Author Topic: Believe in Tesla and Volt?  (Read 7503 times)

Offline Sal1981

Re: Believe in Tesla and Volt?
« Reply #60 on: December 01, 2017, 05:59:45 AM »
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So basically, what you are saying, is you are fucking with us; saying things in a certain way to cause us to think we're discussing something else/confusing us entirely, just so you can invoke a certain narrative that isn't even there from us that loosely suits your needs and biases and then you move the goalpost?

Yeah. Nah. Not a fan of that bullshit.
Seems like theistic bs strikes again.

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Offline Baruch

Re: Believe in Tesla and Volt?
« Reply #61 on: December 01, 2017, 06:00:51 AM »
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So basically, what you are saying, is you are fucking with us; saying things in a certain way to cause us to think we're discussing something else/confusing us entirely, just so you can invoke a certain narrative that isn't even there from us that loosely suits your needs and biases and then you move the goalpost?

Yeah. Nah. Not a fan of that bullshit.

No ... that isn't what I said in my last post.  Read more carefully.  It took me awhile to develop my thesis, and I apologized for my ambiguity.  Did you follow my restatement?
« Last Edit: December 01, 2017, 06:07:34 AM by Baruch »
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Offline Baruch

Re: Believe in Tesla and Volt?
« Reply #62 on: December 01, 2017, 06:07:03 AM »
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No they are not. They are cars. Period. They are powered by different sources of energy than you might be used to. Big fucking deal. They are not pipe dreams. They are not vaporware. They are real and being bought and driven by real people as has been the case for several years now.

Will they be going away? Sure. Absolutely. So will gasoline powered cars, diesel powered trucks, lithium ion powered cellphones and nuclear powered warships. All them will go away eventually. But I'm sure you already knew that. So I still don't know what point you're trying to make and I'm beginning to suspect that you don't know either. Which means that this entire thread has been about as productive watching a couple of monkeys trying to fuck a football.

I didn't say they were vaporware (even self-driving cars are physically real, I just wouldn't ride in one, because I am not stupid).  Yes, Lamborghinis are real, but most people can't buy one.  Guess we need more Venezuela instead of more cow bell?  And yes, eventually cars will go away, but not be replaced with Rombas that self-drive, and run on solar cells.  Right now, Europe is saying ... outlaw the sale of petroleum fuel in 2040.  I think they should do it today ... and join Venezuela right away.  Techno=utopia isn't coming ... living now, as if it is coming, is theistic in a bad way, in the sense of "magical thinking".  Popular Mechanics and Popular Science have been "selling" this Jetson BS since I got a butch at the local barber shop with my dad.

Yes, you can move to a more sustainable system, that was true in 1980.  Do what you can, but use your own money, not the taxpayer's money ... don't subsidize well connected frauds.  Knock down your house and replace it with a geodesic dome tent, put on your tie-died shirt and smoke some pot.  Get an electrified bicycle, that you can recharge with a solar panel.  Just don't expect your current standard of living (but it is a step up from a trash dumpster).

This is American technical know-how ...

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Too bad you are heavier than a cat ...

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Reality isn't your friend.  It sucks.  You need actual non-fraud inventors, who aren't trying to defy existing physics.
« Last Edit: December 01, 2017, 06:23:07 AM by Baruch »
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Offline Johan

Re: Believe in Tesla and Volt?
« Reply #63 on: December 01, 2017, 07:00:13 AM »
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I didn't say they were vaporware (even self-driving cars are physically real, I just wouldn't ride in one, because I am not stupid).  Yes, Lamborghinis are real, but most people can't buy one. 
You keep going back to this 'yeah but I can't afford one' point. When in history has it not been the case that the newest technology was too expensive for those on food stamps to afford? But then you yammer on about how 'that's not sustainable...' The newest technology has ALWAYS been expensive. It has ALWAYS gotten cheaper. But now suddenly that's not sustainable. Mmm'k thanks bye.
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Online PickelledEggs

Re: Believe in Tesla and Volt?
« Reply #64 on: December 01, 2017, 09:38:32 AM »
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No ... that isn't what I said in my last post.  Read more carefully.  It took me awhile to develop my thesis, and I apologized for my ambiguity.  Did you follow my restatement?
I reworded it to show you what you were doing.. clearly and explicitly.

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Edited to take out the extra "show" for grammatical excellence
« Last Edit: December 01, 2017, 04:42:43 PM by PickelledEggs »
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Online PickelledEggs

Re: Believe in Tesla and Volt?
« Reply #65 on: December 01, 2017, 11:03:19 AM »
Fucking conspiracy theorists...
"Tell Pilate to release the files!!!" - Bill Hicks
"I have an open mind, but not so open that my brains will fall out" -James Randi
"One who truly hates himself cannot love, he cannot place his trust in another." - NGE

Offline Baruch

Re: Believe in Tesla and Volt?
« Reply #66 on: December 01, 2017, 06:59:25 PM »
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You keep going back to this 'yeah but I can't afford one' point. When in history has it not been the case that the newest technology was too expensive for those on food stamps to afford? But then you yammer on about how 'that's not sustainable...' The newest technology has ALWAYS been expensive. It has ALWAYS gotten cheaper. But now suddenly that's not sustainable. Mmm'k thanks bye.

Through mass production, all products drop to zero unit cost ... bwhaha.  That happens sometime.  And diamond rings, aren't new technology, and we can even make artificial diamonds, and they are still expensive.  Moore's Law of silicon chips ... apply to silicon chips.

No technology, beyond 1800, is sustainable .. if by that you mean environmentally friendly.  That is how I mean it.  And I am not sure that all the horse shit our horses put out back then, was environmentally friendly.  I assume you don't mean "sustainable" in the idea that it will always cost X per unit, and that everyone not on food stamps will be able to afford one.  Even 100 years ago, not everyone could afford a horse.
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Offline Baruch

Re: Believe in Tesla and Volt?
« Reply #67 on: December 01, 2017, 07:02:29 PM »
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Fucking conspiracy theorists...

A free lunch ... we can have it ... if only we kill the wealthy?  Isn't that a Left conspiracy theory?  They aren't just for Right kooks.  Kind of like the old conspiracy theory, that Ford had a carburetor, that was invented by an independent inventor, and the oil industry paid Ford to buy it and bury it, because it would allow a regular car to get 100 miles per gallon.  Also the idea that no medical appointment would cost more than $5 except for all the Republicans sabotaging our medical care.
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Offline Hakurei Reimu

Re: Believe in Tesla and Volt?
« Reply #68 on: December 01, 2017, 07:27:15 PM »
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Reality isn't your friend.  It sucks.  You need actual non-fraud inventors, who aren't trying to defy existing physics.
You have not done nearly enough to show that reality will not allow us to have a sustainable, comfortable living for everyone, especially if we're allowed to escape our planetary womb and colonize space. You have not demonstrated that existing physics does not allow for electric cars, nor the energy to run them or make them. It's all weasel words and FUD.
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Offline Johan

Re: Believe in Tesla and Volt?
« Reply #69 on: December 01, 2017, 08:24:43 PM »
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Through mass production, all products drop to zero unit cost ... bwhaha.  That happens sometime.  And diamond rings, aren't new technology, and we can even make artificial diamonds, and they are still expensive.  Moore's Law of silicon chips ... apply to silicon chips.
What the fuck are trying to say? Each sentence in this quote seems to say the opposite of what the previous sentence is trying to say.

Quote
No technology, beyond 1800, is sustainable .. if by that you mean environmentally friendly.  That is how I mean it. 
Indoor plumbing sure seems like an unsustainable technology doesn't it. Anyone with a toilet inside their house will probably die off by the time they reach the age of 14. So we best not even mention things like crop rotation, penicillin, condoms zippers radio or nylon. Zippers alone will drive our species to extinction in the next 6 months.

In case you missed it, that was all sarcasm intended to point out that you're talking out of your ass.
Religion is regarded by the common people as true, by the wise as false and by the rulers as useful

Online PickelledEggs

Re: Believe in Tesla and Volt?
« Reply #70 on: December 01, 2017, 11:02:29 PM »
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A free lunch ... we can have it ... if only we kill the wealthy?  Isn't that a Left conspiracy theory?  They aren't just for Right kooks.  Kind of like the old conspiracy theory, that Ford had a carburetor, that was invented by an independent inventor, and the oil industry paid Ford to buy it and bury it, because it would allow a regular car to get 100 miles per gallon.  Also the idea that no medical appointment would cost more than $5 except for all the Republicans sabotaging our medical care.
WHAT DOES A FUCKING FREE LUNCH HAVE TO DO WITH ANYTHING.

We're looking for better, more reliable travel and energy for those vehicles. This is new technology. So far it has proven to be very reliable (with of course some isolated incidents) and extremely efficient.
And not only is it efficient in using energy, it has also proven in utilizing energy. The tesla car has shown instant responsiveness in acceleration tests, where with fuel-based cars, they lag and the power isn't there for a while, until certain RPMs.

So blow it out your ass with this free lunch bullshit. This is about newer, more refined, more efficient, more effective, more reliable transport that can run off of a better, more reliable energy source. Electricity. because electricity can be obtained via water, air, sun, and of course fuel. It's flexible. Adaptive. And as the Tesla and other similar cars have shown, it fucking works.

"Tell Pilate to release the files!!!" - Bill Hicks
"I have an open mind, but not so open that my brains will fall out" -James Randi
"One who truly hates himself cannot love, he cannot place his trust in another." - NGE

Online Hydra009

Re: Believe in Tesla and Volt?
« Reply #71 on: December 01, 2017, 11:23:40 PM »
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WHAT DOES A FUCKING FREE LUNCH HAVE TO DO WITH ANYTHING.
He imagines that liberals have naive fantasies about energy and health care.  (Which is pitiable because his idea of liberals bears no resemblance to the actual liberals he interacts with)

Or pretends to believe that to garner attention.  Either way, it's bullshit.

One thing's for sure, he's marshaling more brainpower in deciphering and rebutting these dubiously genuine claims than was ever put in creating them.
« Last Edit: December 01, 2017, 11:29:15 PM by Hydra009 »

Offline Baruch

Re: Believe in Tesla and Volt?
« Reply #72 on: December 02, 2017, 01:03:30 AM »
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You have not done nearly enough to show that reality will not allow us to have a sustainable, comfortable living for everyone, especially if we're allowed to escape our planetary womb and colonize space. You have not demonstrated that existing physics does not allow for electric cars, nor the energy to run them or make them. It's all weasel words and FUD.

Not comfortable.  Unless you are in the castle with the rest of the nobility.  Communist theory is wrong ... even if you aren't a communist.  We aren't heading for an industrial or technical utopia, with or without political reform.  What has happened is ... we came upon a vast treasure, a vast pool of petroleum, that we don't have to pay full price for.  And like one would expect, we have fully exploited that, and lived like a drunk sailor burning both ends of the candle at once.

Yes, there may be a few electric cars ... in the feudal museum.  Renewable means no modern society ... you can't run a modern society without that drug, the black gold.  And yes, it takes a lot of energy to go into space.  A few people have been, but only as government employees or a few millionaires.  You or I are not going.  No steerage in rocket ships.
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Online PickelledEggs

Re: Believe in Tesla and Volt?
« Reply #73 on: December 02, 2017, 02:44:52 AM »
"Tell Pilate to release the files!!!" - Bill Hicks
"I have an open mind, but not so open that my brains will fall out" -James Randi
"One who truly hates himself cannot love, he cannot place his trust in another." - NGE

Offline Cavebear

Re: Believe in Tesla and Volt?
« Reply #74 on: December 02, 2017, 03:08:15 AM »
I do not trust AI cars.  Yet...

Every new tech has bugs, failures, and hackables.  I do not want to be the rider in an AI car that gets confused by a reflection of sunlight or a deer running across the road.  I do not want to be in an AI car that veers off the road because some hacker gets control of it. 

But I also recognize that we already have many systems in our cars that are out of our control and we are happy with them.  We don't have to adjust our gears by speed anymore (unless you really like a stick shift).  We don't have to play with the carburator via a throttle.  Our brakes self-control and to all wheels mostly. 

Most of the operations of a car are already automated.  Get it?

And it seems likely that AI cars, if everyone had them, would result in fewer accidents and deaths overall by a factor of at least 10.

And I still don't want one! 

I'm not sure why not.  Getting in a car and saying "drive me to the Safeway" sounds good.  And I used to laugh at people driving "stick" as not trusting "auto".

Maybe I'm just not sure the car will open the garage door before driving into it.  Or know what to do at the landfill while there are bulldozers driving close. 

I'm not so much worried about an AI car navigating the NJ Turnpike so much as it failing on a tight country road when a tractor pulls out suddenly.
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