Genetically modified .... humans

Started by Coveny, September 15, 2017, 06:55:32 PM

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Coveny

Humans have already shown that it’s going to be a slippery slope when designer babies pick up full steam. PGD is widely used around the world currently to allow parents to select some of the traits of their children, such as gender and eye color.

http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/a19313/genetic-engineering-allow-parents-select-gender-eye-color-children/

First genetically modified human embryo happened this year.

http://www.iflscience.com/health-and-medicine/world-s-first-genetically-modified-human-embryo-raises-ethical-concerns/

Is genetic modification of humans to remove genetic illnesses like some cancers, color blindness, Sickle-Cell, Hemophilia, etc. a matter of if or a matter of when? A U.S. Panel has already endorsed it for these serious diseases.

https://www.technologyreview.com/s/603633/us-panel-endorses-designer-babies-to-avoid-serious-disease/

Ethically and morally I see it as a positive thing. The ability to remove genetic diseases from the world is huge in and of itself, and I think it more than overcomes the possible abuse by parents to make perfect little designer babies. But we live in a capitalist world so is it just going to become yet another way that the 1% is “better” than the rest of us? Or on the other end what about genetic mistakes happening in third world countries doing bargain basement genetic modifications?

So do you think the benefits of genetically modified humans outweigh the negatives?
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Shiranu

I have to be honest, I don't have much thought on it one way or another. Morally I am for it, but I have read enough cyber punk to know what it leads to :P.
"A little science distances you from God, but a lot of science brings you nearer to Him." - Louis Pasteur

Mermaid

Yes, I think the benefits are worth it. There are a lot of ethical issues in medicine, and while this is a big one, it's just another ethical issue.
A cynical habit of thought and speech, a readiness to criticise work which the critic himself never tries to perform, an intellectual aloofness which will not accept contact with life’s realities â€" all these are marks, not as the possessor would fain to think, of superiority but of weakness. -TR

Hydra009

Getting rid of heritable diseases (in perpetuity) is a hugely beneficial thing.  That's an ethical imperative.

But designer babies, that's a little murkier.  Especially when it exacerbates Haves and Have-Nots.

If it were implemented in an ethical way (which is doubtful atm), it might be okay.  For example, Martian colonists collectively deciding on some trait that would be beneficial in their low-gravity environment, that might be okay.  But only the super rich making designer babies, that way leads to a very bad future.

Baruch

#4
In the future, you techno-enthusiasts will all be sterile female worker bees in Hillary's hive ;-)  You won't be Dr Frankenstein, drawing lightning from Heaven.

Bioengineering in an immoral world?  Not a good idea.  Best to nuke humanity first, before we show how we can build The Island of Dr Moreau.

Sorry, bioethics concerns are my highest concern ... and the failure of most people to take it seriously is why I have no hope for humanity.  We already have sheep in London who are 10% human genome.  How much farther do you maniacs want to take it?  Weed out all Republicans?  How about weed out all Black people or all Democrats?  You know where this is going.  There is no utopia, just dystopia.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Blackleaf

I've been expecting this for years now. I think that when genetic engineering is introduced for human babies, it will be resisted at first. Sometime down the line, however, I think public opinion will slowly shift to accept it, embrace it, and eventually mandate it. At some point, it is going to be considered child abuse not to genetically engineer children to be clear of genetic diseases, just as neglecting to give children vaccines is starting to be seen as child abuse. It might even be common practice to maximize intelligence, artistic ability, etc, and the entire human race will have the genetic component to literally be capable of mastering any skill they desire.
"Oh, wearisome condition of humanity,
Born under one law, to another bound;
Vainly begot, and yet forbidden vanity,
Created sick, commanded to be sound."
--Fulke Greville--

SGOS

Some people will no doubt design their sons to be mentally challenged socially inept banjo players.

Hydra009

#7
Quote from: Blackleaf on September 16, 2017, 12:35:18 PM
I've been expecting this for years now. I think that when genetic engineering is introduced for human babies, it will be resisted at first. Sometime down the line, however, I think public opinion will slowly shift to accept it, embrace it, and eventually mandate it. At some point, it is going to be considered child abuse not to genetically engineer children to be clear of genetic diseases, just as neglecting to give children vaccines is starting to be seen as child abuse. It might even be common practice to maximize intelligence, artistic ability, etc, and the entire human race will have the genetic component to literally be capable of mastering any skill they desire.
Raising the bar of human capabilities across the board could be a huge boon to humanity.  Imagine what humanity could accomplish with prodigies galore working with increasingly sophisticated technology.  But implemented in an incorrect way could lead to a genetic elite and genetic discrimination.

As always, science/technology unlocks the future but we have to choose what kind of future we want.

Coveny

Making us more resilient could pose other problems to the symbiosis we call the human digestive system. If they wanted us to be able to get the nutrients we need without bacteria and other lifeforms living in us, they would really have to rework the human body to overcome the deficiencies. Also there are issues with creating a totally different type of class warfare where you have the designer people of means versus then randoms who can't afford it.
http://fordebating.com is now in beta.

We have 1v1 and 2v2 debates 2-6 round debates others vote on and will have up to 16-man tourneys working soon.

Blackleaf

Quote from: Coveny on September 16, 2017, 11:29:07 PM
Making us more resilient could pose other problems to the symbiosis we call the human digestive system. If they wanted us to be able to get the nutrients we need without bacteria and other lifeforms living in us, they would really have to rework the human body to overcome the deficiencies. Also there are issues with creating a totally different type of class warfare where you have the designer people of means versus then randoms who can't afford it.

Maybe people will be sterilized from birth, so that no accidental babies could be made. Then if they want a child, they'll have to go to a doctor to have one made, using the parent(s) own genes as a base to start with. They might even have parenting permits, requiring people to prove their worth as potential parents, which will be revoked if the parent is found guilty of child abuse.
"Oh, wearisome condition of humanity,
Born under one law, to another bound;
Vainly begot, and yet forbidden vanity,
Created sick, commanded to be sound."
--Fulke Greville--

Baruch

Quote from: Blackleaf on September 16, 2017, 12:35:18 PM
I've been expecting this for years now. I think that when genetic engineering is introduced for human babies, it will be resisted at first. Sometime down the line, however, I think public opinion will slowly shift to accept it, embrace it, and eventually mandate it. At some point, it is going to be considered child abuse not to genetically engineer children to be clear of genetic diseases, just as neglecting to give children vaccines is starting to be seen as child abuse. It might even be common practice to maximize intelligence, artistic ability, etc, and the entire human race will have the genetic component to literally be capable of mastering any skill they desire.

Cannibalism will be resisted at first, but given the ability of the human to accommodate to dystopias .... it will become normal.  And sorry, you won't be maximizing anything ... the wealthy will make themselves or their children into supermen.  Khan!
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Baruch

#11
Quote from: SGOS on September 16, 2017, 12:52:34 PM
Some people will no doubt design their sons to be mentally challenged socially inept banjo players.

And that isn't child abuse?  Parents do a bad enough job already.  Brainiacs are autistics male defectives ... the people who post here would be weeded out by the managerial class.
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Baruch

Quote from: Coveny on September 16, 2017, 11:29:07 PM
Making us more resilient could pose other problems to the symbiosis we call the human digestive system. If they wanted us to be able to get the nutrients we need without bacteria and other lifeforms living in us, they would really have to rework the human body to overcome the deficiencies. Also there are issues with creating a totally different type of class warfare where you have the designer people of means versus then randoms who can't afford it.

Why do you hate your gut bacteria?  Are you Howard Hughes?
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

Baruch

Quote from: Blackleaf on September 16, 2017, 11:40:21 PM
Maybe people will be sterilized from birth, so that no accidental babies could be made. Then if they want a child, they'll have to go to a doctor to have one made, using the parent(s) own genes as a base to start with. They might even have parenting permits, requiring people to prove their worth as potential parents, which will be revoked if the parent is found guilty of child abuse.

Too bad they didn't do it to your parents?  Is that you Dr Mengele?  I am so glad we will be finally able to clone Hitler's nose (movie Sleeper and Boys From Brazil) so we can really get that 1000 year Reich going ;-(
Ha’át’íísh baa naniná?
Azee’ Å,a’ish nanídį́į́h?
Táadoo ánít’iní.
What are you doing?
Are you taking any medications?
Don't do that.

trdsf

Quote from: Coveny on September 15, 2017, 06:55:32 PM
So do you think the benefits of genetically modified humans outweigh the negatives?
I think it's something we need to move very slowly and carefully at.  We can't always predict whether or not there will be any knock-on effect from changing a gene or two -- we already know that it's possible for one stretch of code to be transcribed in multiple ways.  I'd be concerned about the possibility of messing up an alternate transcription.

A long, slow process of evolution brought our species to this point, and dinking with a code that's evolved to fit its environment should not be done lightly.
"My faith in the Constitution is whole, it is complete, it is total, and I am not going to sit here and be an idle spectator to the diminution, the subversion, the destruction of the Constitution." -- Barbara Jordan