Author Topic: God is Imaginary  (Read 778 times)

Offline Baruch

Re: God is Imaginary
« Reply #15 on: September 12, 2017, 10:24:33 PM »
Baruch, I have never doubted you had/have first hand experience with your g-d.  And I like the way you explained faith.  As you said, if you can see it, touch it or feel it---belief is not needed, for you it has happened in a tangible way.  You don't believe it, you know it.  And from that gnosis (knowing) your experience can be acted upon.  All of that is valid--for you.  For anyone else to accept your experience requires belief.  I need to believe you really experienced that; had that happen to you.  For you have no way of providing any empirical evidence for me or anyone else.   And so I don't accept what you say about your g-d, not because I think you are making things up, but that your brain did that for (or to) you for some reason.  And I think that in a day far, far from now, science will be able to explain it.  Belief and magic belong in the same universe--the universe of the unnatural, or supernatural--or the land of fiction.  It is real only to one person.

You have the same arm as I have.  You just don't believe it ;-(
שלום

Re: God is Imaginary
« Reply #16 on: September 12, 2017, 10:41:26 PM »
You have the same arm as I have.  You just don't believe it ;-(
Correct.  I don't believe it.  Oh, the arms are the same--I can show you mine and you can show me yours.  There is nothing to believe about that--except in your mind.  And I don't mind--you can believe what you want about your arm.  But if you can't show me, then that is all it is,---a belief.
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent,
Is he able but not willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able or willing?
Then why call him god?

Offline Baruch

Re: God is Imaginary
« Reply #17 on: September 13, 2017, 06:43:09 AM »
Correct.  I don't believe it.  Oh, the arms are the same--I can show you mine and you can show me yours.  There is nothing to believe about that--except in your mind.  And I don't mind--you can believe what you want about your arm.  But if you can't show me, then that is all it is,---a belief.

No man is an island, except Mike ;-(
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Re: God is Imaginary
« Reply #18 on: September 13, 2017, 09:03:58 AM »
No man is an island, except Mike ;-(
As Simon and Garfunkle say:

"I Am A Rock"

A winter's day
In a deep and dark December
I am alone
Gazing from my window
To the streets below
On a freshly fallen, silent shroud of snow
I am a rock
I am an island

I've built walls
A fortress, steep and mighty
That none may penetrate
I have no need of friendship
Friendship causes pain.
It's laughter and it's loving I disdain.
I am a rock
I am an island

Don't talk of love
Well, I've heard the words before
It's sleeping in my memory
And I won't disturb the slumber
Of feelings that have died
If I never loved, I never would have cried
I am a rock
I am an island

I have my books
And my poetry to protect me
I am shielded in my armor
Hiding in my room
Safe within my womb
I touch no one and no one touches me
I am a rock
I am an island

And a rock feels no pain
And an island never cries

Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent,
Is he able but not willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able or willing?
Then why call him god?

Offline Baruch

Re: God is Imaginary
« Reply #19 on: September 13, 2017, 03:00:20 PM »
You are a node in the great network of Mother Nature.  You didn't come from nowhere, you are connected to everything and everyone ... you will never be separate.  Not even an isolated hydrogen atom in outer space is separate ... its degree of separation ends at the Big Bang when it was created.
שלום

Re: God is Imaginary
« Reply #20 on: September 13, 2017, 03:37:54 PM »
You are a node in the great network of Mother Nature.  You didn't come from nowhere, you are connected to everything and everyone ... you will never be separate.  Not even an isolated hydrogen atom in outer space is separate ... its degree of separation ends at the Big Bang when it was created.
Yeah, I agree with that--even from my island--so what?  The universe is constructed of a finite list of materials and substances--we are all connected in that way.  There is no need for a god nor creator for that to be so. 
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent,
Is he able but not willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able or willing?
Then why call him god?

Offline Baruch

Re: God is Imaginary
« Reply #21 on: September 13, 2017, 06:12:19 PM »
Yeah, I agree with that--even from my island--so what?  The universe is constructed of a finite list of materials and substances--we are all connected in that way.  There is no need for a god nor creator for that to be so.

G-d lies in that connectedness.  Particularly in the connectedness between people, that is more recent than the Big Bang.
שלום

Re: God is Imaginary
« Reply #22 on: September 13, 2017, 07:33:01 PM »
G-d lies in that connectedness.  Particularly in the connectedness between people, that is more recent than the Big Bang.
What lies in that 'connectedness' is evolution--no need for g-d or god or gods.  Humans represent the best of the best; the worst of the worst; and all that is in-between.  God is not needed.  (Nor wanted) As our brains and our bodies evolve so do our societies.  It's just that that process takes sooooooo much time.  Theists want to put an end to waiting for that process to end (which is never) and provide them with answers now.  Impatient buggers--fuck us all over.
Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able?
Then he is not omnipotent,
Is he able but not willing?
Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able or willing?
Then why call him god?

Offline Baruch

Re: God is Imaginary
« Reply #23 on: September 13, 2017, 10:38:38 PM »
What lies in that 'connectedness' is evolution--no need for g-d or god or gods.  Humans represent the best of the best; the worst of the worst; and all that is in-between.  God is not needed.  (Nor wanted) As our brains and our bodies evolve so do our societies.  It's just that that process takes sooooooo much time.  Theists want to put an end to waiting for that process to end (which is never) and provide them with answers now.  Impatient buggers--fuck us all over.

So our connection is some very tenuous quantum field?  What QFT is ... "Six degrees of separation"?
שלום

Offline Cavebear

Re: God is Imaginary
« Reply #24 on: September 14, 2017, 01:30:43 AM »
Darrow is a hero of mine...
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!  b 1950

Offline Baruch

Re: God is Imaginary
« Reply #25 on: September 14, 2017, 01:12:26 PM »
Darrow is a hero of mine...

And WJB is one of mine, but not for the Scoped trial.  For the Cross of Gold speech.  Have you read it?
שלום

Offline Cavebear

Re: God is Imaginary
« Reply #26 on: September 14, 2017, 02:14:08 PM »
And WJB is one of mine, but not for the Scoped trial.  For the Cross of Gold speech.  Have you read it?

Read it?   I dissected it for a Poli-science class.  It was bad economics, bad politics, and poorly-constructed.  William Jennings Bryan had a brain a mile wide and as shallow as a plate...  He was the Trump of his time.
« Last Edit: September 14, 2017, 04:05:47 PM by Cavebear »
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!  b 1950

Re: God is Imaginary
« Reply #27 on: September 14, 2017, 03:10:29 PM »
G-d lies in that connectedness.  Particularly in the connectedness between people, that is more recent than the Big Bang.
Now if we just had enough Brazilian power crystals to cover the Earth we'd be much more loving.
God Not Found
“Money supplants skill; it's possession allows us to become happily stupid.”
Bill McKibben, The Age of Missing Information

Offline Cavebear

Re: God is Imaginary
« Reply #28 on: September 14, 2017, 04:07:52 PM »
Now if we just had enough Brazilian power crystals to cover the Earth we'd be much more loving.

A lot of Tinkerbelle dust would be good...
Atheist born, atheist bred.  And when I die, atheist dead!  b 1950

Offline Baruch

Re: God is Imaginary
« Reply #29 on: September 14, 2017, 07:50:27 PM »
Read it?   I dissected it for a Poli-science class.  It was bad economics, bad politics, and poorly-constructed.  William Jennings Bryan had a brain a mile wide and as shallow as a plate...  He was the Trump of his time.

Perhaps.  But if you hate Populism, you must love Elitism.  And you will burn in Hell, sorry.
שלום