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Apu is offensive!

Started by Munch, November 16, 2017, 06:57:30 AM

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Shiranu

Quote from: Munch on July 27, 2018, 07:19:44 PM
the only damage risk comes from thin skinned social justice cry babies like you looking to get offended by anything to help your PC points grow, and the risk being them actually changing the character to suit that shallow need.
We've seen what happens when thats been done in comics, big surprise, the social justice cry babies who wanted more pc reforms in comics, ended up not even buying the comics, and it ruined it for everyone else as well, forcing marvel to take two steps back to win genuine fans back.

The biggest mistake modern media can make is trying to appeal ti the easily offended generation, since all you do it get offended, and then don't even support the ones who make the changes for you.

And even if they did change Apu, you'd just find the next thing to get offended by and drag that down too.

Yeah, clearly you aren't offended... that's why it took you six words to start throwing insults around and then just kept going from there...

"A little science distances you from God, but a lot of science brings you nearer to Him." - Louis Pasteur

Mr.Obvious

I think there's a very important distinction some people need to learn to make.
The distinction in that being offended by something, does not mean said cause of offence is offensive in itself.

Lots of people are offended by things that aren't actually offensive.

Apu, imho, seems to have become one of those things.
"If we have to go down, we go down together!"
- Your mum, last night, requesting 69.

Atheist Mantis does not pray.

PickelledEggs

"stereotypical as possible" LOLZ

What voice would you suggest an indian immigrant character to have, @Shiranu ?

Or would you rather the character not exist at all?


*do I press "no accent for an immigrant character" or "shouldn't represent immigrants at all"*

Shiranu

#108
QuoteApu, imho, seems to have become one of those things.

And I think that hints at a fundamental issue between our two "sides"...

Actual people from India, actual Indian-Americans, have pretty consistently considered characters like Apu to be offensive. Hank Azaria himself has said that he feels it might be time for him to leave his role as the character because he is deeply hurt by how people have used the character as a tool to attack Indian Americans.* And Mr. Azaria has broken rank with "The Simpsons" who have doubled down on the issue, so it's not like he is being told to say that to save the brand.

When both the butt of the joke and the actor who portrayed him both say that there is an element of offensiveness and hurtfulness behind the character, than in it self-evident that at some level Apu is an inherently offensive character. That is simply inarguable. When both the offended and the person doing the offending say it's offensive, than it is offensive.

But my fundamental... lack of understanding?... is how people who are not the butt of the joke can tell people what they are or aren't suppose to be offended by. That seems to be what this conversation has ultimately boiled down to... that your opinion on what is offensive is more important than the opinion of the people being offended.


Edit - Derp, forgot to post link.


*https://www.theglobeandmail.com/opinion/article-who-needs-the-kwik-e-mart-not-apu/
"A little science distances you from God, but a lot of science brings you nearer to Him." - Louis Pasteur

Shiranu

Quote from: PickelledEggs on July 27, 2018, 07:33:50 PM
"stereotypical as possible" LOLZ

What voice would you suggest an indian immigrant character to have, @Shiranu ?

Or would you rather the character not exist at all?


*do I press "no accent for an immigrant character" or "shouldn't represent immigrants at all"*

Neither of those two choices are the ones I have advocated for this entire thread, nor do either actually relate to anything I have said, so I am not going to answer that question.
"A little science distances you from God, but a lot of science brings you nearer to Him." - Louis Pasteur

Baruch

Shiranu - You really, really need to watch my post of the preview of the Warren Beatty movie, Reds.  You are Warren Beatty (well the character he is playing, anyway).  Out there defending the Proletariat.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Shiranu

Quote from: Baruch on July 27, 2018, 08:00:10 PM
Shiranu - You really, really need to watch my post of the preview of the Warren Beatty movie, Reds.  You are Warren Beatty (well the character he is playing, anyway).  Out there defending the Proletariat.

Was that in this thread? I don't remember seeing it, but I'll check it out.
"A little science distances you from God, but a lot of science brings you nearer to Him." - Louis Pasteur

Baruch

Quote from: Shiranu on July 27, 2018, 08:01:37 PM
Was that in this thread? I don't remember seeing it, but I'll check it out.

Under American Myths, in the Political section.  It is a good movie, but at least see the preview if you have never seen it.  And don't take offense at the comparison.  Ordinary people don't like their fun-house reflection, and if you are a monster then you won't like the ordinary mirror reflection.  Or not.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Shiranu

#113
I know how annoying as fuck it gets when people like pr post videos here, and if yall don't watch it I am completely understand, but @Mr.Obvious  and @PickelledEggs I would really be interested in hearing your opinion on what Mr. Azaria has to say over the first 5 minutes or so about the character of Apu and how "The Simpsons" responded to it by doubling down.

I am completely unable to comprehend what is so wrong with what he says, but perhaps hearing a rebuttal to the way he put the argument can help me understand the rebuttals you have made here or at least better understand where yall are coming from. And maybe likewise hearing it from someone yall don't stereotype as being further to the left will help explain where I am arguing from.




https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BrlpU99lGzI
"A little science distances you from God, but a lot of science brings you nearer to Him." - Louis Pasteur

PickelledEggs

I'll check it out this weekend. I'm on he 59.5 of a 60 hr week. Probably more than that at this point actually.

I just think it's interesting. The people that say apu is offensive... I wonder if they'd go out of their way to say Samesh, the owner of the convenience store down the street is offensive. I say no, but I guess I also live in a culturally diverse area, which I am pretty happy about. Unrelated, but I I wouldn't be able to do or say half the shit I do in Arizona or Alabama. I. E. Signing bibles and handing them back to the street preacher

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk


PickelledEggs

So I'd also like to add, @shiranu that if I misrepresented your point, I apologize because I'm not 100% from this long-ass week

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk


Baruch

We made fun of Irish-Americans, German-Americans, Italian-Americans, Polish-Americans ... are Indo-Americans so special?
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Draconic Aiur

Quote from: Baruch on July 28, 2018, 12:11:35 AM
We made fun of Irish-Americans, German-Americans, Italian-Americans, Polish-Americans ... are Indo-Americans so special?

Yes apparently because no on cares if its white people.

Baruch

Quote from: Draconic Aiur on July 28, 2018, 01:06:41 AM
Yes apparently because no on cares if its white people.

Used to be that Irish-Americans, German-Americans, Italian-Americans, Polish-Americans etc weren't considered White ;-)
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

pr126

#119

I find this [insert your label here] -  American strange. Why is it not just American?
Why is it important to name the country of origin for citizens?
For example, African American usually refers to black people
What about those who never been to Africa for generations or not from Africa at all?

Irish-Americans, German-Americans, Italian-Americans, Polish-Americans who never been to their original countries but born in America?

Isn't that labeling a kind of discrimination?
A melting pot that refuses to become fully American?

Also, this constant mentioning of the melanin content of the individual, isn't that race-baiting?

I lived in the UK since 1970. Never once I was called Hungarian British.
It would sound weird. You can be called either Hungarian or British. Never both.

Come to think of it, here in the UK we also have some labeling system.
The child molesting groups which are so prevalent here have a distinct label, they are called “Asians”.
Of course everybody understands that the eupheism really means Pakistani Muslims.
But this way it sound inoffensive. It could be anybody east of Europe.



Let's see who gets triggered by this post.