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Believe in Tesla and Volt?

Started by Baruch, November 20, 2017, 06:44:01 PM

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Cavebear

Quote from: Jason Harvestdancer on February 05, 2018, 07:53:28 PM
Okay, I exaggerated about the limited range of the electric car, but it does have a range/recharge issue.  If I were to visit my in-laws, I have to drive 400 miles.  I can refuel my gas car in less than 10 minutes as well.

Electric cars have range limitations.  So do gas ones.  The difference is that electric car charging stations are not yet widespread.  Someday they will be.  And I suggest it will work this way:

1.  The Federal Govt will support electrical recharging stations to support a growing fleet of State and Federal Govt vehicles like Mail cars, govt fleet cars, and diplomatic cars.

2.  The Govt will open the stations to private vehicles for a slight fee to encourage their use.

3.  The existence of some electrical recharging stations in cities will encourage highway rest stops to add fast-recharging stations among their gas and diesel ones. 

4.  The growing use of charging stations will cause tech companies to improve the technology.

If you think that seems unlikely, think of how the gasoline stations started...
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Baruch

Rechargables already work in dense urban settings, where driving ranges are short.  Why not try there first?  People who have to commute daily over 70  - 90 miles ... as I did once upon a time, are not candidates for this utopia.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Cavebear

Quote from: Baruch on February 06, 2018, 11:19:39 PM
Rechargables already work in dense urban settings, where driving ranges are short.  Why not try there first?  People who have to commute daily over 70  - 90 miles ... as I did once upon a time, are not candidates for this utopia.

Yes, that would be "cities", as I mentioned.  Um, electrical car ranges are above 90 miles these days (https://www.cheatsheet.com/automobiles/electric-vehicles-with-the-longest-driving-range.html/?a=viewall)

But most commutes are far shorter than that around cities.  The prob is that there aren't enough fast charge stations.  There will be in a few years.
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Jason78

Quote from: Baruch on February 06, 2018, 11:19:39 PM
Rechargables already work in dense urban settings, where driving ranges are short.  Why not try there first? 

They are trying there first.

Quote from: Baruch on February 06, 2018, 11:19:39 PM
People who have to commute daily over 70  - 90 miles ... as I did once upon a time, are not candidates for this utopia.

That is well within the range of an electric car.   Even if your shift was only 4 hours long, your car would be recharged by the time you left.
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We can easily forgive a child who is afraid of the dark; the real
tragedy of life is when men are afraid of the light. -Plato

Cavebear

Quote from: Jason78 on February 07, 2018, 06:32:12 AM
They are trying there first.

That is well within the range of an electric car.   Even if your shift was only 4 hours long, your car would be recharged by the time you left.

Agreed.  But that's assuming you had recharging privileges at work.
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Baruch

Mao bicycles don't require charging and are good for your health ;-)
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Cavebear

Quote from: Baruch on February 07, 2018, 07:43:39 AM
Mao bicycles don't require charging and are good for your health ;-)

Hurray.  Pedal 20 miles to work every day.  You will be the strongest-legged dead guy at 50.
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!

Jason Harvestdancer

If recharging stations were more common, it wouldn't help with the recharge issue - how long it takes to recharge.  I can refuel my suv in less than 10 minutes.
White privilege is being a lifelong racist, then being sent to the White House twice because your running mate is a minority.<br /><br />No Biden, no KKK, no Fascist USA!

Hakurei Reimu

The recharge issue is a technological problem. Theoretically, supercapacitors can fill up on a full charge in seconds. There are problems with them, though.

Also, a standardized battery could be made to be field-swappable. Then refueling an electric car is as fast as it takes to swap that battery.
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(she bites!)
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SGOS

#159
Quote from: Cavebear on February 06, 2018, 08:04:27 PM
If you think that seems unlikely, think of how the gasoline stations started...
Indeed.  The horse and buggy crowd were pointing out that cars run out of fuel, and you had to have fueling stations.  The problem was quite easily solved by building fueling stations (duh!) bought and paid for by enterprising entrepreneurs, who could turn a profit, and in a short time billions of dollars were added to the economic infrastructure.

And look at the crappy cars people owned to create the boom.  You can point out the flaws as you see them in current electric cars, but that doesn't mean they will never been fixed, just as the flaws of the Model T eventually led to the well designed more efficient Japanese style cars of today.

I know there is probably government funding being funneled into alternatives to fossil fuel, but I don't see this as a nefarious conspiracy.  A large part of the population wants an alternative.  Some don't of course, so there is going to be conflict either way. 

It seems sensible to encourage experimentation.  Sometimes the experiments will fail, but it's probably better to test and learn than wait for the free enterprise system to, out of nowhere, come up with a perfect vehicle that will send investors scrambling to buy into the new wave.  But that's letting economics manage our lives.  I'd prefer that we manage our economics, and our direction.

Baruch

Gas stations happened over a long time, and due to free enterprise.  All I see here is how a Solyndra solution should be pushed on us by the D-party or R-party government hacks.  If it is economical, it will happen, no matter what Popular Mechanics says.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Unbeliever

Why can't they just put car chargers in all the parking lots, or any place they can put a parking meter?
God Not Found
"There is a sucker born-again every minute." - C. Spellman

SGOS

Quote from: Baruch on February 08, 2018, 12:59:47 PM
Gas stations happened over a long time, and due to free enterprise.  All I see here is how a Solyndra solution should be pushed on us by the D-party or R-party government hacks.  If it is economical, it will happen, no matter what Popular Mechanics says.
That's my point.  If people need charging stations, businessmen will provide them for a profit.  It should be right up your alley.  It's the free enterprise part of the equation.  The charging stations will be there if there is a need.  The bigger the need the more services will arise and will do so either quickly or slowly in direct proportion to demand.  Now if you want to talk about the insufficiency of electric cars, that matters of course, but I wasn't talking about that.  You seem to be saying that electric cars can't be feasible, and your argument is based on the state of current technology remaining constant.  This is not supported by past experience, however.  Technology grows, and it's speeding up.  Where's your old scientific spirit, Man?

Baruch

Science?  You mean Popular Science?  I want my George Jetson flying car now!
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Johan

Quote from: Unbeliever on February 08, 2018, 01:16:15 PM
Why can't they just put car chargers in all the parking lots, or any place they can put a parking meter?
They can. And the probably will. Target needs to have a parking lot and until now, there was little to no opportunity for them to realize any revenue on that real estate. They need a parking lot so they had to buy the land, build the lot on it and maintain it even though they make no money from it directly. Putting in banks of charging stations would change that. The moment there are enough electric vehicles on the road to make installation of charging stations worth while, they will pop up in parking lots everywhere.
Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false and by the rulers as useful