Author Topic: On Miracles  (Read 7226 times)

Re: On Miracles
« Reply #30 on: January 10, 2018, 02:26:06 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
G-d isn't inhuman, just more than human.  But demons see things your way.  They project their own hideousness onto others.  Just like in politics.

If we're all demigods in your view, who are the demons?
"Oh, wearisome condition of humanity,
Born under one law, to another bound;
Vainly begot, and yet forbidden vanity,
Created sick, commanded to be sound."
--Fulke Greville

Offline Baruch

Re: On Miracles
« Reply #31 on: January 10, 2018, 02:47:28 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
If we're all demigods in your view, who are the demons?

Its a matter of attitude.  At extremes some people are angelic, others are demonic.  Zoroastrianism is wrong ... so is what the Abrahamic religions borrowed from Zoroastrianism.  The Cold War for instance, is institutionalized Zoroastrianism, as were the Crusades and the Jihad.  If you divide people in general, in two, you are also dividing your own self in two.  Schizo.
« Last Edit: January 10, 2018, 02:49:21 PM by Baruch »
πŽπŽœπŽœπŽŸπŽŒπŽ€πŽπŽŽπŽ€πŽ€πŽšπŽ€πŽŸπŽπŽœπŽœπŽŸπŽπŽ€πŽπŽ‰πŽ€πŽ€πŽšπŽ€
luu shalmaata luu balt’aata
May you be well, may you be healthy

Offline trdsf

Re: On Miracles
« Reply #32 on: January 12, 2018, 12:16:18 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
If we're all demigods in your view, who are the demons?
I know I'm not a god of any sort.  If I were, things would be run a damn sight better in this universe.
Sir Terry Pratchett, on being told about the theory that the universe is a computer simulation: "If we all get out and in again, would it start to work properly this time?"

Offline Baruch

Re: On Miracles
« Reply #33 on: January 12, 2018, 12:35:08 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
I know I'm not a god of any sort.  If I were, things would be run a damn sight better in this universe.

Demigods can only put their BVDs on two legs at a time, not their pants ;-)

If you want things to be better, run for office, and clean up the DNC or RNC.
πŽπŽœπŽœπŽŸπŽŒπŽ€πŽπŽŽπŽ€πŽ€πŽšπŽ€πŽŸπŽπŽœπŽœπŽŸπŽπŽ€πŽπŽ‰πŽ€πŽ€πŽšπŽ€
luu shalmaata luu balt’aata
May you be well, may you be healthy

Re: On Miracles
« Reply #34 on: January 15, 2018, 09:01:16 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
This thought has crossed my mind from time to time.  Why did god only issue his 'word' in one language and in one spot?  Has a bible turned up in say, the Americas dating to that time period?  Or Asia or Europe--or anywhere else?  And why was Jesus, the son of god, not paraded around any other part of the world?  God did not have enough semen in impregnate more than one woman?  Why not Jesus' all over the world teaching the same lessons and healing the sick in that part of the world?  And why couldn't god have written and distributed the same bible in all the languages of the world at that time and in material that would not rot away?  And if this god were perfect and all knowing, why would a bible be needed in the first place? 



This great video pretty much illustrate your post.

Well worth watching.



You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login


You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
« Last Edit: January 15, 2018, 09:24:54 PM by Simon Moon »
And if there were a God, I think it very unlikely that He would have such an uneasy vanity as to be offended by those who doubt His existence - Russell

Re: On Miracles
« Reply #35 on: January 15, 2018, 09:13:40 PM »
That quote was from Mike CL, not me. I was totally confused because I couldn't remember typing that!
β€œYou are the sky. Everything else – it’s just the weather.”

― Pema ChΓΆdrΓΆn

Re: On Miracles
« Reply #36 on: January 15, 2018, 09:25:13 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
That quote was from Mike CL, not me. I was totally confused because I couldn't remember typing that!

Corrected!
And if there were a God, I think it very unlikely that He would have such an uneasy vanity as to be offended by those who doubt His existence - Russell

Re: On Miracles
« Reply #37 on: January 15, 2018, 09:26:53 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login


This great video pretty much illustrate your post.

Well worth watching.



You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login


You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
Yes, Simon, that is a good illustration of my point.  I had not see that before.
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent,
Is he able but not willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able or willing?
Then why call him god?

Offline Baruch

Re: On Miracles
« Reply #38 on: January 15, 2018, 10:10:08 PM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
Corrected!

I have editing errors too, where I type stuff inside the Quotes, instead of after them.  This makes who said what, unclear.

DarkMatters is good, has been posted here many times before.  The #4 on this series, just before the posted one, is on Lucifer.  I watched that one just now, too.

These show up the conundrums of theology.  Which needs to be done, because theologians are just geeks who don't really get religion in the first place.  They impress the ignorant and illiterate.  Most people don't in fact get religion, they simply go thru the motions, like they do with most things in their lives.  Ritual/habit is how we get thru most things.

If one takes the "objective" aka "external" aka "material" view ... to the exclusion of the "subjective" aka "internal" aka "spiritual" view ... then Camus is right ... the only important question is suicide, individual and social.  Reductionism is its own absurdity.  In pre-modern societies, they didn't have this distraction ... and they dismissed the geeks.

They knew they were people, who lived among other people.  That they were alive, for awhile, and had to get on with daily life, not speculate on string theory.  As Socrates pointed out, the only relevant study for humans isn't Thales' TOE (which was all wet), it is how to be a better human.  I had counseling once, about not being a Vulcan, about just being human.  It was good advice.

I could take many pages, to personally diss everything about the Bible, everything others say in its favor, and everything other say against it.  But that would be a waste of my time and yours.  The video is good as far as it goes, but like any such discussion, it lies, by what it leaves out.  Inevitably, things have to be left out, invalidating the argument.

This stuff is just Nietzsche in action ... obsessing over a book you don't like.  Though I do like Nietzsche's program of getting back to Greek paganism.
« Last Edit: January 15, 2018, 10:40:32 PM by Baruch »
πŽπŽœπŽœπŽŸπŽŒπŽ€πŽπŽŽπŽ€πŽ€πŽšπŽ€πŽŸπŽπŽœπŽœπŽŸπŽπŽ€πŽπŽ‰πŽ€πŽ€πŽšπŽ€
luu shalmaata luu balt’aata
May you be well, may you be healthy

Re: On Miracles
« Reply #39 on: January 16, 2018, 11:06:19 AM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
If a god suddenly performed a miracle for all of the world to see, my first thought would be,
"According to the Problem of Evil, you're either deeply incompetent or actively malicious. How do we kill you?"

?

Or maybe that's just me.

Offline SGOS

Re: On Miracles
« Reply #40 on: January 16, 2018, 11:34:30 AM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
"According to the Problem of Evil, you're either deeply incompetent or actively malicious. How do we kill you?"
There are problems with killing God, not the least of which is that it is impossible to know if he is alive or dead at any given moment.  This is why we have the Heisenberg Principle.  There are two reasons we talk about the Heisenberg Principle.  First, it's fun to say, "Heisenberg Principle" in a sentence when you want people to think you know what you are talking about.  Second, we seldom know what we are talking about, which is the main reason for the Heisenberg Principle to begin with.

Re: On Miracles
« Reply #41 on: January 16, 2018, 11:40:17 AM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
There are problems with killing God, not the least of which is that it is impossible to know if he is alive or dead at any given moment.  This is why we have the Heisenberg Principle.
Ah, but isn't God's current state of vitality/mortality observed the moment he reveals himself to take credit for the miracle?

Offline SGOS

Re: On Miracles
« Reply #42 on: January 16, 2018, 11:49:32 AM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
Ah, but isn't God's current state of vitality/mortality observed the moment he reveals himself to take credit for the miracle?
This is only true to the person witnessing the miracle.  But he doesn't know what he's talking about, can't demonstrate it to anyone else in his peer group, and so they have to take it on his authority.  Heisenberg isn't buying it.
« Last Edit: January 16, 2018, 11:51:28 AM by SGOS »

Re: On Miracles
« Reply #43 on: January 16, 2018, 11:50:56 AM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
This is only true to the person witnessing the miracle.  But he doesn't know what he's talking about, can't demonstrate it to anyone else except his peer group, and so they have to take it on his authority.  Heisenberg isn't buying it.
So what you're saying is, God doesn't reveal himself because if he did then he'd be observed and become a certain existence and thereby temporarily lose his immortality?

Hmm.

Offline SGOS

Re: On Miracles
« Reply #44 on: January 16, 2018, 11:52:09 AM »
You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login
So what you're saying is, God doesn't reveal himself because if he did then he'd be observed and become a certain existence and thereby temporarily lose his immortality?

Hmm.
Sure, why not?

 

SMF spam blocked by CleanTalk