Christopher Hitchens

[trdsf]

It goes so much farther back than LBJ.  After WWII, we were very supportive of our French allies, so when they couldn't hold on the Indochina, we stepped in slowly.  They left, and we stayed.

It's also worth noting that Ho Chi Minh came to the West first in his quest for Vietnamese independence.  Wilson and the West refused to see him at Versailles after World War I, and as late as World War II by which time he was already involved in the Communist International, he was working with the OSS against both Vichy France and Japan in French Indochina, and after the war tried repeatedly to contact Truman regarding Vietnamese independence -- who essentially ignored him.  Viet Nam was very much a war that did not need to happen.

[Unbeliever]

I knew at a young age that war itself wasn't evil (WWII) but stupid ones were.  I grew up with MASH and Star Trek and Vietnam.

I decided there had to be a better way of solving problems and I've lived my life on that idea.  Now, NK is making me doubt that.  Insanity has to be stopped.  I am logically adrift...

I believe that if war becomes necessary we've already lost, whether or not we "win" the war.

[Unbeliever]

NK worries me also.  My biggest worry is that we don't have the leadership to deal with the problem in the best way.  I'm not saying I know the best way, but I have zero confidence in any of our leaders and that makes me feel helpless.

America - and it's weapons makers - need NK; we always need a boogyman to make the people scared enough to keep supporting the war mongers, since their sacred shareholders always need more money..

[Unbeliever]

I was OK with Afghanistan too, but I was floored when we decided to go into Iraq.

Afghanistan didn't need to be attacked to get Bin Laden - they offered to turn him over to us through a third party nation, but the Bush regime wouldn't have that - they needed a war, so they made damned sure they got one - or two, as it turned out.

[Cavebear]

Afghanistan didn't need to be attacked to get Bin Laden - they offered to turn him over to us through a third party nation, but the Bush regime wouldn't have that - they needed a war, so they made damned sure they got one - or two, as it turned out.

Bin Laden shou;d have been "gotten" through Interpol as a criminal, not a terrorist.  The US govt blew it big time for publicity and power-showing!