Impeach Trump????

[Cavebear]

I'm not a lawyer so I could be wrong but my understanding is that if the senate exonerates him of whatever charges the House has tabled against him, he is free of those charges. Of course any other charges not part of the impeachment proceedings can still be levied against him. It would be weird if the senate says he's not guilty of charges A,B,C and then a jurisdictional court finds him guilty on the same charges!?!

Well-reasoned.  And I had to sit here and think about it for a while.  House impeachment and Senate conviction (which has never occurred) ties even constitutional lawyers in knots.  As best I can understand it, there are 2 events going on.  One, the House could impeach (or not) and the Senate convict (or not).

Second, at the same time, some courts (State or Federal) could bring charges against Trump regardless of House and Senate actions or inactions within the statutes of limitations for some crimes.  And I've seen some arguments that both could occur at the same time.  It is altogether maddening.

Almost any combination is possible.  NY State might, for example, try Trump for violations of State tax laws while the Congress decides about impeachment proceeding.  Sometimes I just listen to the legal experts on political talk shows discuss the possibilities with amazement.  Sometimes, they say things that seem nonsensical and sometimes they make arguments that impress me. 

I await more information about the possibilities. 

But mostly, I think Trump is an utterly corrupt person who SHOULD be impeached and convicted without expecting that will happen.  But that is just a personal opinion.  One thing I AM sure of is that "we are living in interesting times"!

[Baruch]

There are as many possibilities from criminal or civil charges, as there are jurisdictions in the US.  But that shouldn't make anyone happy.

[josephpalazzo]

Well-reasoned.  And I had to sit here and think about it for a while.  House impeachment and Senate conviction (which has never occurred) ties even constitutional lawyers in knots.  As best I can understand it, there are 2 events going on.  One, the House could impeach (or not) and the Senate convict (or not).

Second, at the same time, some courts (State or Federal) could bring charges against Trump regardless of House and Senate actions or inactions within the statutes of limitations for some crimes.  And I've seen some arguments that both could occur at the same time.  It is altogether maddening.

Almost any combination is possible.  NY State might, for example, try Trump for violations of State tax laws while the Congress decides about impeachment proceeding.  Sometimes I just listen to the legal experts on political talk shows discuss the possibilities with amazement.  Sometimes, they say things that seem nonsensical and sometimes they make arguments that impress me. 

I await more information about the possibilities. 

But mostly, I think Trump is an utterly corrupt person who SHOULD be impeached and convicted without expecting that will happen.  But that is just a personal opinion.  One thing I AM sure of is that "we are living in interesting times"!

I would add to that "interesting and dangerous times". Back in the 90's there was a lot of talk that the 21st century would be China's century. I did not think it would happen in my lifetimes. But it's happening right now. Within a decade China will be the master of this planet. And Trump has been instrumental in making America worse. He ran his organization like a mafia boss, and he's doing the same in the WH. The GOP has become a cult, with Trump as a monarch. And the Dems are falling all over themselves. Nothing good can come out of this. And I'm too old to learn mandarin...

[Cavebear]

I would add to that "interesting and dangerous times". Back in the 90's there was a lot of talk that the 21st century would be China's century. I did not think it would happen in my lifetimes. But it's happening right now. Within a decade China will be the master of this planet. And Trump has been instrumental in making America worse. He ran his organization like a mafia boss, and he's doing the same in the WH. The GOP has become a cult, with Trump as a monarch. And the Dems are falling all over themselves. Nothing good can come out of this. And I'm too old to learn mandarin...

It may not be as bad as you fear.  In past decades, world opinion has been that Germany, Japan, and even SE Asia would become the "New Economic Power".  Each has slipped down for basic economic reasons.  And there are understandable reasons. 

First, there is an underlying tech/education/capital structure in the US.  That is hard to overcome easily.  Second, the US has an abundance of natural resources.  And third (and this may be personal and parochial), but the US has a "do or die, try of fail" attitude within a basic system of laws that encourages start-up businesses while also watching over them to reduce monopolies. 

Such things come and go of course, but I think we have reached the limits of tolerance to many of the biggest companies and I suspect there will be some legally-enforced break-ups coming.  Google and Facebook are starting to feel pressure (with help from Europe) and some changes are probably coming.

Looking at our history, I think we tend to let businesses with great ideas expand to the point where they have to be restrained.  Europe does that a bit faster than the US does and I'm not sure which is the better way.  But the US does usually rein in the businesses that can't control themselves, eventually.

And surely, as history teaches us, The US will one day not be the economic and military superpower it is today.  Nothing lasts forever.  Ask the Romans and the Brits...

But I don't think that time is this coming decade.  When things change, it will seem obvious in hindsight but we don't have that historical view right now. 

I sometimes think the cruelest thing in human life is to know there is a future and not knowing what it is.  We are the only animal here that truly understands the concept of "future",  It's like reading a good book and discovering the last pages are not only missing but not yet existing.  And you don't even know how many chapters there might be.

Que Sera, Sera...

[josephpalazzo]

It may not be as bad as you fear.  In past decades, world opinion has been that Germany, Japan, and even SE Asia would become the "New Economic Power".  Each has slipped down for basic economic reasons.  And there are understandable reasons. 

First, there is an underlying tech/education/capital structure in the US.  That is hard to overcome easily.  Second, the US has an abundance of natural resources.  And third (and this may be personal and parochial), but the US has a "do or die, try of fail" attitude within a basic system of laws that encourages start-up businesses while also watching over them to reduce monopolies. 

Such things come and go of course, but I think we have reached the limits of tolerance to many of the biggest companies and I suspect there will be some legally-enforced break-ups coming.  Google and Facebook are starting to feel pressure (with help from Europe) and some changes are probably coming.

Looking at our history, I think we tend to let businesses with great ideas expand to the point where they have to be restrained.  Europe does that a bit faster than the US does and I'm not sure which is the better way.  But the US does usually rein in the businesses that can't control themselves, eventually.

And surely, as history teaches us, The US will one day not be the economic and military superpower it is today.  Nothing lasts forever.  Ask the Romans and the Brits...

But I don't think that time is this coming decade.  When things change, it will seem obvious in hindsight but we don't have that historical view right now. 

I sometimes think the cruelest thing in human life is to know there is a future and not knowing what it is.  We are the only animal here that truly understands the concept of "future",  It's like reading a good book and discovering the last pages are not only missing but not yet existing.  And you don't even know how many chapters there might be.

Que Sera, Sera...

I wish I could share your optimism, and I'm glad there are still people like you who have those hopes. But to me, it all boils down to leadership. And I'm not reassured with what I see. It's true that in trying times, there has always been someone to rise above the fray and trace a clear path for the rest of humanity to follow. Not sure this time around Mr. Mysterious Hero will save the day. The forces that have been building up since the 1980's are awesome, and the tidal wave coming our way is incontrovertible.

[Baruch]

Relative power, not absolute power.  US relative power was less by 1965 than in 1945.  Soviet power is less in 2005 vs 1985.  Perhaps in 1970, Soviet power was relatively greater than the US (because of Vietnam, and Afghanistan hadn't happened yet).

China is king as of 2 years ago.  They may yet grow relatively.  But as a one party authoritarian state, that isn't a good thing for the world.  Hence the need for a trade war to curb their ambitions, without really hurting them.

[Hydra009]

Trump administration halts life-saving medical research

Pro-life?  ¯\_(:-/)_/¯

[Baruch]

Trump administration halts life-saving medical research

Pro-life?  ¯\_(:-/)_/¯

Crony capitalism.  It is all about the money.  Trump isn't ideological ... not a college student ;-)

[Unbeliever]

Liberal journalist, Jon Hotchkiss, went undercover to numerous Trump Rallies and now he reveals 10 things he documented that Donald Trump wants to keep secret from liberal voters.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yuU72FB-0fE

[Baruch]

If they are known, they aren't secret.  Will Democrats use their secret decoder ring from the Kracker-Jacks box?

[Unbeliever]

One decoder ring to rule them all! :-P

[Hydra009]

Trump blasts moon mission after supporting it.

We've always been at war with Eurasia.

[Baruch]

Trump blasts moon mission after supporting it.

We've always been at war with Eurasia.

It is like he has a drinking problem.

[Hydra009]

It is like he has a drinking problem.

Or a thinking problem.

And thanks to his position, his problems are now our problems.

[Hydra009]

Trump admin refuses to fly rainbow flag

Remember that one time when Trump briefly held a rainbow flag and people assumed he was lgbt-friendly despite picking Mike "the shocker" Pence as his running mate and his party's undying opposition to gay rights?

Good times.

Btw, Obama flew the flag with no problem.  Always slouching in his shadow, that guy.  I guess Trump will have to be content with that, because that's all he'll ever be.