowed in public?
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

trdsf

Inside job?  Probably not.

Taken advantage of by the warmongers and war profiteers?  Yeah, that's pretty clear.  If they were serious about rooting out the 9/11 conspirators after invading Afghanistan, the next target should have been Saudi Arabia, not Iraq, and that should have been dones only after being damn sure the job in Afghanistan was complete.

Instead, they left Afghanistan half in the hands of Taliban thugs and immediately moved on Iraq.  And given the number of times Dubya moved the goalposts in the run-up to the invasion of Iraq, it's pretty clear that war there was their goal once they saw they had an opportunity.  remember that they prioritized defending the oil ministry while the museumâ€"and by extension, the historical legacy of human civilizationâ€"was looted.  That should tell you what their ultimate goal really was.

And, predictably, they fucked *that* up too.

Conspiracy?  No.  Greed?  You betcha.
"My faith in the Constitution is whole, it is complete, it is total, and I am not going to sit here and be an idle spectator to the diminution, the subversion, the destruction of the Constitution." -- Barbara Jordan

Sal1981

I believe most of the official story, that Muslim extremists, mainly from Saudi Arabia, crashed 2 planes into the WTC, 1 plane into the Pentagon and 1 plane into a field. That building 7 fell from falling debris from the WTC. I remember watching the whole ordeal on BBC world news and how surreal the whole thing felt.

The whole "jet fuel can't melt steel beams" is the first indication that people haven't even listened to the official story, because they never melted, but buckled under strain - this was explained in detail in the official story.

Gawdzilla Sama

Conspiracy advocates are never about getting the truth, because it's obvious they ignore it when they get it. Their goal is to attack a person, persons, or an organization. This results in the resolute refusal to admit that there are fatal flaws in their advocacy, they steam right past that insoluble problem and continue their attacks.

With that in mind the way to deal with them is to address their claims, not them. Prove it wrong and show that proof whenever they bring up a "gotcha!" point.
We 'new atheists' have a reputation for being militant, but make no mistake  we didn't start this war. If you want to place blame put it on the the religious zealots who have been poisoning the minds of the  young for a long long time."
PZ Myers