Author Topic: Bitcoin craze  (Read 3692 times)

Offline Sal1981

Bitcoin craze
« on: December 08, 2017, 09:23:08 AM »
Have you been following the surge in Bitcoin pricing lately? It went up to more than $17k per Bitcoin yesterday, and plummeted to $14k per Bitcoin today.

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The cryptocurrency has become a big contender against fiat money, it seems, more so now that on Sunday Bitcoin futures will be launched.
Quote
Next month, investors should be able to start trading bitcoin futures via the Chicago Mercantile Exchange, which is expected to give the virtual currency more legitimacy among professional investors. Futures allow traders to bet on the future price of assets like currencies, metals and agricultural commodities.

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"The first principle is that you must not fool yourself - and you are the easiest person to fool" --- Richard P. Feynman

Online Shiranu

Re: Bitcoin craze
« Reply #1 on: December 08, 2017, 12:18:59 PM »
I tend to agree with the economists who say this is a a bubble that's about to pop since this all about hype and not actual practicality.
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Offline Baruch

Re: Bitcoin craze
« Reply #2 on: December 08, 2017, 12:49:49 PM »
BitCoin is volatile.  A derivative on BitCoin would be even more volatile.  Russian roulette.

See, the world is becoming Zimbabwe ... everyone who had BitCoin earlier, has got on the tiger, the problem isn't getting on the tiger, it is getting off, without being eaten ;-)  Something for nothing!  Bring out your dead!  Something for nothing! ...

Think Obama trillion dollar platinum coin, but private sector rather than government CF.

Avoid volatile, speculative investments.  Diversify.  Don't churn, but make conservative decisions and hold tight.
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Offline SGOS

Re: Bitcoin craze
« Reply #3 on: December 08, 2017, 02:32:21 PM »
Isn't one fiat currency enough?

I'm so out of touch about this.  Yeah, I've heard about the stuff, but I don't get it.  Did someone just invent bit coins, and now people are buying things with them?  Are they tradable anywhere, or are they like green stamps?  Would you take bit coins if you were selling your car?  Or are you better off with government backed bills?

Offline SGOS

Re: Bitcoin craze
« Reply #4 on: December 08, 2017, 03:40:24 PM »
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I tend to agree with the economists who say this is a a bubble that's about to pop since this all about hype and not actual practicality.
I think you're right.  I'm selling my assets and buying bitcoin right now while it's still valuable.  I don't want to make the same mistake that I did during the mortgage collapse.  I sat on my money waiting for the sub prime bonds to hit their peak, but then the market collapsed before I could buy them and they lost all their value.

Offline Hydra009

Re: Bitcoin craze
« Reply #5 on: December 08, 2017, 03:53:36 PM »
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Isn't one fiat currency enough?

I'm so out of touch about this.  Yeah, I've heard about the stuff, but I don't get it.  Did someone just invent bit coins, and now people are buying things with them?  Are they tradable anywhere, or are they like green stamps?  Would you take bit coins if you were selling your car?  Or are you better off with government backed bills?

Offline Hakurei Reimu

Re: Bitcoin craze
« Reply #6 on: December 08, 2017, 07:20:54 PM »
To say that cryptocurrency is an alternate to fiat currency assumes that there is such a thing as non-fiat currency. I don't think there is such a thing as a non-fiat currency, as all pricing systems involve how much people are willing to pay for goods. Even based currencies are founded on this assumption. The US government saying that a dollar is worth a dollar doesn't stop prices from being assigned by supply and demand.
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Offline SGOS

Re: Bitcoin craze
« Reply #7 on: December 08, 2017, 08:25:48 PM »
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To say that cryptocurrency is an alternate to fiat currency assumes that there is such a thing as non-fiat currency. I don't think there is such a thing as a non-fiat currency, as all pricing systems involve how much people are willing to pay for goods. Even based currencies are founded on this assumption. The US government saying that a dollar is worth a dollar doesn't stop prices from being assigned by supply and demand.
It does seem like cryptocurrency is just another fiat currency with it's value tied to arbitrary whim.  A fiat.  The old gold and silver standard was less of a fiat, except the value of gold and silver was arbitrary.  It all seems fake like monopoly money to me, especially today.  So why not just take something and assign it an arbitrary value and use that?  We could used turtle shells.
« Last Edit: December 08, 2017, 08:33:22 PM by SGOS »

Offline Hydra009

Re: Bitcoin craze
« Reply #8 on: December 08, 2017, 08:41:51 PM »
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We could used turtle shells.
We absolutely could.  You are not allowed to view links. Register or Login.  Ideally, you want something that is 1) portable 2) exists in limited quantity 3) difficult to fake 4) doesn't decay quickly.  Small shells are a decent commodity money.

Offline SGOS

Re: Bitcoin craze
« Reply #9 on: December 08, 2017, 08:51:26 PM »
The biggest problem I see with bit coin is that it won't be accepted at Walmart.  You could put up a fuss to the manager, but he would eventually call the cops.  You'd spend the night in jail, all the while having a pile of bit coins that couldn't even get you a decent lawyer, or pay the damn fine.  Go to the movies and give the ticket vendor guy a bit coin.  Like what's he supposed to do with that?   I just don't think it's very practical.

Offline Hydra009

Re: Bitcoin craze
« Reply #10 on: December 08, 2017, 09:09:11 PM »
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The biggest problem I see with bit coin is that it won't be accepted at Walmart.  You could put up a fuss to the manager, but he would eventually call the cops.  You'd spend the night in jail, all the while having a pile of bit coins that couldn't even get you a decent lawyer, or pay the damn fine.  Go to the movies and give the ticket vendor guy a bit coin.  Like what's he supposed to do with that?   I just don't think it's very practical.
True.  But a bunch of sites accept Bitcoin.  Sure, you can't use it at Walmart, but you can use it at Newegg and Subway.

Offline SGOS

Re: Bitcoin craze
« Reply #11 on: December 08, 2017, 09:25:53 PM »
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True.  But a bunch of sites accept Bitcoin.  Sure, you can't use it at Walmart, but you can use it at Newegg and Subway.
Maybe it will catch on eventually.  I did wonder if any popular businesses actually accepted bit coin. Subway surprises me. Newegg not so much because it does most everything over the computer already.

Offline SGOS

Re: Bitcoin craze
« Reply #12 on: December 08, 2017, 09:28:08 PM »
So when you conduct business using bitcoin, do you use a credit card or something like that?

Offline Hydra009

Re: Bitcoin craze
« Reply #13 on: December 08, 2017, 09:44:52 PM »
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So when you conduct business using bitcoin, do you use a credit card or something like that?
I have wondered this as well.  Apparently, it can be somewhat more difficult than plastic but not overly so.

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"Once our subs were made the employee took out an iPad and opened Coinbase. She punched our total in the register and then in the iPad, which immediately generated a custom QR code linked to the store’s Coinbase account which was preloaded with our exact total calculated. I took out my iPhone, opened my Coinbase app, and scanned the QR code. Instantly the total popped up on my screen and gave me the option to leave a note about my purchase. "Subway" seemed appropriate.

I hit send and within seconds she received confirmation on the iPad that her account had received the bitcoin. It took no longer than a credit card transaction, and it didn’t require my signature."

Offline Baruch

Re: Bitcoin craze
« Reply #14 on: December 09, 2017, 12:21:36 AM »
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Isn't one fiat currency enough?

I'm so out of touch about this.  Yeah, I've heard about the stuff, but I don't get it.  Did someone just invent bit coins, and now people are buying things with them?  Are they tradable anywhere, or are they like green stamps?  Would you take bit coins if you were selling your car?  Or are you better off with government backed bills?

BitCoin etc is private money.  You could use a BitCoin debit card to spend it.  Think of PayPal ... only the value doesn't come from dumping cash or credit from conventional sources, like you do with PayPal.  Not government money.  Technically FRN are private money, since the Fed is a private organization, given a monopoly by the Treasury.  But it is licensed money.  You can use private money anytime, including the S&H Green Stamps of our childhood.  And yes, some venues will take it directly in trade for actual stuff or services.  Think of this as banking, without a banking license.  In either case, the banker cleans up, and you lose ... the question do you want to be screwed by licensed public banking or unlicensed private banking.  Either way, you are screwed.
« Last Edit: December 09, 2017, 12:34:09 AM by Baruch »
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