Author Topic: A Word To Left-Wing Students  (Read 1564 times)

Offline Baruch

Re: A Word To Left-Wing Students
« Reply #30 on: January 11, 2018, 06:33:31 AM »
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Literal nihilism is what.

Mike CL and Unbeliever claim to be nihilists, yet they still have ideas and words.  They need to work harder, or join a Zen monastery to do it right.
שלום

Re: A Word To Left-Wing Students
« Reply #31 on: January 11, 2018, 10:47:20 AM »
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Mike CL and Unbeliever claim to be nihilists, yet they still have ideas and words.  They need to work harder, or join a Zen monastery to do it right.
You love to define me.  Ah, what the hell, gives you something to do.  And as you know, I don't fit into any one niche very well.  And you too, need to work harder in your belief in G_d, or join a monastery to do it right.
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent,
Is he able but not willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able or willing?
Then why call him god?

Re: A Word To Left-Wing Students
« Reply #32 on: January 11, 2018, 01:21:15 PM »
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Mike CL and Unbeliever claim to be nihilists, yet they still have ideas and words.  They need to work harder, or join a Zen monastery to do it right.
Or you need to learn just what the word nihilism means. There's political nihilism, which I don't believe, and there's philosophical nihilism, which I do believe, which to me simply means that there is no inherent meaning or purpose in the universe (or the multiverse, for that matter). I believe a few other things that I can't prove, as well, such as You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login, but I can discern no meaning or purpose in existence other than that which I generate from within myself.

Can you?
« Last Edit: January 11, 2018, 01:23:25 PM by Unbeliever »
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"No matter how cynical you become, it's never enough to keep up."
Lily Tomlin

Offline Baruch

Re: A Word To Left-Wing Students
« Reply #33 on: January 11, 2018, 02:23:53 PM »
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You love to define me.  Ah, what the hell, gives you something to do.  And as you know, I don't fit into any one niche very well.  And you too, need to work harder in your belief in G_d, or join a monastery to do it right.

I believe you and Unbeliever both made that claim.  Disclaim if you like.  I would like it if you both did.
שלום

Offline Baruch

Re: A Word To Left-Wing Students
« Reply #34 on: January 11, 2018, 02:27:08 PM »
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Or you need to learn just what the word nihilism means. There's political nihilism, which I don't believe, and there's philosophical nihilism, which I do believe, which to me simply means that there is no inherent meaning or purpose in the universe (or the multiverse, for that matter). I believe a few other things that I can't prove, as well, such as You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login, but I can discern no meaning or purpose in existence other than that which I generate from within myself.

Can you?

Much better.  You didn't give me a link, that may or may not be your opinion.

Yes, meaning as in "the universe has meaning" ... yes, it doesn't.  That is consistent with the usual atheism (there is no universal god).  If there was a universal god, then we could suppose that the meaning is the purpose, and that universal god might have a purpose.

Political nihilism ... meaning ... just realize that some craziness isn't worth participating in?  I can get behind that.  I consider the government to be a violent gang, and I participate because of that fact, not because I buy into any ideology it has.  I think that is nihilistic enough, yes?

See my post under Philosophy etc ... Sociology 101.
שלום

Re: A Word To Left-Wing Students
« Reply #35 on: January 11, 2018, 02:34:12 PM »
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I believe you and Unbeliever both made that claim.  Disclaim if you like.  I would like it if you both did.
Unbeliever stated it quite nicely, thank you. :)
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent,
Is he able but not willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able or willing?
Then why call him god?

Offline Baruch

Re: A Word To Left-Wing Students
« Reply #36 on: January 11, 2018, 07:43:35 PM »
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Unbeliever stated it quite nicely, thank you. :)

Meaning does come from within yourselves ... and then you proclaim that meaning to be invalid.  Self hate?
שלום

Re: A Word To Left-Wing Students
« Reply #37 on: January 11, 2018, 07:45:49 PM »
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and then you proclaim that meaning to be invalid.
Uh...when did that happen?
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"No matter how cynical you become, it's never enough to keep up."
Lily Tomlin

Offline Baruch

Re: A Word To Left-Wing Students
« Reply #38 on: January 11, 2018, 07:58:21 PM »
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Uh...when did that happen?

Only what is external to you is real, right?  And since there is no universal external meaning (I agree), then any meaning found internally is invalid.
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Re: A Word To Left-Wing Students
« Reply #39 on: January 11, 2018, 08:01:54 PM »
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Only what is external to you is real, right?
When did I ever say or imply that?


 
Quote
And since there is no universal external meaning (I agree), then any meaning found internally is invalid.
Any meaning found internally is the only valid thing.
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"No matter how cynical you become, it's never enough to keep up."
Lily Tomlin

Re: A Word To Left-Wing Students
« Reply #40 on: January 11, 2018, 08:02:29 PM »
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Only what is external to you is real, right?  And since there is no universal external meaning (I agree), then any meaning found internally is invalid.

You're trying too hard, Baruch.
"Oh, wearisome condition of humanity,
Born under one law, to another bound;
Vainly begot, and yet forbidden vanity,
Created sick, commanded to be sound."
--Fulke Greville

Re: A Word To Left-Wing Students
« Reply #41 on: January 11, 2018, 08:49:29 PM »
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Meaning does come from within yourselves ... and then you proclaim that meaning to be invalid.  Self hate?
There you go again--twisting what has been said.  You do like to irritate, don't you; and you don't hold yourself to any level of accuracy, do you.  That part of your personality has surprised me.  Anyway, I have said time and again, that the universe does not supply any meaning whatsoever.  The only meaning one can ever get from one's life is a subjective, self applied, meaning.  I never said that that was unimportant or invalid.  For me, it is all important.  I have found meaning and imagine I'll always find it.  But it is only my meaning.  I cannot give it to somebody else; not even children or loved ones.  I may not even be able to articulate it very well, but that does not make it invalid for me.  For you, my life's meaning(s) are not invalid; you can't really know what they are, so my meanings of life are meaningless for you.  Something cannot be invalid if you don't know what they are.
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent,
Is he able but not willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able or willing?
Then why call him god?

Offline Baruch

Re: A Word To Left-Wing Students
« Reply #42 on: January 12, 2018, 07:00:14 AM »
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When did I ever say or imply that?


 Any meaning found internally is the only valid thing.

No true nihilist then.  Being anti-politics isn't nihilism, it is anarchism.
שלום

Offline Baruch

Re: A Word To Left-Wing Students
« Reply #43 on: January 12, 2018, 07:06:39 AM »
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There you go again--twisting what has been said.  You do like to irritate, don't you; and you don't hold yourself to any level of accuracy, do you.  That part of your personality has surprised me.  Anyway, I have said time and again, that the universe does not supply any meaning whatsoever.  The only meaning one can ever get from one's life is a subjective, self applied, meaning.  I never said that that was unimportant or invalid.  For me, it is all important.  I have found meaning and imagine I'll always find it.  But it is only my meaning.  I cannot give it to somebody else; not even children or loved ones.  I may not even be able to articulate it very well, but that does not make it invalid for me.  For you, my life's meaning(s) are not invalid; you can't really know what they are, so my meanings of life are meaningless for you.  Something cannot be invalid if you don't know what they are.

I seek my own clarity, not yours.  I would phrase it differently.  You aren't your own species, entirely different from all other humans, entirely different from all other life forms.  Most of what you experience, and what you mean, is what we all share.  Or are you just showing social isolation perhaps?  And no, I ask to clarify, not to irritate.  Sorry if it seems like the Inquisition, but maybe that is my Spanish ancestry.  Nobody Expects Baruch!

We are all sociopaths, particularly Americans.  But there are degrees of sociopathy.  For many of us, it lies in politics.

We probably all experience brief moments of antipathy ... like I did, wanting all Russians dead, this morning.  The feeling passed, and I know it is wrong, all feelings are wrong, am I right?  Vulcans.
שלום

Re: A Word To Left-Wing Students
« Reply #44 on: January 12, 2018, 09:07:37 AM »
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I seek my own clarity, not yours.  I would phrase it differently.  You aren't your own species, entirely different from all other humans, entirely different from all other life forms.  Most of what you experience, and what you mean, is what we all share.  Or are you just showing social isolation perhaps?  And no, I ask to clarify, not to irritate.  Sorry if it seems like the Inquisition, but maybe that is my Spanish ancestry.  Nobody Expects Baruch!

We are all sociopaths, particularly Americans.  But there are degrees of sociopathy.  For many of us, it lies in politics.

We probably all experience brief moments of antipathy ... like I did, wanting all Russians dead, this morning.  The feeling passed, and I know it is wrong, all feelings are wrong, am I right?  Vulcans.
You very well could be seeking clarity.  Laudable.  But you do so in the form of statements and not questions.  So, your seeking of clarity looks and feels like you are putting words in my mouth and thoughts into my head, not asking about, or even testing, what I said or meant.  "And no, I ask to clarify, not to irritate."  That's just it--you don't ask, you pontificate--you make a flat statement about what I have said; you don't ask.
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent,
Is he able but not willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able or willing?
Then why call him god?

 

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